JavaScript is required to use Bungie.net

Foros

publicado originalmente en: Weapon Retirement - Limiting Player Choice
Editado por Haunter: 4/30/2020 4:31:34 PM
22
Its completely unnecessary Lukes post can be broken down into 2 issues, one of which is factually incorrect the other is an issue that the design team needs to work on and hilariously these issues contradict each other. Issue #1: Power creep. The system where gear becomes better and better as time goes on. This is totally and completely false. Let's look at a Y2 pulse rifle compared to a Y3. Blast furnace vs sacred providence. Both are great pulses, both see use, neither are stronger then the other, if power creep existed sacred p would be miles better then blast furnace. Can anyone look at the recent weapons we've got and say they're vastly better then Y2 or sometimes even Y1 options? No. Power creep does not exist in destiny. Issue #2 new weapons aren't being used because people prefer the old. Aside from being a complete contradiction from issue #1 power creep where the latest gear is the best so why would it not be used the ones at fault for new gear sucking is purely on the devs. The fact is when new weapons are part of a good archtype and have the desirable perk pools they get used. Let's look at this season - astral horizon, seraph shotty, summoner, dire promise and eye of sol are the highlights this season, all are good archtypes with the right perk pools. Let's look at last season - line in the sand, perfect paradox, travelers judgement, last hope, breachlight and steelfeather repeater - all good perk pools with good archtypes and all saw use last season and continue to do so. The destiny community like grinding for new stuff when it's worthwhile. However when everyone loves 150 rpm cannons and bungie decide not only to not bring back jewel of osiris, messenger or infinite therom (probably time gating for next season) despite bringing back all the other Y1D1 trials stuff or when they make a seraph hand cannon but for who knows what reason decide to make it a 180 what exactly do they expect? When new gear is part of weak archtypes or have bad perk pools including times where perks that would work well together both get placed under the same node you can hardly expect players to use it. Literally if anyone in the community would be designing these weapons they'd know the desirable perk combos and ensure they're possible, when that happens new stuff absolutely gets used, this is a dev ignorance or incompetence issue, not a player one. The fact is there are only 2 real reasons this is being done - and neither are to help players. Reason 1: Bungie devs want the latest gear to be used but not have to put effort into making them - simply put they want to kill all the old stuff to force players to use new garbage (at least until people find the latest good stuff and ONLY use that taking away practically all choice) Reason 2: Bungie want to "retire" all the guns just to bring them back later as content - similar to how they brought back Y1 guns like last hope, dire promise and old fashioned they want to remove all the guns so they can resell them behind later dlcs and force players to regrind for it - a pure scumbag move through and through. No one should be for the change because the change is not for the player - weapon retirement is an awful decision that should be totally and completely repelled by the community. [spoiler]Side note to those that feel pinnacle/ritual weapons specifically are too strong: even if I agreed (and I'm not saying I do) why on earth would a bare handful of weapons mean we retire everything? You feel the pinnacle/rituals should be retired? I can hear the argument, the 99% of other stuff? Absolutely not[/spoiler]
English

Publicando en idioma:

 

Pórtate bien. Echa un vistazo a nuestro Código de conducta antes de publicar tu mensaje. Cancelar Editar Crear escuadra Publicar

  • I am not for Luke Smith screwing all the players to continue to be lazy and farm guardian hours. If he put a little effort into making some decent content he wouldn't have to force us to do anything. LUKE SMITH IS THE CANCER THAT IS KILLING DESTINY 2.

    Publicando en idioma:

     

    Pórtate bien. Echa un vistazo a nuestro Código de conducta antes de publicar tu mensaje. Cancelar Editar Crear escuadra Publicar

  • Don't know for sure if it affects power creep but every major sandbox update they have to go through every weapon and make adjustments to code and this is proven through light.gg. That may be why we don't notice the power creep. This is also one of the reasons LS said they want to leave weapons behind is so they don't have to continue to do that. I imagine it's a painstaking and time consuming process. I for one hate to leave a lot of my weapons behind but if it means we will actually start getting good releases again instead of this dribble their feeding us now then so be it.

    Publicando en idioma:

     

    Pórtate bien. Echa un vistazo a nuestro Código de conducta antes de publicar tu mensaje. Cancelar Editar Crear escuadra Publicar

  • Don't kid yourself. They haven't given us any good content in forever. Forsaken was good but not done by them. Luke Smith is nothing but full of excuses. We won't get anything good. He isn't capable of it. D2 has been a huge failure. Trash content that keeps getting worse. Bungie is nothing but cry babies that don't want to do what it takes to be good.

