shotguns dominate .. you said it yourself. so,,, they are broken. they are overpowered in comparison to everything else

No. Overused==/== Overpowered. Shotguns are OVERUSED in the current meta, because Bungie made a conscious decision last year to raise the TTK of primary weapons, and to (in their minds) SLOW the pace of the game. So for over a year now, every primary weapon has essentially been nerfed into the ground for PvP play. The problem is that he first thing worked. Primary weapons are very weak. But the SECOND part didn't work. The game isn't slower...its just gotten faster and faster as more and more players master the game's movement abilities. So now you have a game where the primary weapons are so ridiculously underpowered, that they can no longer keep up with the speed of the game. TLDR: Shotguns are overused, because primary weapons are ridiculously underpowered, and all the YEar one and Year three maps PUSH people into Close Quarters fighting. There are NO NERFS to shotguns that will fix this. Nerf shotguns anymore and you might as well just remove them from the game entirely. They're little more than CLUBS right now as it is. The solution is that Bungie needs to realize that this primary weapon TTK is simply incompatible witht he game they've designed. They need to BUFF primaries to the point they kill FAST ENOUGH....so that there is FINALLY a disadvantage to running around spamming a shotgun. But until a shotgun warrior can't rely on being able to easily close to shotgun range whenever he gets caught OUT of range with that shotgun in his hands....you'll never fix this game's problems. No matter how many times you nerf shotguns (Nine times already) or how many times you try trestrict special ammo. Insanity is doing the same things again and again and expecting a different result.

you are literally describing a weapon being overpowered. also if you buff primaries you need to buff snipers , fusions and sidearms alongside it or nothing will change. shotguns will still dominate

No I'm not.. You need to go play Titanfall so that you can understand the difference between overused, and overpowered. In Titanfall(2). Shotguns have TWICE the range of shotguns in Destiny....when shotguns were at the height of the power. They are OHK weapons....and there is NO effort on Respawn's part to restrict their ammo or their use in anyway. If you want to run around and use a shotgun as your main weapon the game does NOTHING to prevent you from doing that. To compound the problem, Pilots move MUCH faster and more unpredictably than Guardians do. So Titanfall has a horrible shotgun spamming problem, right? WRONG. Because in Titanfall, Respawn has BALANCED the power of shotguns by having POWERFUL multi-shot ("primary") weapons. Their weapons are allowed to kill at a speed that can keep up with the speed at which players move. So anyone who wants to try to "shotgun warrior" in Titanfall----as you see everyday in the Crucible---is going to have one VERY rough go of it for several reasons. 1. The maps are large enough, and varied enough....that anyone running around out in the open is going to be engaged from rooftops and windows by longer ranged weapons...for which he is going to have NO reply ( Destiny maps are too small and too flat). 2. The multi-shot weapons kill fast enough to IMPOSE a range-related disadvantage on your shotgunner. This doesn't happen in Destiny. Catch me outside of shotgun range...and I can just run at you (skate, blink, shadestep) and be in shotgun range before any of the game's underpowered primaries can kill me. If I tried the same thing in Titanfall...I'd be DEAD before I got halfway to you. Two trigger pulls from that multi-shot weapon (as opposed to the 3-5 that Destiny demands) and I'm dead on the ground. 3. The greater power of "primary" weapons in Titanfall is able to impose a level of risk to the use of a shotgun or a sniper that Destiny does not. Which is why they are able to push these "power" weapons back into their proper roles as SITUATIONAL weapons....rather than the de facto primaries that they are in Destiny. IOW. You learn quickly that if youre going to run around with a Shotgun in Titanfall, you had either better be a certifiable bad ass.....or you'd better stay indoors and use it clear out rooms and clear off roof tops in CQC. You're going to be cannon fodder using it any other way. Likewise, run around with a sniper....then you'd better find a nice elevated spot to snipe from at a healthy distance from the game's multi-shot weapons. Or else you'r going to be padding someone else's K/D. That is what a balanced weapons system looks like and plays like. Shotguns are out of balance....buttheya re out of balance because Bungie made the game's primary weapons ridiculously weak in an effort to get the game to play like Halo. Despite the fact that Guardians move MUCH too fast for that approach to be reasonable or to work. Nerfs to shotguns won't fix this. Buffs to primary weapons and returning them to a credible threat to power weapon users....will.

..... this is ridiculous. you are basically describing "overpowered" and then denying it. you called them a club, but in comparison everything else is a squirt gun or foam bat. the club is OP by comparison. should it be nerfed? no. but everything else needs a buff. including snipers and fusions

If something is OP, the NERFING it fixes the problem. If a nerf can't fix it...then the TRUE problem lies somewhere else. Shotguns in this game have been nerfed more than any other weapon class in this game's history....and they are more of a "problem" today than they have ever ben. If something is UP, then BUFFING it fixes the problem. If a buff can't fix it...then the true problem lies somewhere else. Buffing primaries to the point where the can pose a genuine risk of DEATH to someone caught out of shotgun range WILL fix the problem. That risk does not exist in the game currently...and hasn't existed since the Great AR Nerf of 2015.....which started Bungie's campaign to raise TTK and "cool off" the game. Shotguns are not OP. Primary weapons are UNDERPOWERED....and the solution to the game's imbalance lies in fixing the game's primaries. Fortunately, it sounds like the Sandbox team is FINALLY starting to realize this.

lol if something is underpowered.... by comparison the other thing is overpowered.... that is like the textbook definition.... simple critical thinking there.... nerfs and buffs are the same thing from different perspectives also, if primaries are the issue why is it that the 3 other special types aren't performing nearly as well as shotguns? wouldn't they be dominant as well?

