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3/8/2019 12:14:47 AM
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It doesn’t matter if there’s no exact definition. You don’t need one. You can evaluate it on a case by case basis. For example one person might say: “I believe in vampires and my definition of vampire is an undead human that can turn into a bat and drink the blood of other humans”. You can then evaluate the truth of that persons claim based upon their own definition. You can decide whether or not the thing that person defines as a vampire does or does not exist. You can do the same for any set of beliefs. If someone says “my personal definition of god is a man called Jesus that rose from the dead and performed miracles”. You can then evaluate the truth of those beliefs based upon that definition. All this is besides the point though. My original point was that faith is not a reliable path to truth. For example one person might have faith that we go to heaven when we die. Another person might have faith that we don’t go to heaven but instead we are reincarnated eternally in this life. And someone else might also have faith that there is no afterlife at all - we just die and that’s it. They all have faith that their position is correct. But they obviously can’t all be right. So faith obviously is unreliable.
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  • [quote]All this is besides the point though. My original point was that faith is not a reliable path to truth. For example one person might have faith that we go to heaven when we die. Another person might have faith that we don’t go to heaven but instead we are reincarnated eternally in this life. And someone else might also have faith that there is no afterlife at all - we just die and that’s it. They all have faith that their position is correct. But they obviously can’t all be right. So faith obviously is unreliable.[/quote] And this is why all that other stuff is [b]not[/b] beside the point. They absolutely [i]can[/i] all be correct in their beliefs. Obviously we know nothing about what happens when we die, but here is just one way all three of the above claims can be simultaneously correct: Maybe what happens when you die is different depending on each person. Or maybe all three happen and each claim is actually a different stage of the same process. Which brings me back to my original point - There are several different definitions of what constitutes a god. And this is relevant because it's entirely possible that the Abrahamic God, all Egyptian deities, the Mesoamerican pantheon, the Eldritch Horrors and the flying spaghetti monster are all real beings, that exist in our universe [i]somewhere[/i], and yet a Christian would tell you that only their God is actually a god at all - but that on its own would not mean that the other deities didn't exist, it would merely mean that that group of people do not consider the other beings an example of a god. So all religions don't necessarily contradict one another, they just define the term "god" in different ways, or decide that their faith is best directed towards a different idol.

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  • What you are saying makes no sense. Do you honestly believe that people are incapable of being wrong? You’re saying one person can believe 1+1=3 and one person can believe 1+1=2 and they can both be correct? I’m sorry to break it to you but there is only one right answer. Either 1+1=2 or it doesn’t. Either there’s a conscious supernatural being that created the universe or there isn’t. Either there’s an afterlife or there isn’t. Either Jesus was resurrected or he wasn’t. Not everyone can be right. Reality doesn’t change depending on someone’s belief about it. Here’s another example to make make it really obvious: - Person 1 believes that tooth fairy is real. - Person 2 believes that the tooth fairy isn’t real. What you are saying is that it’s possible for them to both be correct. That’s it’s possible for the tooth fairy to both exist and [i]not[/i] exist at the same time. I’m sorry to break it to you but that just isn’t possible. Only one of them can be correct. Either the tooth fairy exists or the tooth fairy doesn’t exist. You can’t have it both ways.

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  • I'm not talking about whether or not these beings actually exist. If that's what you get from my responses, then that's why it's not making sense. Obviously, they either exist or they don't. But Christianity [b]does not state[/b] "Anubis is not real." It states "There is only one God, the Father, Creator of our planet and everything on it." It is entirely possible that that is true, [b]and also Anubis is real[/b], but Christianity considers him something other than a god. And in that way, the two religions [b]do not contradict each other[/b].

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  • They do contradict each other if followers of other gods believe that their god is the one true father and creator. For example Muslims don’t believe Jesus was god. They instead believe he was a prophet. So their faith is in direct contradiction with Christian faith. Which brings me back to my original point which you continue to ignore. Faith is not a reliable way to discover the truth. It can lead you to believe things that are simply not true. A child can have faith that Santa Clause and the tooth fairy are real. You’re not going to try and argue that their faith is true are you?