    Publicando en idioma:

     

    Pórtate bien. Echa un vistazo a nuestro Código de conducta antes de publicar tu mensaje. Cancelar Editar Crear escuadra Publicar

  • [quote]Don't know for sure if it affects power creep but every major sandbox update they have to go through every weapon and make adjustments to code and this is proven through light.gg. That may be why we don't notice the power creep. This is also one of the reasons LS said they want to leave weapons behind is so they don't have to continue to do that. I imagine it's a painstaking and time consuming process.[/quote] What adjustments to code? They change the power cap and move on, I doubt they do it weapon by weapon since all legendary weapons have that ability [quote]I for one hate to leave a lot of my weapons behind but if it means we will actually start getting good releases again instead of this dribble their feeding us now then so be it.[/quote] It won't, just because they arent updating the light value of old weapons does not mean suddenly we will have significant content drops

    Publicando en idioma:

     

    Pórtate bien. Echa un vistazo a nuestro Código de conducta antes de publicar tu mensaje. Cancelar Editar Crear escuadra Publicar

  • They’re retiring weapons because everyone has been using the same guns for so long. They did the same thing in the taken king and it worked fine. I’m feeling pessimistic because bungie have -blam!-ed shit up recently, but the taken king was fantastic and implemented weapon retirement.

    Publicando en idioma:

     

    Pórtate bien. Echa un vistazo a nuestro Código de conducta antes de publicar tu mensaje. Cancelar Editar Crear escuadra Publicar

  • [quote]They’re retiring weapons because everyone has been using the same guns for so long.[/quote] No, new gear gets used all the time when it's good Astral horizon, eye of sol, seven seraph shotty and summoner all prove that this season Breachlight, steelfeather repeater, perfect paradox, travelers judgement and line in the sand all prove that last season. [quote]They did the same thing in the taken king and it worked fine. I’m feeling pessimistic because bungie have -blam!-ed shit up recently, but the taken king was fantastic and implemented weapon retirement.[/quote] TTK they did it to move away from elemental primaries and it failed - ultimately they ended up having to bring the Y1 stuff back due to how unpopular the retirement decision was, ldr5001, longbow and most others came back and this includes the elemental raid primaries which were changed to exotics

    Publicando en idioma:

     

    Pórtate bien. Echa un vistazo a nuestro Código de conducta antes de publicar tu mensaje. Cancelar Editar Crear escuadra Publicar

  • Plus they would have to create a weapon of each archetype to at least fill the gaps they create, otherwise people are going to be pissed beyond compare. They would HAVE TO put in more effort to at least create a larger pool of weapons, but unfortunately that means literally nothing because theres no guarantee it will even be useful. Let's also not forget they could create artificial trials metas. Cant upgrade that spare rations to 1050? Better use this 1050 180 rpm because we didnt create any 150s this season.

    Publicando en idioma:

     

    Pórtate bien. Echa un vistazo a nuestro Código de conducta antes de publicar tu mensaje. Cancelar Editar Crear escuadra Publicar

  • Well said and if I could upvote every 5 minutes I would. It’s a lazy way for them to water things down even further. It absolutely disrespects my time put in on grind for perfect rolls. Competition is always a good thing. If something is actually better I’ll grind it and use it in load outs. They need to value a players time invested. A god rolled kindle orchid isn’t being tested to see if it will break the new raid. The points put forward in the DC were absurd. I’m in a clan that’s extremely active and full. It has a PVE clan and a PVP clan. No one is running Breakneck load outs like he suggested in the DC. They sunset weapons I won’t spend a dime on the game till they walk it back.

    Publicando en idioma:

     

    Pórtate bien. Echa un vistazo a nuestro Código de conducta antes de publicar tu mensaje. Cancelar Editar Crear escuadra Publicar

  • But here’s the problem: if I already have a god rolled Blast Furnace, why farm for a Sacred Providence?

    Publicando en idioma:

     

    Pórtate bien. Echa un vistazo a nuestro Código de conducta antes de publicar tu mensaje. Cancelar Editar Crear escuadra Publicar

  • [quote]But here’s the problem: if I already have a god rolled Blast Furnace, why farm for a Sacred Providence?[/quote] 1. You want to try something new and mix it up 2. Sacred has rapid hit which is amazing on pulses 3. You like the aesthetics or audio of sacred providence over blast furnace But maybe you dont want any of the above and like your blast furnace, that to me is 100% fine, don't go for sacred providence in that case, bungies job is to provide content, not ensure everything in the game be used by everyone. If bungie dropped a new 150 rpm primary cannon many people would grind for it and many would say they like thier dire promise/spare rations. There nothing wrong with that, player choice should be the final say.

    Publicando en idioma:

     

    Pórtate bien. Echa un vistazo a nuestro Código de conducta antes de publicar tu mensaje. Cancelar Editar Crear escuadra Publicar

  • Never understood how it's "power creep" if all I use are old weapons. (1 exception: Y3 Perfect Paradox....absolutely love this shotty) IMO the majority of the good weapons were in Y2.

    Publicando en idioma:

     

    Pórtate bien. Echa un vistazo a nuestro Código de conducta antes de publicar tu mensaje. Cancelar Editar Crear escuadra Publicar

  • There’s a Y1 edition from the Lost Prophecies that has Rampage I think. I’m going after that one. Let’s see what I use: Tigerspite (Y2) Dire Promise (Y4) Pillager (Y2) Hawthorne's Field-Forged Shotgun (Y3) The Chaperone (Y2) Long Shadow (Y2) Swift Ride XE8375 (Y2) Skyburner's Oath (Y1) Bad Reputation (Y2) Tommy's Matchbook (Y4) Play of the Game (Y2) Steel Sybil (Y2) Most of my stuff in my immediate inventory is from Forsaken. Of course there’s a couple Y3, Y3, Y1 in there. That’s because all the weapons are basically the same caliber of weapon. There’s literally no power creep.

