~ I agree they shouldn'tve held back for the last gens. But imo 30 is acceptable this time. ~ Hardly. Outside the iron banner everyones armor rating and damage are identical. Classes are balanced by being unbalanced since there is no clear best class. ~ Every game company sets high expectations during the beginning months. "subject to change" is there for a reason. At least in destiny most places are real geometry. Meaning IF the invisible barriers were removed we could climb that stuff. ~ so you are complaining about single player being like single player? I won't even comment on the other 2 points. It's clear you are pretty much strwa manning at this point. ~If you know what a beta is you would know why it's a valid "excuse." I have to laugh. Destiny isn't lasting 10 years. the franchise is. Do research please. Your last sentence is subjective. It's obviously not as big and wonderous as many people hyped themselves before. But it's certainly bigger then pretty much anything we've gotten on consoles content included. It's just the beginning and it's being supported by one of the best developers around. If people want to focus on the downsides and ruin things for themselves that's their problem not mine. I acknowledge this games downsides. But i think this games upsides more then make up for it. Flame me if you wish.

>Reasons why people are upset >Lists reasons why people are upset Never once did I say "Reasons why "I" am upset"

Perfect way to dodge an argument. Muting you.

Congratulations, you guys can't even be bothered to read the first sentence, just come to defend all the reasons why you are blindly following ring leaders. Have fun with your game, I won't be playing it because of most of those reasons.

So I don't generally enter into these little cry baby bs arguments but you are quite the contradictory young man. You said you listed the reasons people are upset not why you are, but than said you won't be playing destiny because of those reasons, therefore implying you are upset enough by them that you do not want to play... Some people...

ummm. ok not even going to wait to read the rest of your post because you're so very very wrong very very early in your rant.. it's not lazy developing.. it's intelligent (read: not brain dead) business to market a game to the largest audience available.. I know the ps4 has sold a lot of consoles.. but seriously.. you thing there are more current gen players out there already ? no sir, the biggest console player base still remains on last gen.. and only an idiot would target the smaller half of console consumer so early into the new generations.. They want to sell a lot of copies, make a lot of money, install a massive initial fan base. I may not like a bit less of the high end power on my PS4 version of Destiny.. but only a fool would argue that they are coddling anyone or being lazy developers. seriously??? SERIOUSLY?? try to recall that Bungie and Activision are companies that rely on fiscal success to continue..

>Make one version of the game at 1080p 60FPS >Make another version of the game 1080p 30FPS Lazy developing

pretty much bungies entire built in fan base comes from 30fps soooo, give them a release to bump up.. Destiny will most definitely hit 60, it's allowing for a transition.. it'll probably be ok.

Destiny won't hit 60, it's currently sitting at sub 30 most of the time.

Destiny will hit 60 almost definitely in the sequel.. like I said give them a release to bump up with.. allow for a transition. Destiny 1 : 30... Destiny 2: the poorly named sequel: almost definitely 60fps

Lol... That's sad bungie's waiting 2+ plus years to get a 2014 game to 60 fps. Pcs have been hitting 60 fps on games for years. Just another reason pc gaming trumps console gaming.

every shooter based game has been "un-balanced" for a long time, the trick is for the player to balance it, either with distance(to counter supers, shotguns) or with a counter weapon(sniper rifle or a super to the guy in the tank) If the games were balanced they would get boring, balanced games would work great if it were 1 lifers(socom)

Correct and incorrect at the same time. Most PVP/Arena shooters before Call of Duty came out featured level playing fields that you had to go to a weapon to pick up the "bonus" which made it fair from the beginning and never once did I leave a match of Unreal Tournament or Halo 2/3 and felt ripped off that a person started with a different gun than I did, which could give them an advantage from the beginning.

[quote]30FPS is a subpar experience for a First Person Shooter and "holding back" to coddle the people who didn't leap into the next generation of consoles (like myself) is lazy developing. Unbalanced PVP with unbalanced weapons, map control, and classes. [/quote] 30 FPS is not a subpar experience, please acknowledge what previous games have done with similar framerates. And, don't be so derogation about staying behind either. Not everyone can afford it, and saying that Bungie is coddling them makes it seem wrong that they actually care for others. And finally, the game was pretty well balanced, you just have to use brain power while playing. Meaning stay out of the effective range of whatever gun you find overpowered, play the objectives, and acknowledge that at some point your going to die to a super, and you have one too, and you definitely don't complain as much when you get a kill with your super.

