Its funny cause well, I remember how it was just people complaining about how "overpowered" the striker was. I mean it was hilarious because: -Storm fist was useless and still is for the most part in crucible -Shoulder charge was a risk reward, easily countered by a prevealent shotgun presence, which still exists, because shotguns are just reliable defensive tools in the crucible yet people still complained on it -The lightning grenade was only good in tight spots and usually got an unaware person rather than those who knew they could destroy it like a tripmine grenade -Fist of havoc was not something smart strikers wanted to waste, they wanted a good moment which usually, never occured, unless you had 3 people clustered in a rare occasion, most settled for 2. -The strikers talent synergy alone, was horrendous, abysmal, there were such situational talents, no one ever used juggernaut, transfusion didnt heal you for much, and just dear lord, unstoppable was the worst of the bunch, I mean do you realize how terrible this modifer was? Lets you get a fist of havoc off? You have better protection from the agility and momentum rather then this talent. I mean for gods sake, if you died in mid-attempt to set it off, you didn't exactly lose it. God, unstoppable was just too situaional and too specialized, it hardly proved a difference. Now look at the sunbreaker. I mean, in some cases its something I can admit, is devistating, I mean 5 shots at base which you can go to either, granting up to 7 with high noon, 3 alternate shots with suncharge, or just kept at 5 with scorched earth with an AOE effect, god the deal when looking at this class is. I mean, its a devistating super, but ironically, its also the only one we have and at this point, would even want to use. Why settle for one major AOE impact when we can get 5-7 smaller ones? If people are scared when they hear that clang its a good reason to just run and hide. Last year, it was the blade dancer everyone fussed about, but that was just due to the fact, not much else with a lot of synergy existed and they could get away with a lot of crap. Now its the sunbreaker, but it still has its limits. I mean the hammer is not instant, it has a slow travel time, its much better at mid-close. A GG shot, nova bomb, night shot, suppressor grenade, focused fire, etc, they are still vulnerable Dont be suprised if their super takes the longest out of all other subclasses to charge, it takes the longest out of the titans for sure. Like a gunslinger, they are also very vulnerable to flanking, even the seeker hammers are able to be tricked with changing their flight path. The horror people experience is generally, any hammer power plus catuerize, because that power is just so good. Really my question is just to bungie, how the heck could you make a class like this, feel so good, and yet look at the striker, its like no effort went into that at all! I mean last year, this class, the striker felt generic, nothing special, I saw the abilities of the bladedancer and aside from cloaking, I just wondered to bungie, why does the striker not get anything of actual effect? Why this simplisity? Why ablities which could only be done when in motion? Otherwise talent modifers that just seemed to underwhelming? You wonder why strikers are on the decline in pvp? Because sunbreakers outclass them, in practically everyway save for grenades, thats it. All 3 titan subclasses still have a reason for PVE, but for PVP, its practically going to just be sunbreakers and defenders. Defenders still have a presence and meaning, a class focused on supporting a team with buffs and suppressing opponents, hell a defender and nightstalker can make a brutal combination at this point. But sunbreakers, with the exception of lift and its modifers and grenades being the only thing that strikers have over them, just good god, l cannot even believe some of the stuff from the sunbreaker: -Melee actually has a freaking difference, forget sunstrike being the same as scorch at base, melting point is useful in pve and for some parts of pvp. Thermal vent just outclasses discharge, because both cause an AOE effect on hit, but with thermal vent, they not only explode, you make a AOE effect field that can actually kill the rest around you! And then comes stoke the forge, just dear god, this is overload on steroids. Its not only the fact you get free melee on kills, it reduces the cooldown to 10 seconds, not as fast as fast twitch being down to 5, but its good enough. Hell, you can use this power to wipe up any minor grunts on most PVE encounters like shanks, dregs, combine with cauterize to just keep healing. Hell, I meleed the entire mob of thralls near the end of sunless cell once, and never lost my melee because of this. -The hammer, is a devistating super, better yet, the real reason is this, be it for PVE or PVP, would you settle for one large major strike or several smaller ones which you can reposition, target, and compenstate for in case you miss? PS you also get one grenade if its ready with hammer of sol. Yeah I think most of us will take the hammer over fist cause its more practical. -The modifers, are all useful in other ways and make a freaking difference. Flameseeker isnt anything majorly different, but the added recovery and speed always are in effect at least. Explosive pyre is situational, but can still make some use in PVE. Fleetfire, its odd, but hey, if you at least kill with a solar ability, you can move and reload faster. The second one, by god, all of them are so useful its put the striker to shame. Shimmering flames, nothing wrong with the one who wants to save their super, get back melee and grenades twice as fast when supercharged. catuerize, by god, its just red deaths power, but for anything we kill with our abilities, you wonder why most sunbreakers take this in PVP? Having a regenerating burning terror in the crucible will make anyone shit their pants, hell this makes tranfusion look like an embarresment. Then flamekeeper, yeah it makes the super last longer and works with thermal vent and scorched earth. The real issue with the sunbreaker, its practically outclassed the striker in everyway. The real question should be, aside from being a defender at times, why should I ever play a striker when these other abilties, are similar, yet also superior in most aspects? Just remember, unstoppable, blech, I will always hate that passive, its so useless and so situational, it was never worth it.

