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8/25/2020 11:20:49 AM
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1. Every loot game sunsets gear in some fashion. They just HIDE how they do it better, and don't call attention to it like Bungie has been forced too.
[quote]Nobody is going to regrind and reupgrade a full new set of everything each year if it's going to expire.[/quote]
2. Everyone who plays a loot game over a long period of time does EXACTLY that. Because that is what these games are designed to do. Take power away from you in one area of the game, while you grind to get it back somewhere else.
[quote]Half the player base will simply leave destiny because their time and effort has been wasted[/quote]
3. Shooter gamers may leave. But loot-gamers and MMO players know that this is how these games work. Not only do they not feel that their effort has been wasted, they've been waiting for this day to arrive so the game can get healthy.
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MMO player here. I left because Bungie wasted my time. There's a big difference between a favorite weapon with a favorite design using a favorite firing and/or reload animation and a piece of gear in an MMO that only matters for its stat bonuses because you have your glamours ready to cover it up. Try again.
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Then its good that you left. Because what you wanted was not consistent with the kind of game that Destiny is. What you wanted would have destroyed the game...is destroying the game. That shooter sensibility of "I get my favorite weapon and keep it forever" is not compatible with the need for continual power progression and loot pursuit that is the foundation of every loot game. What you want is fine. Loot games----no loot games----can offer that and stay healthy.
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I'm not sure you even know what kind of game Destiny is. In fact, I'm not sure Bungie knows. That would explain some things. I know, however, that it's built on the bones of Halo: Reach and shares more DNA with shooters than it does with MMOs. That was kinda the point I was making. Games like Borderlands work because you find guns similar to your favorites that are better. Eventually, you hit the ceiling and move on. Bungie doesn't want to face facts that their game has already hit its ceiling, so they are trying to knock players' feet out from under them to create the illusion of a higher ceiling. If you think you are actually getting more powerful in this game as time goes on, you're frankly deluded. Forsaken was the last time we truly got more powerful. Armor 2.0 created opportunity for horizontal progression. Everything since has been an illusion.
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Destiny is a MMO/Action-RPG/FPS [i]hybrid. [/i] IOW, a brand new kind of game created by blending aspects of different KINDS of games. I've said that going all the way back to the Destiny 1 beta. Its just taken Bungie five years to figure this out, and agree to it amongst themselves.
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A brand new kind of game that is just Borderlands in the Halo: Reach engine with somehow worse writing. There's nothing MMO about Destiny, nor is there anything action RPG. It's an online shooter iced with a diet stat system to make it look like something more than it is.
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1. No other loot game replaces with weaker things That basically the only argument necessary 🤷♂️
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They do when the game needs to be retuned to deal with power creep. I lived through The Division 1 in 2016 having to do that.
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What you call power creep is punching a hole through the ceiling Bungie doesn't want you to reach. Power creep would give you actual progression instead of the illusion of it. The point of a game built upon progression is that you go back to old content and casually solo a raid boss you previously needed an entire team to struggle through. In Destiny's case, Bungie implements the 50 Power variance to ensure that no matter how "powerful" you become, old content can still put up something of a fight. So progression barely matters in this game you tote as needing sunsetting for healthy progression. It only matters in a few endgame activities such as the latest raid and Trials of Osiris, and those activities exclude the majority of the community anyways. But please, enjoy the Kool-Aid. If there's one thing Bungie's good at, it's convincing people of their bullshit.
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[quote]Power creep would give you actual progression instead of the illusion of it.[/quote] Like breaking raid mechanics (Riven)? Routinely one-phasing raid bosses? Or how about continuously having your super (Skull of Dire Ahamkara, Phoenix Protocol, Orpheus Rig, etc....) As for the rest, Bungie has never wanted a game where people stomped around in God mode. Many RPGs do the same. Which makes their case against power creep even more compelling.
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The only thing Bungie wants is your wallet. Your kidding yourself if you project any other desires upon them.
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Yes, they want that. But if that were the only thing they wanted, they’d still be owned by Microsoft and would be cranking out Halo sequels like 343 is doing.
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They might make half decent games if they'd stuck to Halo.