[quote]And, don't be so derogation about staying behind either. Not everyone can afford it, and saying that Bungie is coddling them makes it seem wrong that they actually care for others. [/quote] >Make one version of the game at 1080p 60FPS >Make another version of the game 1080p 30FPS Lazy developing [quote]30 FPS is not a subpar experience, please acknowledge what previous games have done with similar framerates. [/quote] Wait and see the difference for yourself in November when you can play Halo 3 at 60FPS, hell have a buddy come over with his TV and hook the two systems together so you can see them side by side. The future is 60 or higher. Also Borderlands 2 runs at 60, so a similar game running at a better frame rate. [quote]And finally, the game was pretty well balanced, you just have to use brain power while playing. Meaning stay out of the effective range of whatever gun you find overpowered, play the objectives, and acknowledge that at some point your going to die to a super, and you have one too, and you definitely don't complain as much when you get a kill with your super.[/quote] Right, if you call going into a match with a low leveled gun (20 damage) against somebody who is fully maxed out (60 damage +elemental +blah blah +blah blah) "balanced" you truly need to learn what balancing is.

..Considering all damage and armor ratings are equalized for Crucible matches, your argument about going into a match with a low level gun is completely invalid. The level and damage doesn't mean anything in PvP. Unless you're in the Iron Bannor. Then that's your own fault for going in with shit gear to begin with. And 60 FPS is the future, I won't disagree there. But the fact you're complain because it isn't running in 60 fps.. I'm sorry, but you're not a real gamer. Shit like that doesn't matter. Shooters have been playing competatively without 60 FPS for years without problems. And on top of that, Destiny is for FUN, obviously not for try-hard tournaments or bullshit MLG. And no, I'm not just some gaming casual. I play in Tournaments (Well, use to back when I was in a clan) and watch MLG matches. But really.. That stuff doesn't make or break a game. There are plenty of shooters that don't hold tournaments that still make a killing, and do fine. It isn't lazy development, it isn't them coddling one portion of people.. It's just going with what works best, and what's the right choice. You're seriously in the majorly off man, just face it.

[quote][quote]And, don't be so derogation about staying behind either. Not everyone can afford it, and saying that Bungie is coddling them makes it seem wrong that they actually care for others. [/quote] >Make one version of the game at 1080p 60FPS >Make another version of the game 1080p 30FPS Lazy developing [quote]30 FPS is not a subpar experience, please acknowledge what previous games have done with similar framerates. [/quote] Wait and see the difference for yourself in November when you can play Halo 3 at 60FPS, hell have a buddy come over with his TV and hook the two systems together so you can see them side by side. The future is 60 or higher. Also Borderlands 2 runs at 60, so a similar game running at a better frame rate. [quote]And finally, the game was pretty well balanced, you just have to use brain power while playing. Meaning stay out of the effective range of whatever gun you find overpowered, play the objectives, and acknowledge that at some point your going to die to a super, and you have one too, and you definitely don't complain as much when you get a kill with your super.[/quote] Right, if you call going into a match with a low leveled gun (20 damage) against somebody who is fully maxed out (60 damage +elemental +blah blah +blah blah) "balanced" you truly need to learn what balancing is.[/quote]What are talking about when you say "low level gun(20 damage)vs someone with maxed out gun(60 damage)? Are you talking about the gun's "Attack"? If so,FYI : the guns attack is relevant only in PvE and the iron banner game mode in PvP(recommend not playing in iron banner until you have some good gear). In PvP,only the guns stats are relevant,such as impact(damage),range,stability etc. As for the 30fps issue,yes 60fps does look better but a game running at 30fps is not a game breaking issue. We console players been playing on 30fps for years without any issues. Although destiny is running at 30fps,the game looks really good. I'm sure in the future 60fps will be the standard for games on consoles. Finally,if you don't like what you've seen so far in destiny,there's more games coming out running at 60fps that you can play,dude.

[quote]We console players been playing on 30fps for years [/quote] No you haven't, there are a ton of games from the 1980's up until 2005 that have all been 60.