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8/12/2017 6:20:29 PM
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Warlocks melee range should be the same as other classes. It's not at all fair for 1 class to have a significantly better melee without any negatives. It just doesn't make sense and isn't at all balanced.
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The warlock actually reaches his whole arm out to get the melee. Thats why his range should be better! Just me though.
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That's only a good point if you're thinking about realism. I think that balance is more important than realism in most cases, and if the warlocks base melee is better than other classes melees in every way, I think there's a problem.
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Yet Hunters can literally throw two of their Melee attacks, and Blink Strike definitely matches range with 'Lock melee.
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Blink strike =5 meters. Base warlock melee = 6 meters.
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Those are CHARGED MELEES. Those aren't the default class melees. The warlocks increased range wasn't there because of a perk on a subclass, it was just given to them for free. Why should that be a thing? The argument to keep the range for warlocks is just as valid as if I made an argument to why I think titans melees should do more damage by default. Neither of these arguments make any sense, and neither would help the game.
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Editado por Fos Kuvol: 8/12/2017 6:55:57 PMThe default Melee range wasn't really the problem. The problems stemmed from Life Drain, Flame Shield, and the Thunderstrike perk that doubles range. So we are really arguing perks against perks here. In the case of Titans, their melee sucked. Hunters were fairly on par in D1. But have been nerfed in D2 quite noticeably.
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My point is, the warlock has no reason to have a higher melee range by default. If it has higher range with a charged melee then that's fine, because it's supposed to be better, but they shouldn't have more range for no reason.
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They should have done more to differentiate melee attacks, I feel Hunters should have had lunging, Titans should have had a near 180 degree forward swing, but with no lunge, and Warlocks should have had the range, but with a thinner radius and no "snap to target" auto aim.
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That would be fine. My argument is that warlocks shouldn't have a higher melee range as long as titans and hunters don't have anything either. If titans and hunters would get buffs to their non charged melees, warlocks would have a reason for the extra range. The way it is now, a warlocks uncharged melee beats a titan or hunters uncharged melee in every way. That shouldn't be the case.
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Titans melee hits the hardest and Hunters melee is faster than the other 2. That was why Warlocks had range. Now, we have nothing special about our base melee and he other 2 still have theirs.
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Titans melee did the same damage as all of the others. They all do 122 damage without charges. The melee attack speed is true, but it isn't nearly as significant as the range on the warlocks melee.
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So, should Hunter and Titans also be nerfed so their jumps are as bad as Glide? Cause thats where this sounds like it SHOULD be going.
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Glide isn't always bad. It has the most distance out of any jump, and if you use focused burst you can go just as fast as titan skating in Destiny 2 because titan skating was nerfed.
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Melee Range doesn't always matter either. That doesn't mean it didn't get nerfed. ;)
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How much it matters is irrelevant. If it matters at all it still should be fixed.
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Exactly. So all classes should have the same jump too then, because it matters sometimes. Oh and the same supers too. And the same perks. Cause if they are different, it will matter sometimes.
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The jumps have their own strengths and weaknesses. The warlock melee has no weaknesses, and titan and hunter melees have no strengths. If you think the warlock melee should have more range, you would need other classes to have strengths to their melees as well.
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[quote]Warlocks melee range should be the same as other classes. It's not at all fair for 1 class to have a significantly better melee without any negatives. It just doesn't make sense and isn't at all balanced.[/quote] You mean like the Titan shoulder charge which catapults you forward to hit or the Hunter throwing knife and smoke attacks that have the same range as a grenade.
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That's not a standard melee. Shoulder charge needs to charge up, and it was nerfed in year 3 so that its range wouldn't be nearly as far. If you use it now you would know that it doesn't have that much range anymore. The warlock melee range used to be higher than other classes in Destiny 1 without any perks to make it that way. It was extremely unfair to titan and hunter mains and it was one of the reasons that I switched to a warlock main in year 3.
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To say that the warlock melee range is too far you have to look at the whole picture. Titans have an extra ability (the shoulder charge). It may have less range than it used to but the range is still further than a "standard" melee. Hunters have throwing knives and smoke which have the same range as a grenade. Bladedancers also have a backstab that works from the front (rubber arms) if you jump before you hit. All had something, but only warlocks get their's taken away because people who only see a small part of the picture complain about it.
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Editado por PkmnGymLeader: 8/12/2017 6:37:18 PMThe thing is, warlocks melee range was higher than other classes by default. The other abilities you mentioned (shoulder charge, throwing knives) are special abilities. That gives them a reason to be better than a regular melee. Warlocks melee range wasn't activated by a perk in a subclass, it was just higher for no reason.
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Warlocks have extended melee, because warlocks are based around it. Every class has a superior aspect over other classes. Hunters have the superior supers, titans have superior speed and the superior ability to close the gap in a fight, warlocks have the best close quarter fighting capabilities. Every class excels in an area where other classes are generally weaker. Taking away the extended melee is neither a good thing nor a bad thing. The warlocks are now more reliant on supers in D2 than D1. We have gained better super game at the sacrifice of our neutral game.
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I think that all classes should have advantages with their abilities, but only in one area. I don't think that one class should have a melee that's better than others in every way, even if the other classes have something else to make them good. Your point is really good, and it makes a lot of sense, I just think that the game would be easier to balance if each category of combat is balanced individually. This would mean that melees would be the same strength overall, and so would other abilities such as supers. It wouldn't make them exactly the same, they would still have areas they shine. I just think that they shouldn't make an ability that's intentionally better than another just to balance a completely different ability. It could work the way you're saying, I just think it would work a little better this way. Let me know what you think about this. And please, lets keep this civilized.
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I see your point, but if every class is balanced to the same tier, then there would be no diversity. Class choices would then become a choice of cosmetics. People choose the classes based on how the class plays with the pros and cons of that class.
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Not entirely. Things such as grenades wouldn't always be cosmetic. Some grenades would be good for certain situations, and bad for others. They wouldn't necessarily be worse overall, they would just cater to a certain scenario or a certain playstyle. Balancing to the same tier doesn't always mean making them identical. It just means that overall, they would be equal. I said in another reply about this same topic that if they gave titans and hunters a special buff to their melees to make them good in different situations, they wouldn't need to remove the range of the warlocks melee. I just think that as long as other classes don't have anything special about their melees, warlocks shouldn't either.
