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Editado por Shining Silver:
11/6/2014 8:15:53 PM
40
Atheon Hard Mode Tips Here!
I'll be honest, for the last month, every time I did Atheon on hard mode, I either cheesed him or spent nearly an hour just on the fight because my team was not well-coordinated or died too much. Yesterday, I ran through hard mode with a team that consisted of my brother and our real-life friends and we managed to beat him legit twice in a row on both of my characters without anyone dying a single time on either run (just Atheon, we died plenty on the maze and the jump across).
Although most of us were lv30, I found that our strategy worked well compared to past runthroughs, so I thought I'd post some key tips and a full guide as well.
#1: SURVIVAL IS #1 PRIORITY! Unless you can self revive, your priorities should focus on not dying. Hard mode punishes mistakes a lot more and once you lose 2 people, a wipe is almost inevitable. I find too many people focus on DPS when it's much better to have a longer fight and playing safe rather than sorry.
#2: KILL SUPPLICANTS BEFORE FOCUSING ON ATHEON! Yesterday I didn't have my DPS weapons, so I focused on killing supplicants even while Time's Vengeance was active and I realized it helped a ton. I also realized that in past raids, 90% of my team's deaths were from the supplicants (I mean come on, unless you're standing still, Atheon won't hurt much). If the home team focuses on the supplicants while portal team is away, there should only be 3 left by the time they're out. If you have any hunters or underleveled teammates, they should focus their priorities on the supplicants (especially if they have golden gun) even while you have time's vengeance. THIS IS THE BIGGEST SURVIVAL TIP I CAN GIVE YOU! While I was staying in the back golden gunning the supplicants yesterday, the field stayed completely supplicant-free and no one died a single time the whole fight.
#3: DO NOT ALERT THE PORTAL ENEMIES! Have you ever been doing the Gorgon's Maze and someone told you "Don't double jump, they'll hear you!" Well in my experiences, this is true and applies for other enemies too. Using your jump ability, firing a weapon, or throwing a grenade will alert enemies to you. In case you didn't notice, whenever you are teleported in, the enemies are not aware of your presence yet, so RUN DOWN THE STAIRS and don't jump/attack until you are very close to them. As long as no one in the portal shoots or double jumps, you can literally walk up to them and dance and they will not notice you until you are in melee range or attack them first EVEN IF THEY ARE LOOKING RIGHT AT YOU! (If you've done Phogoth on the moon, you have probably already noticed this with the 2 hallowed knights outside his chamber. They spawn looking in your direction, but don't notice you until you're practically touching them.) This will give you time to get in position and take out all 3 hobgoblins at once, or take out both goblins first before dealing with the minotaur.
#4: WATCH YOUR MINI-MAP, HOME TEAM! I was surprised that most people I played with didn't know this. When the portal team is teleported in, their arrows on the minimap will point to the correct side that they're on. A team with communication should call out their location right away, but if they don't or if you don't know the callouts, just look at their arrows on your map. Pointing left = left portal, pointing right = right portal. It's funny that in the past when I played with randoms and I was home team, I would call out portal team's location first, even though I wasn't even in there.
#5: STICK TO ONE SIDE, STRENGTH IN NUMBERS! Once you know which portal to open, all 3 home team members should be on that side. Why? This was you can kill the most threatening supplicants first, while maintaining a safe distance from the opposite side's supplicants. Most people have ice breakers now, so I found the best method was to use your primary on the supplicants close to you, then switch to a sniper and one-shot the opposite side ones. You will never have home team die again to the supplicants if you stick together and focus on them like this.
#6: IF YOU USE THE MIDDLE, BAIL OUT LAST SECOND! People have different strategies for Time's Vengeance, but if you use the middle with the relic's shield (which I did), make sure you jump out to safety before the shield drops. Yesterday, the guy with the relic was always calling out when we had 2-3 seconds of vengeance left, so the team would always jump over to the left or right sync plate and hide before it ran out. Like I said, playing it safe is your top priority for hard mode, so even if you lose a few seconds of DPS, you save a lot more time by not dying.