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  • [quote]They do contradict each other if followers of other gods believe that their god is the one true father and creator. For example Muslims don’t believe Jesus was god. They instead believe he was a prophet. So their faith is in direct contradiction with Christian faith.[/quote] This part, perhaps. But my issue with this is that Christian ideas of the Trinity contradicts itself already. At least from my understanding of it. [quote]Which brings me back to my original point which you continue to ignore. Faith is not a reliable way to discover the truth. It can lead you to believe things that are simply not true. A child can have faith that Santa Clause and the tooth fairy are real. You’re not going to try and argue that their faith is true are you?[/quote] I'm not ignoring that point, I was explaining how I disagreed with it by way of our last discussion. Faith can lead you to believe things that are not true? Perhaps. But how do you know those things are not true? There could very easily be a race of creatures that eats teeth, much like how some real animals eat bones: http://wikipedia.org/wiki/Osteophagy But yeah, faith is not a reliable way to discover the truth - because it's not trying to discover truth. We have other methods for doing that. Faith is the explanation or belief in something that we will never be able to discover the truth behind - most obviously, gods.

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  • [quote]This part, perhaps. But my issue with this is that Christian ideas of the Trinity contradicts itself already. At least from my understanding of it.[/quote] At least you concede that Christian theology makes no logical sense. [quote]I'm not ignoring that point, I was explaining how I disagreed with it by way of our last discussion. Faith can lead you to believe things that are not true? Perhaps. But how do you know those things are not true? There could very easily be a race of creatures that eats teeth, much like how some real animals eat bones: http://wikipedia.org/wiki/Osteophagy[/quote] Just because something might potentially be possible that doesn’t mean it‘s true. I can dream up any fantastical beast or god. Doesn’t mean they actually exist. There is zero evidence to suggest that the tooth fairy is true. I hate to break it to you but your parents are the ones that put money under your pillow when you lost a tooth - not a race of teeth eating creatures. [quote]But yeah, faith is not a reliable way to discover the truth - because it's not trying to discover truth. We have other methods for doing that. Faith is the explanation or belief in something that we will never be able to discover the truth behind - most obviously, gods.[/quote] As long as you are conceding that it’s not the truth you are interested in. If you want to live your life believing that every god in history, Santa Claus, the tooth fairy and every other historical myth and fairy tale is real then that’s you choice I guess. But to me it’s fairly obvious that you are not even remotely interested in truth or reality.

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  • If you want to have a debate, you could at least show me enough respect to actually [i]read[/i] my arguments...

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  • Where did I misunderstand you? Here’s your argument again: [quote]But yeah, faith is not a reliable way to discover the truth - because it's not trying to discover truth. We have other methods for doing that. Faith is the explanation or belief in something that we will never be able to discover the truth behind - most obviously, gods.[/quote] You directly conceded my original point with this statement. You said that faith is not trying to discover the truth. Faith is the explanation for something we don’t know the truth about. That was my whole point to start with. [u]Faith is an unreliable path to the truth[/u]. Your argument is that we don’t know the truth therefore we can just make it up. It doesn’t seem to matter to you if it’s true or not. If you don’t see the problem with that thinking then I’m sorry.

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  • [quote]Where did I misunderstand you?[/quote] Here: [quote]Your argument is that we don’t know the truth therefore we can just make it up. It doesn’t seem to matter to you if it’s true or not.[/quote]

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  • [quote][quote]Where did I misunderstand you?[/quote] Here: [quote]Your argument is that we don’t know the truth therefore we can just make it up. It doesn’t seem to matter to you if it’s true or not.[/quote][/quote] You may not see it but that is the inevitable conclusion of what you’re saying. When you say: [quote]But yeah, faith is not a reliable way to discover the truth - because it's not trying to discover truth. [/quote] You are saying that you are going to have faith in something without knowing if it’s true. In other words, it doesn’t matter to you if it’s true or not. If the truth mattered to you, you wouldn’t believe something without knowing if it’s true. [quote]Faith is the explanation or belief in something that we will never be able to discover the truth behind - most obviously, gods.[/quote] In other words if you don’t know the actual truth you (or someone else) will make up an explanation. If the truth can’t ever be known then the only possible option when it comes to god’s is to make up an explanation. All I did was point out to you the logical conclusion of your own statements. If you don’t like the conclusion then it’s not my fault. Perhaps you need to look a little deeper into your own beliefs and decide whether or not they actually make sense.

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