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8/29/2019 11:04:57 PM
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Let’s start with the easy one by calling out some nonsense PR speak: seasonal content drops and changes are not innovative, having been done already by many high profile games. Nothing describes about the seasons sounds innovative; it’s just the usual model of trying to incentivize continual play between small changes or content drops.
Next, the suggestion that the best gameplay stories should be ones that “you had to be there for” is an ultimate failure of game design. Gameplay that’s worthwhile enough to be worth talking about or described as the best in any fashion shouldn’t be transient; it should endure to be experienced by players who aren’t constantly engaged with the game.
Seasons bring some changes to environments to shake up things like patrols and vendors and other such simple content that should be refreshed on a regular basis is fine, it’s not innovative but it is worthwhile. Same goes for having XP-based lootstreams to help bring in more regularized rewards; not innovative, but useful.
The seasonal artifacts are an abomination. It is not engaging to invest time working on building out player power or designing a build to have it stripped away on a regular basis. We keep telling you that we hate having progress wiped away; you should know darn well that this isn’t going to go over well with the community. The game needs regular balance changes and maintenance. It has never been in a stable enough state to be left alone for ~10 weeks at a time, yet you have consistently left significant portions of tuning unchanged for significantly longer. It is very much a cop-out to use rotating artifacts to avoid iterating towards balanced player abilities and building in player depth in customization at more basic levels that don’t feel like an awkward add-on.
The future of Destiny needs to focus less on quick fixes to ride the train of catchy things that work for other games and instead build on solid foundations. That means really making serious efforts on balancing, moreso than has ever been done by the franchise. It means working on highly replayable content, probably a few different types of procedurally generated stuff for PvE, along with loot and reward structures that have the complexity and stability to stand the test of time without being wiped and reset every year.
Shadowkeep, and in particular the season model described, thus far don’t seem to be putting enough work into the real fundamentals, and instead are doing small scale work that doesn’t really fix core problems or go far enough to meet player expectations.
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It's all been said before. Such a shame they just can't seem to do it.
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[quote]The seasonal artifacts are an abomination. It is not engaging to invest time working on building out player power or designing a build to have it stripped away on a regular basis.[/quote] this x 100000000000000000
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Agreed, in full.
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SC, I reposted a quote from your reply as its own thread as it was legendary.
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Editado por ken31cayman: 8/30/2019 3:33:27 PM[quote] It is not engaging to invest time working on building out player power or designing a build to have it stripped away on a regular basis[/quote] Preach. [quote] The future of Destiny needs to focus less on quick fixes... and instead build on solid foundations. ...with loot and reward structures that have the complexity and stability to stand the test of time without being wiped and reset every year. [/quote] Amen.
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Nah, I like the look of it.
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I'm with you my dude.. Tbh there's a lot I Wana say about this bs, but I think I'm gona pass and not give 2 -blam!-s about it! Basicaly is what bungie is doing atm.. And don't get me wrong, I always understood bungie point of view, actions and defend them whem they need to be defended, but, with this "annual season battle pass fortnite legends" I can't support that bs and scummy method. I said that was a mistake make the damn game f2p cuz I had the feeling that this gona happen.. I just hope this bs not gona be the beginning of the end of this game/franchise! Or even bungie to a certain point.. The problem atm is that even if we don't buy the season passes, cancel the shadowkeep deluxe pre orders and just buy the shadowkeep expansion, they not gona have enough time to change their "annual pass" model..and I do hope ppl don't engage with this bs and show the middle finger to them, since is what they're doing to us atm.
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[quote]Let’s start with the easy one by calling out some nonsense PR speak: seasonal content drops and changes are not innovative, having been done already by many high profile games. Nothing describes about the seasons sounds innovative; it’s just the usual model of trying to incentivize continual play between small changes or content drops. Next, the suggestion that the best gameplay stories should be ones that “you had to be there for” is an ultimate failure of game design. Gameplay that’s worthwhile enough to be worth talking about or described as the best in any fashion shouldn’t be transient; it should endure to be experienced by players who aren’t constantly engaged with the game. Seasons bring some changes to environments to shake up things like patrols and vendors and other such simple content that should be refreshed on a regular basis is fine, it’s not innovative but it is worthwhile. Same goes for having XP-based lootstreams to help bring in more regularized rewards; not innovative, but useful. The seasonal artifacts are an abomination. It is not engaging to invest time working on building out player power or designing a build to have it stripped away on a regular basis. We keep telling you that we hate having progress wiped away; you should know darn well that this isn’t going to go over well with the community. The game needs regular balance changes and maintenance. It has never been in a stable enough state to be left alone for ~10 weeks at a time, yet you have consistently left significant portions of tuning unchanged for significantly longer. It is very much a cop-out to use rotating artifacts to avoid iterating towards balanced player abilities and building in player depth in customization at more basic levels that don’t feel like an awkward add-on. The future of Destiny needs to focus less on quick fixes to ride the train of catchy things that work for other games and instead build on solid foundations. That means really making serious efforts on balancing, moreso than has ever been done by the franchise. It means working on highly replayable content, probably a few different types of procedurally generated stuff for PvE, along with loot and reward structures that have the complexity and stability to stand the test of time without being wiped and reset every year. Shadowkeep, and in particular the season model described, thus far don’t seem to be putting enough work into the real fundamentals, and instead are doing small scale work that doesn’t really fix core problems or go far enough to meet player expectations.[/quote] Very good post. Too bad these scummy, incompetent hacks won’t listen to it. The point about artifacts was especially good; it [i]is[/i] a lazy cop-out to balancing the game, and for us, we will lose progress we worked hard for. It is their job to tweak and balance the game, yet they don’t want to even do that, let alone adding planets, enemy races, strikes, crucible maps, etc. What’s the point of going for something when you know it will disappear in a few weeks? This is so unbelievably backwards, lazy and dumb. Get this trash company out of this space. They’ve lost all hope. We need someone new to take over instead of these brainless, foolish wannabe devs. They fumble at every corner on their greed and idiocy; it’s embarrassing.