#7: STAY ON THE GROUND, DON'T GOOF AROUND! I know you have nothing better to do while waiting for that first time stream, but don't be running around jumping and shoulder charging and stuff. If you're in the air at his teleport, you'll fall out of your detain bubble and die instantly. After that teleport, you should be 100% focused on the supplicants if you're on the home team.
I hope these tips helped you to destroy Atheon. If you don't want to bother reading the whole thing, my biggest piece of advice like I repeatedly mention is KILL SUPPLICANTS. I can't stress this enough, KILL THOSE SUPPLICANTS FIRST. FOCUS ON THE SUPPLICANTS. Have a gunslinger with his golden gun FOCUS ON THE SUPPLICANTS EVEN DURING TIME'S VENGEANCE. THE SUPPLICANTS ARE MORE OF A THREAT THAN ATHEON! If you don't believe me, think about deaths during time's vengeance in your past raids. There's only 3 things that can kill you during that stage: Supplicants, Atheon, and the Architects, and unless you weren't paying attention or have rather slow teammates, you rarely will be killed by the latter 2.
EDIT: Thanks to everyone who commented or contributed to this thread. If you are still looking for more tips, scroll down and read some of the posts from the other users as there's some great advice there. I won't add them to the main post since it's already a huge list and a lot of reading.
English
#Destiny
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10 RespuestasIf the oracle team is falling behind, the relic holder can drop the relic to help, and as long as the same person picks it back up it'll still have its cleanse charged.
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5 Respuestasone other thing to mention is to have people ready to grab the relic who are comfortable with it and those who are not to leave it. we normaly do it by having the four most comfortable just hold square when ported that way the 2 less comfortable never have to worry. also depends on which have the better oracle weapons equipped but you get the picture. the other must in my opinion is communication. its probably the biggest help in the raid. you die often when people don't call out oracles or praetorians. simple info can save your buddies and a wipe.
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Use weapons of light on the back of the middle part so people can walk through and then go to the front and relic will hold the cleanse and you can do extra damage
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I disagree with No. 5. Having one person on the other side helps with getting rid of the sups. A different angle from the portal makes it very easy to keep the field clear.
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Don't die
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6 RespuestasMy tip: Wait 'til Bungie fix the bugs. That's what I'm doing.
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Your strategy should be based on maximizing Time's Vengeance, not least because the sooner you kill Atheon the less glitches you will experience. This means you must jump in the middle platform and put up the shield with 30 seconds to go! To achieve this you must do the last cleanse before your teammates start shooting the last two oracles. After this cleanse, leave them in there to finish the job and get in the middle. If your timing is spot on, you will be putting up the shield as the last oracle is destroyed - your teammates then get cleansed on the middle platform. During the last cleanse your teammates must be together, cleanse them at the bottom of the steps, they should always be together as they are shooting, keep an eye on them and let them know if a gap appears between them. You should cleanse them three times, at the top of the stairs, in the middle somewhere and at the bottom of the portal steps. You can use your super to shoot down the 4th, 5th or 6th oracle. The less cleanse time you use the faster your super will charge so again it helps if your teammates are together. Let everyone know when you are exiting the portal so they can get ready to jump in the middle. If you meet a supplicant on the way out, use light attack to kill it. When you jump on the middle platform, make sure your shield isn't touching the pillar on the left. If it does, you can get splash damage and you could all die so stand on the right at the front. If you look down you will see a horseshoe shaped crack on the floor - stand in it. Weapons of light should go at the back, sometimes this can cause splash damage as well. I'm not sure if it's because it too overlaps the pillar or because it overlaps the shield thereby acting as another pillar. Avoid both by putting it at the back right of the middle platform. Don't move about when the shield is up and your teammates must not bump into you. Everyone should stand still. Jumping out of the shield and firing rockets is silly, if your going to fire rockets don't jump into the shield, or fire them as you jump out. If there are supplicants tell someone to break off and clear them. You don't need to look around, you can tell by the amount of red sections on the radar. Call out when 10 seconds