That argument works only if everything is relative....and it isn't. BALANCE is relative. POWER levels (and TTK) have an ABSOLUTE...and therefore OBJECTIVE....aspect. If there were no difference between nerfs and buffs...then you could solve the "shotgun problem" by nerfing shotgusn. But Bungie has been trying that for nearly 2.5 years without success. Because the reality is that you could nerf shotguns all the way down to being melee weapons, and you still wouldn't fix the problem. You'd just haver a CLUB that ran on special ammo...and they'd work the same way swords do right now. You'd still have a distance WELL OUT into hand-cannon and AR range....where someone armed with that thing could still close on you...and beat you do death with it....before you could kill them with a primary. Whereas a simple buff to primaries would allow you to kill before that player could close...and make him very warry about when and where he used the weapon. As for the other specials.....simple. 1. Sidearms don't because they aren't OHK weapons. They're basically hand cannons with a shorter range and less impact. 2. Snipers aren't...because Bungie basically found a way to BUFF primary weapons relative to snipers....without having to touch the TTK. FLINCH basically took the sniper's need for precision and used it against them. So the primary weapon user can neutralize a snper by simply making it impossible to fight back once he starts taking damage. So you get the same result. You create a disadvantage for the sniper rifle user, and it turns the weapon into a situational weapon. 3. Fusion rifles ARE working as well as shotguns....in the hands of people who actually know how to use them well. But the reason why FRs aren't dominating is because most people don't know how to use them. Since FRS aren't hit-scanned....you have to be VERY good at tracking and predicting an opponents movements. in order to allow for both charge up time...and travel time, while still hitting your target. Many vanilla players----like myself----learned these skills in the early days of the game when FRs were strong weapons. But complaints about "getting sniped across the map' by FRs....lead to a crippling set of nerfs. I call it the "Great AR Nerf" because ARs were the main victims of that catastrophic balance patch....but Fusion rifles were similarly taken over an KNEE, broken...and Bungie handing us back the pieces. But unlike ARs----which Bungie left in piece after they were broken----Bungie CONTINUED to keep torturing FRs after they were already nerfed to the point of uselessness (probably trying to rein in a Crucible-breaking Vex Mythoclast). That's the reason why "Nerf Fusion Rifles" is still a forum meme to this day. To the point Greg Peng had to ask us to finally stop bringing it up. Reminding them about how they continued to keep weakening a weapon class that was already broken and useless. Starting with Year Two though, they slowly and quietly started buffing FRs back. They became usable again with the dropping of TTK....and with by the mid year...with changes to the weapon system and new gear being introduced....FRs had quietly become viable again. Today...in the right hands....they are quiet strong. . But the problem is that weapons were so useless for so long, that many people who had the skills to use them let them get rusty....and TONS of people came to the game...and never bothered to acquire them at all. Trust me if peole were getting "vooped" out of supers as often as they were getting shotgunned or sniped. "Nerf Fusion rifles" would QUICKLY cease to be the punchline of its own joke.

also. fusion rifles are easy mode, for me they are easier to use than shotguns in 6s where everybody is terrible . but fusions aren't nearly as competitive as shotguns even in the best players hands. otherwise you would see them in sweats or tournaments.

getting sniped out of a super is the super users fault 99% of the time and luck the other 1% some supers like blade have a very rough time not getting shotgunned because they literally have to get into melee range to get a kill.. but for any other super getting shotgunned is your own fault. as for relativity, everything is relative, I don't know how you can say it isn't that doesn't even begin to make sense

Dude, I agree with everything you said, but ... this is the Destiny forum. You shouldn't waste good logic here. Everyone knows, if someone dies to a gun in Destiny and they don't use that gun then that gun is "OP'd" and needs to be nerfed. And, if someone kills you with a gun and you have the same gun, but with different perks then whatever perks aren't on your gun are "OP'd" and need to be removed.

I know. But I'm speaking more to Cozmo and the Bungie people reading this thread than to anyone else. I accepted long ago that the vast majority of people who post in places like this have NO real interest in a balanced game. They just want nerfs to make the game easier for them, and so that hey can WIN with their favorite class and favorite "toy".

That and Opionated Feelings don't mean the same as Fact and Logic Based Opinion. Right now I feel Op using Ether Nova and my Sunbreaker Guantlets. My Meta is about getting Vwoop kills and keeping my enemy toasty. Snipers love getting a Solar Grenade in the face. Make them move and I tap them with a high Accuracy HC There are so many different styles we can use, I'd rather see more guardians finding their own rather than see the popular style as problematic.

All I know is: Nerf fusion rifles.