    Publicando en idioma:

     

    Pórtate bien. Echa un vistazo a nuestro Código de conducta antes de publicar tu mensaje. Cancelar Editar Crear escuadra Publicar

  • I couldn't agree more! I haven't played much this season, but on occasion I would still pull out the Y1 stuff. And they seem to work just as effectively as before. With power creep, the old Y1 weapons should be blown away at this point in D2's lifespan. But the truth is that they aren't.....unless someone wants to argue that static rolls are garbage compared to random rolls. I cannot argue that at all. What I do find interesting is that Y1 weapons had LESS perks than Y2 and beyond AND they are still viable (looking at the EP Shotty, Midnight Coup, Nameless Midnight Y1, etc) Here is what I think would fix this whole situation. Eliminate Power Levels (aka "Light Levels"). Allow game progression to unlock certain activities....ie, to do the raid, you must beat the campaign or the missions to that season or dlc. To do Trials, one must complete so much PvP/Comp activities in the season/DLC which will reduce cheating drastically in Trials AND keeps it F2P🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯 MINDBLOWING! People will argue about feeling more powerful... give weapons damage ranges and make them randomly rolled. You wanna feel powerful, farm that TRUE God gun of your play style. If you are OK w mediocrity, then do what you want.

    Publicando en idioma:

     

    Pórtate bien. Echa un vistazo a nuestro Código de conducta antes de publicar tu mensaje. Cancelar Editar Crear escuadra Publicar

  • Upvote. I agree with the comp/PvP requirement for Trials. Like Fabled or above can enter, cuz it’s like the endgame PvP!

    Publicando en idioma:

     

    Pórtate bien. Echa un vistazo a nuestro Código de conducta antes de publicar tu mensaje. Cancelar Editar Crear escuadra Publicar

  • Yup! Something somewhat easy but not ridiculously easy. Fabled is a good level.

    Publicando en idioma:

     

    Pórtate bien. Echa un vistazo a nuestro Código de conducta antes de publicar tu mensaje. Cancelar Editar Crear escuadra Publicar

  • Yes, cant believe people bought into the whole power creep thing and all the contradictions the argument brought with.

    Publicando en idioma:

     

    Pórtate bien. Echa un vistazo a nuestro Código de conducta antes de publicar tu mensaje. Cancelar Editar Crear escuadra Publicar

  • Outstanding and well-put counter argument! You knocked down the argument Datto was making for the weapon retirement in one post. It's a shame that I feel because Datto's okay with it, that means they feel there's no actual pushback. I hope this gets upvoted into infinity and shared everywhere, and not buried by Bungo or Ninjas.

    Publicando en idioma:

     

    Pórtate bien. Echa un vistazo a nuestro Código de conducta antes de publicar tu mensaje. Cancelar Editar Crear escuadra Publicar

  • Some other intelligent soul who understands powercreep, prepare for the fanboys to message you in hordes how you are wrong.

    Publicando en idioma:

     

    Pórtate bien. Echa un vistazo a nuestro Código de conducta antes de publicar tu mensaje. Cancelar Editar Crear escuadra Publicar

  • Fanboys aka kellygreen2 aka Lord High Inquisitor of Bungie - Land

    Publicando en idioma:

     

    Pórtate bien. Echa un vistazo a nuestro Código de conducta antes de publicar tu mensaje. Cancelar Editar Crear escuadra Publicar

  • I get into it with that person all the time

    Publicando en idioma:

     

    Pórtate bien. Echa un vistazo a nuestro Código de conducta antes de publicar tu mensaje. Cancelar Editar Crear escuadra Publicar

  • Your response here is absolutely to the point! Excellent! Couldn’t agree more! I concur with every paragraph. Luke is wrong; this makes Bungie wrong. No question. Nice!

    Publicando en idioma:

     

    Pórtate bien. Echa un vistazo a nuestro Código de conducta antes de publicar tu mensaje. Cancelar Editar Crear escuadra Publicar

  • This is the best post I have ever seen. Power creep can’t be an issue for destiny. People misunderstand the point of retiring weapons in D1. It served a completely different purpose for how the devs want it too for D2. I personally think Pinnacles were a mistake. However they could be either nerfed to be like all other weapons(which I don’t want) or buff em and make em into exotics. It would also help if they scraped lairs and added more dungeons and focus on remaking, taking out, tweaking strikes rather than just increasing light level. At least make smart story changes. Say the GMNF have their 20 timer so it’s like a countdown till Xol destroys Rasputin. Literally some form of a consequence!

    Publicando en idioma:

     

    Pórtate bien. Echa un vistazo a nuestro Código de conducta antes de publicar tu mensaje. Cancelar Editar Crear escuadra Publicar

No se te permite acceder a este contenido.
;
preload icon
preload icon
preload icon