of Time's Vengeance is left. At five seconds tell everyone to get out. Don't leave until they are leaving. Also don't leave if Atheon has just launched a barrage of rockets at you. Make sure you are on the ground as soon as possible, preferrably in a sync plate so that if you get detained you can activate the portal while shooting your way out of the bubble. If you have time you can super supplicants as you are jumping out, or super Atheon if there are no supplicants and you have a clear shot. Killing supplicants is high priority so they can't go inside detain bubbles and kill teammates. As for clearing the portal of enemies you should obviously use the relic smash. This is simple if the enemies are together and they don't see you coming but some spawns are more difficult. Mars is easiest but sometimes they are all facing you and see you coming. If they charge up to shoot while you are in the air, you can use light attack to dodge their shots. This helps a bit but it helps more if your teammates are aware of this spawn and can shoot the enemies forcing them into their defensive stance. Better still precision shots will one shot them. It's not necessary to shoot them under any other circumstances unless one of them is separated from the other two, in this case you can smash the two but there is a chance you will get sniped by the third so having a teammate shoot him to put into that defensive stance will give you more time to close the gap and kill him after your smash. If you do get sniped then you must ensure your next attack kills him - you won't survive two shots. A level 30 shouldn't need any help on Mars, but level 29's need as much help as possible - remember it's the team's responsiblity to kill the mobs, don't just leave it to the relic holder. If you find yourself with two mobs on either side and you need to close a big gap to both of them, you can use light attack to dodge their shots and close the gap quicker. Don't run straight toward them as they are about to fire, move left and right and if you are lucky they sometimes miss. Sometimes your smash will push them a fair distance from your position so use these tactics to close the gap. On Venus it helps alot if your teammates can shoot off the minotaurs shield. If the shield stays on then you will find yourself in a time consuming battle with the minotaur while being sniped from the other enemies. For this reason you should smash the other enemies *before* the minotaur. Doing this gives you plenty of time to battle the minotaur without being sniped but make sure your smash does him some damage or he might decide to teleport up the steps and attack your teammates. When fighting the minotaur attack him from the side and his frontal attack will pose no threat. So after an attack move to the side and do it again. If you lose track of where he is, use the radar to locate him. You should also jump and use the relic smash as much as possible. Hunter's have an advantage here because they can get into the air fast, so if you are a Warlock then use Focused Burst for double jump, it get's you higher quicker making your smash more effective. You don't need to go down the steps to attack them, you can go down the side. I've not done this, it seems a better way to avoid being sniped before you attack but there might be more risk of your teammates being attacked. As for killing supplicants, a Warlock should use Firebolt Grenades, it can damage all three supplicants making killing them much easier. Don't stand around on the sync plate pillar waiting for them to come to you, once the portal is open you should get a clear line of sight to their spawn and start shooting them as soon as possible. A level 30 warlock can kill all supplicants on his own before any of them reach a sync plate. Glitches are a part of the game but you can minimize their effect by not playing with people on the other side of the world ie minimize latency between teammates. If you have an effective strategy and coherant team then you will only need two or three trips through the portal so glitches won't happen as often.
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One big point for the middle burn strategy: When burning atheon on the middle platform, have a titan drop a shield in the back with weapons of light. This will significantly increase your damage output. However, the biggest help here is that now everyone can [u]exit through the back[/u]. Supplicants spawn left and right and rarely ever go to the back. This mean that you don't have to waste time killing the supplicants during time's vengeance. Also, exit with 5 seconds remaining so that you never have a chance of jumping and being detained (insta-death).
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The blinding grenade and saint helm helps quite a bit
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Very good tips! I have found that when I stay on supplicant kill duty....my team usually beats Atheon. Like you said, even during time vengeance. Because if there are no supplicants left no one will die from supplicant suicides. But specially clear the portal of supplicants where your friends are coming from.