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Division allows you to share loot so it’s easier to deal with the changes.
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I lost so many braincells reading this reply...
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Then I wish you luck with your problem of finding them.
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This isn’t a loot game... every gun in an archetype is roughly the same.
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Which you see in loot games as well. The range of weapon archetypes are narrower in this game because of the drag of pvp. Which most loot games don’t bother with.
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This is a first person shooter game, obviously it's not smart to make shooters want to leave. And second, that's what an MMO does I agree. But Destiny has always allowed for infusion and weapon balancing so you can maintain your gear that you have earned and that you like while giving you cool new things to strive for. Taking them away suddenly may not be new to MMOs but it is new to Destiny 2. They sunset the original exotics in destiny 1 also and that was what pushed people away from the game then.
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This game is not Call of Duty. Because it's not CoD or Titanfall, it cannot accomodate that notion of "once I unlock a weapon I get to keep it for the life of the game." Destiny is also a loot game, and accomodating that mindset POISONS that aspect of what Destiny is. YOu may want that from the PVP perspective. But it would absolutely destroy the PVE side of the game. Which is about always chasing what is new. Not getting one perfect item and then keeping it forever.
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Editado por the Whisper: 8/26/2020 11:38:55 AMReally because it's done that for years. Also, we don't need that for PvP because crucible and competitive crucible don't go by power level. This is a shooter game with loot collection not world of warcraft
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No it hasn’t. It’s been nothing but smoke-and-mirrors the whole time: 1. D1Y2—The Taken King—-all Y1 raid weapons were sunset and the entire weapon system rebooted. 2. D2Y1: The entire weapon’s system was rebooted by blowing up our vaults and instituting dual-primary and fixed rolled weapons to nerf our damage output. 3. D2Y2: [i]Forsaken[/i]. Soft reboot of the weapon system by returning special weapons, random rolls, and rebooting the mod system. Return of random rolls, power exotic heavies, and adding Pinnacle weapons Lead to runaway power creep. Bungie spent that entire spring nerfing half the armory to claw back power from us. So that Armor 2.0 could be made relevant without breaking the game. 4. D2Y3: [i]Shadowkeep[/i]. Bungie so far this year has refused to give us any real power to chase, because they’ve run out of options to take power away from us without taking the gear away. Pinnacles? Gone. Exotic heavie? Nerfed. Super-regen armor? Nerfed. Reload perks nerfed. Damage perks nerfed. Bungie has always just let us keep the “light show” while they used evermore desperate ways to take power away from us so that the game could survive.
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Nerfs are fine, they just change how viable that thing is in game but still allows it to be used with reasonable effectiveness. Giving things a hard power cap ensures they are never useful again after a certain point.
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No the nerfs are not [i]okay[/i] in pve. Nerfs destroy the power-fantasy of the game and how the weapon feels in every part of the game. A sunset weapon can be used in 80-90% of the game while keeping its original power, while being non-viable on 10% of the game. A nerfed weapon can be used in 100% of the game, but has been robbed of 10-20% of its power in EVERY part of the game. Every weapon that has undergone a significant nerf is now sitting in my vault gathering dust. ...and that is far more disrespectful of player time and effort than sunsetting.
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Except for crucible it's only in the 10% that your loadout matters though. Being able to use my favourite guns in patrols isn't comforting at all, I don't need top tier loadout to complete a public event. I can do that with green guns. The same goes for any content were the guns are still viable.
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Editado por TheArtist: 8/27/2020 3:36:39 PMSpeak for yourself. It matters to a lot of PvE players which is why the nerfs that get made for pvp balance are met with such resentment. Loot games are not games where you try to demonstrate your [i]skill.[/i]. Anyone wanting that can go play Dark Souls. Loot games are [i]power-fantasy[/i] games. Where you get to experience things that are either not possible in real life or are too dangerous in real life. So it isn’t that I [i]need[/i] a powerful weapon. I can scrape by on weak shit too. The point is that I want to experience the FUN of being this powerful warrior-angel that is kicking the crap out of supernatural evil. And nerfs dump ice-water all over that fun.
