1. You did not actually make a case for them being part of infusion. 2. You undermined any point you may have made by insulting the people you apparently don't agree with. 3. You are actually the one who is completely wrong in tis circumstance because you either don't understand, or are so wrapped up in nonsense it doesn't matter.

Got 16 cores yesterday, just saying. It's not as hard as people say.

the only guaranteed method of getting that many cores in a single day - is essentially by running the daily bounties from spider across [i]3[/i] characters (yes you will get 18). It is also a terrible grind as you need to stop and intermittently grind a dead planet for ghost fragments due to their weird cap. Furthermore some of those targets you do nothing more than just have to sit and wait for them to show up on a map. yay. much fun. Keep in mind, those cores you earned in one day - are actually the only guaranteed amount you can earn in a week. The rest of the week is pure RNG. Sometimes you'll have a good haul, other times you'll see little to none.

Didn't even touch spider bounties. I was farming the masterwork roll for tatara gaze and dismantled quite a few bad rolls, didn't realise just how many cores you can earn from the forge guns, it's crazy. It's also worth mentioning that I did some of the weekly milestones.

So the second half of my argument was that, other than the spider bounties is EVERY other core you can earn in a week is pure RNG, and therefore luck.

Huh? I don't really understand. Is that a question? Assuming it is my answer is no. There are a lot of things you can do to influence how many cores you earn, completing scrapper bounties the moment you get them is one thing, I feel like people greatly exaggerate how rare these bounties are, they are extremely common. Another thing is dismantling forge weapons, most people don't even use their modulus reports so this is a good use for them too.

No there was no question. Forge weapons don't have a higher chance of dropping with masterwork levels high enough to grant cores. I've gotten more cores by farming older vanilla planetary materials and turning in packages at Devrim. Also, scrapper bounties are a bit more frequent but still rng based. I completed my milestones yesterday and scrapped about half the items (crap rolls or low light) - i got a total of 2 scrapper bounties and 1 core from a straight dismantle. My main point here - is there are very few guaranteed methods for cores, but the remaining are all RNG based. It is highly dependent on being lucky with RNG. Now just as i say i'm experience low rates of drops is anecdotal evidence, you saying you're getting high rates of drops is anecdotal. This is one of the bigger problems D2 has had since launch. So much is throttled behind RNG. This game has so many aspects where you're essentially hoping on a lotto win. A big example for me, was my hunter in y1, was forever 399 - for 2 months (until solstice of hero events) because for 2 months no powerful, milestone, or prime engram would give me a max class item. In game currencies or consumables in any game - should have a guaranteed steady method of income. It doesn't have to necessarily be easy - but it shouldn't be random. Imagine going to work and at the end of the week they rolled a dice to see what you get paid.

I understand that. But that is not the argument I, and many others are making. Anyone can grind out any material, the question is why should they in regards to infusion. Bungie's reasoning is that it makes the infusion process mean something. It does not. Why? Because people either have the time to trivialize the system, or they don't have the time to not have it be frustrating. Cores cover up a lack of content, but they don't add anything meaningful to the experience.

I guess it all depends on how you personally feel about games. I prefer things to be harder, I was furious when bungie decreased the light of the forges because of complaints. I prefer the grind, D1 was a better game and I think D2 strayed too far from what the game is supposed to be, it handed loot to everyone with little effort and it feels like the community has become complacent, outside of thousand voices and the crucible pinnacle weapons there really isn't much point in trying to achieve anything in this game. Or at least that's how I personally feel. Before the release of forsaken cores were only used for masterworking, this mechanic had barely any use since you could only get +5 stats out of a gun instead of the current +10. Cores were common and meaningless. At the start of forsaken I had over 200 cores, I used them like a fool and ended up wasting every single one, this was the first time I realised that I had to think about something in D2, it was the first time I got D1 vibes from the game. Maybe this doesn't apply to you, maybe it proves nothing but it's the only way I can explain things. It is universally agreed that D1 is the better game and I want bungie to make D2 as much like the first game as possible.

I think there is a difference between "hard" and "tedious". Pre Forsaken, masterworking had no real point other than orb generation. And the changes to that system, with the new mods in Forsaken, would have been a welcome change, but Bungie decided to throw a wrench in the works. By adding cores to infusion, they essentially created an artificial grind for a material. Where as before it was a matter of choosing what to upgrade fully, it then became a barrier to upgrading just about anything at all. I had over 100 cores when forsaken dropped. I currently sit at about 20, regardless of what I do or do not grind. So cores do not stop me from infusing a small subset of my gear for use while leveling. But they do prohibit me from trying new things, UNLESS, I stop doing content and waste my already limited play time running around doing busy work. If they were removed from infusion, and put back to masterworking, I would be a lot more likely to use them, and to grind them for gear that I wanted to be fully upgraded. Infusion is not a measure of power, because it is not the primary means by which we level. The milestone system, and RNG have far more impact in that regard. So cores simply become a chore and a barrier to player choice. Which is the primary argument against them. Either people have time and have a surplus(cores are then irrelevant), or they don't have the time and have a shortage(cores are then ignored in favor of RNG). Neither of which makes the infusion process impactful for anyone, which is the main argument being made.

Removing cores from infusion would be a permanent solution to a temporary problem and it would harm the game in the long term by creating yet another meaningless currency. The further into a season we get the less people complain about cores, because it stops becoming an issue the more you progress until eventually you're at the top and cores aren't a problem at all anymore. If cores weren't the scapegoat for the communities slow progression then something else would be and people won't stop complaining until things return to the way it used to be, when you were able to reach max light within the first week. I don't care about how much time it takes to earn something, I'm just happy to have a goal and I don't understand how 'respecting players time' factors into it at all. This seems like such a recent concept and it's really tiresome to hear it used so often, imagine if people used that excuse back in the halo 3 days, you'd be laughed at, I don't mean that in an insulting way but it is true.

Not if they were used for masterworking, which does actually have value now. Bungie created the idea of Destiny being a hobby. Then they proceeded to remove all of the elements that made it fun to play that way. Here is how the system should work. Infusion should cost shards, mats and glimmer(as it used to). What mats, should be dependent on where the item originates. Masterwork Cores should be as they are, scarce. but used as they were initially designed, to upgrade your top of the top gear. That way, choosing to get cores does actually mean something, and it is a task that falls in line as PART of progression. Right now it is parallel to progression because you can hit max level without using cores. And even if you do, it does not give you any real advantage. But masterworks? After you hit max level, OR prior to max level, to give your gear a boost? Now THAT is part of the progression cycle. I am not trying to make them less useful, quite the contrary, I want them, and their usage to ACTUALLY mean something.

Looks like we're at an impasse then. My firm stance against this issue mainly comes from the fact that enough childish moaning will get you what you want eventually, I don't mean you in particular, you seem to deal with this matter in an adult way but there are many who don't. I'm happy with the way cores are and I don't want the whining crybabies to be able to dictate what happens in a game they barely play. I see some of the points you're making but it's not enough to make me change my mind.