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Editado por d1st0rt: 11/26/2014 4:37:41 PMAwesome advice! I always stress the importance of having one or two people on supplicant duty when playing with randys(randoms). One tip to maximize dps is when portal team exits have a titan pop weapons of light on the stairs to right or left of main door, so when portal team exits everybody passes through the bubble for WOL. The Relic holder then positions himself in front of the main door and only pops the bubble when Aetheon is shooting at the team but if you notice he will spend most of his time strafing left and right and this is the time the relic holder needs to be shooting the relic special. The damage from the relic special could be the difference between 3 and 4 times vengeance runs, 2-3 if team is equipped with G-horns.
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1 RespuestaGood pointers. One thing I like is right before Time's Vengeance runs out, the Titan, (if you have one in the group) throws down his bubble in the middle so that nobody has to jump from the middle to get killed by a supplicant. If you have two Titans, you can use a bubble along with the relic shield for even more damage to Atheon before dropping another bubble to stay in before being teleported again. If there isn't a Titan, my two favorite spots to stay away from supplicants for each side is..... On the Venus sync plate side- The wall directly behind the plate has a small ledge up pretty high away from supplicants. On the Mars side- Up high above the portal gate.
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DON'T PUSH THE RELIC HOLDER IN THE MIDDLE.. people don't seem to get that and we always end up taking splash damage and shit... Idk if that's intentional or a bug but either way when someone says It listen it's for your own survival
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Editado por Gargantuesque: 11/7/2014 12:19:21 AMIf you have the relic and your teammates are assholes and forget to help you on Venus, don't try to attack the Praetorian while he is on the stairs. Draw him down by killing the two Hobs behind him, while staying inside his melee range so he doesn't rocket yo ass. Because of a glitch regarding stairs, that -blam!-er WILL get his health back and WILL bitchslap your face so hard you will call him Daddy. Don't touch the relic holder if you are doing the middle bubble strategy. Get down too, stay right behind the relic holder. Sometimes you get splash damage from Atheon, and I do not yet know what is causing it exactly, it could be from touching the relic holder, or from standing near the edges of the bubble. Dunno. Don't do either of those, just in case. If you don't have the relic, you gotta watch the relic holder on Venus. Don't let your mate die because of the Praetorian without getting any help, 99% of the time it means a wipe which you could have easily avoided if you had just helped him out for 3 seconds, shooting the rusted -blam!-er. Don't just stand still on top of the stairs waiting for the Oracle to appear, pls. This doesn't apply for the Hobs on Mars. If you can't kill them instantly with a super, or a well launched rocket, just don't do anything. The relic holder can get all of them if he's not retarded, you hitting them without killing them is not helping. Don't just stand on the portal pillars if you are opening the portals at home. You can't kill the Supplicants coming from behind the portal that way. Spread out, put someone right on top of the portal for example for Venus, or on the huge rock for Mars so he can shoot the supplicants when they spawn. Throw Dot grenades so the supplicants hesitate a bit before running in front of the portal as a last resort if your bros are coming back. Thanks for making those kinds of posts, the more that info spreads, the less heavy ammo I'll have to buy from Xur ...
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1 RespuestaA pro destiny player told me some amazing rules to make me a better player. 1.) Don't Die. 2.) Don't Die. wait for it... 3.) Don't Die. 4.) If you get in a fire fight and you are hit first, run for cover. 5.) Don't Die.
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I have given this exact same advice 100 times, you must be a pro raider
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Editado por ThE HUntER USA: 11/6/2014 8:36:39 PMI wish everyone could read this, sadly probably the bad people I play raid with will not read it. . Alot of good things said here which I tried to explain to a few hard raid groups I could find. I really need some good guys who can play adequately. Thanks for posting this!