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Good post, rarity on here.
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Editado por TJ_Dot: 8/30/2019 5:07:20 AMIf anything, the "you had to be there" only works through the game's evolution itself. Like, you had to be there when Vault of Glass was the thing and was first discovered and how cool of an experience that was way back then. It just wouldn't be the same in D1 now than in 2014, it's still a good raid for sure, but that old spark of awe and wonder has ran its course, that's fine I think. Building the game to artifically supply that feeling is not going to work, if anything, it'll be like " you had to be there when Bungie -blam!-ed up again in somehow another ridiculous way, yeah "good times" " A live example would be, you had to be there when the forges were absurdly high-level day 1, or when Niobe was revealed to be a streamer event and was too hard for people to figure out, all for it to be realized that the last hint had a typo and was busted for several days ( I think, it was sad regardless) Or you had to be there when Reckoning was found to be brokenly disappointing You had to be there when Whisper's identity was stripped and reason to even get, giving full rights to Darci in usage amongst pretty much anyone. You had to be there when Thorn or Luna or any severely unbalanced thing in the crucible made it a freaking cesspool This crap only works with negatives anymore
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Well written. I agree, and through all the criticism levied the underlying theme presented (at least my takeaway)is that of players wanting the game to be better. This is a very constructive post.
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I want someone to print this post out and slap it on Luke’s desk lmao
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[quote]I want someone to print this post out and slap it on Luke’s desk lmao[/quote] Well if we all print it out get Bungies address and put FOA Luke Smith, he might get the message. Or not.
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Editado por A_mo: 8/30/2019 2:10:56 AMAt the beginning I wanted to disagree with you but you definitely make a lot of points that are very true. Gameplay that’s worthwhile enough to be worth talking about or described as the best in any fashion shouldn’t be transient; it should endure to be experienced by players who aren’t constantly engaged with the game. So you think that people that have shown loyalty should get nothing then? And you also don't say anything about the real actual reality which is that the game can't take on many more megabites. It just can't. There are all kinds of reasons that have been talked about on the internet that explain this. They are not riding the train of catchy things btw. This is what so-called gamers are now and this is somewhat what they want out of a game. I do like the idea of procedurally generated things but imo AI is somewhat of a golden goose that truly doesn't exist and never will in this respect. Procedurally generated stuff in videogames usually ends up making everyone mad. Overall what Luke just put up was pretty good. Sometimes it just seems like people are praying for Bungie's downfall. Wow. Something went wrong. My quotation didn't quote-tate the way it should have and the part where I said you were right on some things must have gotten lost somehow. I think I was talking about how you are right about seasonal content drops and such being innovative. They aren't. But at the same time there's certain things people have gotten used to and we should understand why Bungie is pivoting in that direction.
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I don’t understand why destiny has such a large file size considering how all of the planet play spaces are so devoid of content. When you consider the size of destiny with all of its content and then consider a game like elder scrolls online with all of its content and complexity and continual dlcs sitting at 105 gigabytes you have to ask where is all of this bloat coming from or is it lack of optimization or both but you can’t tell me that this game is even close to being as large as eso. What I see and I may be wrong who knows but I see a game company that just needs to make its game server based in its entirety and have us download a client instead of making us and our equipment do all of the heavy lifting just so they can peddle fort nite fomo and charge us for content just to throw it away so they can sell more because the games foundation was essentially built on sand and now they are too poor to build it in a way that will future proof it from issues like this after buying freedom from being an activision -blam!- like cod has always been.
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Editado por Lord Kielron: 8/30/2019 4:38:23 PMYou have to also realize that they also have 2 other armor systems still coded in the game, plus one additional weapon system, the remnants of the token system, etc. they have a ton of things just taking up space in this manner, which is adding extra fluff to the overall game. That’s probably why it’s so large.
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The file size is because of a lot of things from what I've read. From the way Destiny renders things, which is something we all like, to what can only be called sloppyness. I honestly agree with everything you are saying as far as how the game got this big and I'm not much of a computer person so I can't really defend the bloat. I don't really think its going to be fomo like that though. I mean, people get so mad about the grinds and not having time to do them because they work all day right. So now they can grind stuff while they are at work all day and just pay for it. Which its not like they are going to be charging that much money for anything. If it works out right it will grow the playerbase and anyone that wants the game to succeed knows that the playerbase must absolutely be bigger than what it is now. As a PvP main there are so many things that are terrible simply because the playerbase is not big enough and its spread across 3 systems.
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I think it’s first light on top of Shadowkeep, might even have the framework for seasons in there somewhere. At least D1 Y3 is there in all its glory
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Unless they shut those servers down....
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Oo boi, that’d be the “you had to be there” moment fo sure
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I 100% agree with the dislike of seasonal artifacts because it would only further a problem D2 has had that D1 didn't really suffer from. In one of his ridiculously long "memoirs of a broken game" speeches luke mentioned he wanted players to have MORE BUILD DIVERSITY. Well.... So Do I, but with the introduction of generic activities to due (aka power level jumps) all this past year he has managed to do just the opposite for 89% of players. I'm a pretty hardcore time investor in the game and still was left behind in bringing alot of items up to the latest power of the given time. Having a seasonal artifact will only be another way to leave players behind unless they choose to Grind Again each season. How TF am i supposed to get my old buds to play this game agin when literally ANY Other Game can be picked up and played without the empty grind to be high enough for endgame content?