One of the first rumble games I played with it, I instantly killed a blade dancer and then turned around a killed a Titan straight out of fists of havoc. Not a single super can do that... It's op

Wait... Titans have always been the worst class? I guess that's why they were often excluded from VoG runs, constantly belittled in the forums, and the subject of so many "sucks in PvE" posts... Oh yeah, that was Hunters, the underdog glass cannon class that everyone hates because they can get multikill a with their super in crucible while simultaneously forgetting they are squishy enough to die from splash damage a mile away. Face it, Titans just like to bitch and brag; need a defender and it's Titan Master Race, think Sunbreakers are powerful and it's "why's everyone always picking on me?" I personally think Sunbreakers are fine, sure they wreck in Crucible with HoS, supers are supposed to; but they DPS the add to a post Gjally PvE is a necessity. I'm just tired of everyone moaning about this class; build a bridge and get over it.

Hunters- 'I have shiny bow with an arrow aimed DIRECTLY at your chest!' [b]Entire enemy team dies[/b] Warlocks- [i]Match starts[/i] 'Okay, so team, let's-' [b]Super Ready[/b] 'Not even a minute in?!' Titans- 'I mean like, I can shut down supers with my Fists, and [i]partially[/i] stop supers with Bubble, and maybe wipe a team with Hammer, but like, halfway through the match.' Like, EVERY class [b]OTHER THAN TITAN CLASSES[/b] can one shot one way or another, with the exception of Sunsinger... Grenades... [i][u]Everywhere[/u][/i]... It's disappointing to see that Nightstalkers, with the most flexible class set, can oneshot a whole fire team or more with 1 bolt, Stormcallers can absolutely wipe away the competition in literally a minute after start, while Titans... 1) Have been prejudiced since Beta 2) Have literally the least amount of players choosing them 3) Have both the slowest speed, melee, Supercharge, et 4) Still are deemed 'Useless' because they're ignorant thickskulled players who like to be dicks And this is from a Sunbreaker myself.

Maybe just make the super take longer to charge up?

What hilarious is it going to get nerfed... I'm a hunter and am fine with my new titan does but wha I have a problem with is that people cry, bitch, an moan about everything that is apparently "OP", and then it gets needed... I honestly want vanilla destiny back...

Its good but it needs to throw more hammers

Every Titan starts a post to "defend" sunbreaker with "Titans were always the jokes and stuff in pvp blah blah blah." When not only do you have shoulder charge but you also have Panic Slam. Warlocks (master race) they cannot simply panic nova bomb... That's not a thing. It takes to long to cast. And sun singer is generally not the best class to use in pvp due to it not being extremely effective (not to say some people can't rock a sunsinger.) but Titans were never that bad in crucible or even bad at all its be player that sucks not the class. Now that you have tracking exploding golden gun blade dancer mode you feel better? That's ludicrous.