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wanted to stress a few points that I've found to be important too. #3 yes, yes, a million times yes. Most people can't believe how frustrating it is to try and zig zag down the left portal side because somebody alerted the 3 hobgoblins so they are already shooting you when you are at the top of the stairs still. Or even worse, shot them once with an auto rifle so they put their shield up, or completely missed with a grenade for the same result. Left side, let the relic holder haul ass down there and ground pound those hobgoblins. If any are still up (quite often you can get all 3 in that first go) 1 slam takes out the last guy if they are level 30. Now on the right side, DO help kill that praetorian. Throw those grenades, use GG if you are a hunter, nova bomb if you are voidwalker, shoot a rocket, whatever. Just do some damage to em because they love to randomly regen their health and its a lot for a relic holder to solo, especially with 2 goblins too. There is plenty of time to focus the adds down first and then start on oracles. If you feel behind on oracles, the relic holder can drop it, shoot a few times, and pick it back up. Or somebody from outside can come in the portal and help shoot oracles. No reason to fall behind and wipe on oracles, but plenty of reason to wipe on a praetorian that nobody helped with. #7 is probably my biggest pet peeve. Just because we've wiped a few times doesn't mean we aren't gonna make it. Screwing around at the start leading to early wipes is a huge time waster and kills a groups momentum. If you are getting farther and farther with each wipe, like first few you wiped at the first teleport, then you started getting through that and getting atheon down, then you started getting through multiple teleports and atheon was going down more, then all the sudden you can't even make it to the first teleport, its a real kick in the gut to the group's momentum. Stay positive, stay focused, don't F*ck over your team because you are bored or being silly. Some new tips #8 when breaking away from the middle (if that is your strategy, otherwise just group up at the plates when he is about to teleport) try to get 3 guys to each sync plate as he is teleporting people. This way you will almost always be starting the sync plate to open the portal asap. The guy(s) on the wrong side can just hop over to help out on the correct portal side. 1 guy can stay on the sync plate pillar to make sure the portal opens and stays open, 1 guy should hop up on TOP of the portal. From there you can see the middle where atheon usually stands and he can shoot the supplicants as they spawn. This makes it so there is never any question of "is the outside of the portal clear?" which wastes times vengeance. The portal team can always run out the moment they are ready. This also leaves 1 guy on the outside to float for whatevers needed. He can move up and help kill supplicants as they spawn, or he can hop in the portal to help with oracles. #9 If atheon does mess up and only send 2 people (or 1 person), don't panic. If people are doing what they should for #8 the portal will be open soon and they will be sending help for those oracles. Grab that relic asap and continue as you normally would with 3, kill adds, then work on oracles. If you are still behind, have that relic hold drop the shield (call it out beforehand so people don't freak out and panic or accidentally grab it, which resets the cleanse). You can shoot a bit, pick the shield back up, cleanse whoever, and then drop it and shoot some more. As long as the same person keeps picking up the relic its fine, if somebody else grabs it, cleanse has to recharge which most likely means a blind group and a wipe.
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1. Don't die 2. Kill Supps 3. Put fire on the Minotaur 4. Call out a stray Hob 5. Stand on top of the portal to kill Supps at their spawn 6. Go to the very back 7. Weapons of Light to the right or left of the Relic holder in the middle 8. 1 person focus on Supps while 4 others unload with the best weapons in the game 9. GG, you beat it in 3-4 teleports
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Editado por laxxmann7: 11/6/2014 3:42:41 PMOne additional tip for bailing last second. Have a tender spawn a bubble right behind the relic's bubble. When the relic holder calls out bail everybody else should run while the relic holder keeps the relic shield up and then when Atheon stops shooting he need to stand in the defender bubble to protect him from a quick shot 1 hit kill. Also titan strikers should fist of havoc the minotaur on Venus if they are teleported. One FoH and a shield slam should kill the minotaur if you are both level 30.
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Add this to your list. Hunters golden gun kills oracles one shot and should always be up after times vengeance. Support middle on Venus and then golden gun oracles to get caught up.
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I barely ever died in my run that took 2 hours. Our most experienced kept dying from supplicants....*facepalm*
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8 RespuestasI dont agree with #5 I like to have 1 person on each portal at all times. This allows you to kill all the supplicant on either side and never have to worry about which side the other 3 teleported too.
