[quote]Currently, Sunbreakers are one of the weakest and least used subclasses in the game, and there's no question as to why.[/quote] Pretty large assumption there btw. [quote]Gunslingers completely overshadow Sunbreakers in every single way. They have both a better super game and neutral game.[/quote] Absolutely not. Gunslingers get 3 shots, no damage resistance, no travel time, 12 seconds of super usage with only Circle of Life as a super duration boost, and an AoE that only activates on kill. They can get a second throwing knife, a reload speed buff on crit kill, or super range. They can get melee energy from ammo, super piercing abilities, or a stability buff from crit kill. Their melee can give more super duration, cause a burn, or refill immediately upon crit kill with it. Their grenades can be the phenomenal Incendiary Grenade, Trip mine, or Scatter grenade the only tracks if you walk into it. Their super can be more accurate, make AoE explosions on kill, or take a minute off recharge. Sunbreakers get between 5-7 hammers depending on how rapidly you throw them and which perks you take. You get upwards to 20 seconds of super energy while losing around 3 seconds instantly with each hammer throw. Every hammer creates an AoE that one hits non-supered guardians. The hammers fly fast enough to be unavoidable in close quarters while requiring some aim in medium range. They can choose between health regeneration on grenade kill, melee charge kill, super kill, or gaining an over shield in an AoE sunspot. Or use THE BEST neutral game perk in the game to get half regen time grenades and melee charge at the cost of their super. They can get tracking for their super (didn't work in the first place so no idea why they nerfed it) chain AoE from super kills, or get significant buffs to reload speed and agility on Grenade, Melee, or super kill. They get the phenomenal Incendiary Grenade (same as the Gunslinger btw) the sticky Fusion grenade, or the wall making thermite grenade which is pretty useless. Their melee can choose between weakening an enemy, creating a sunspot on kill, or regen their melee charge instantly on kill. Making a sunspot with the overshield perk or healing after melee kill then getting that charge back is awesome. In both cases, the survivability in CQC is pretty good. [quote]Sunbreakers have their entire subclass devoted to their super (besides the PvE perks), unlike the Gunslinger, which focuses on neutral game.[/quote] Both not true as shown above. Gunslinger gets gun buffs from precision kills. That's pretty much all the Gunslinger can buff on their own. While Sunbreakers can get healing on ability kills or an overshield, speed and reloading buffs on ability kills. Plus they both have Incendiary Grenades. [quote]Still, Golden Gun is better than Hammer of Sol and Sunbreakers have no where close to a decent neutral game to counter this.[/quote] In some aspects, the Golden Gun is better just like in some aspects the Sunbreaker is better. Supers have a specific area of expertise. Golden Gun has pure, unadulterated killing power but absolutely no survivability whatsoever. Sunbreakers get powerful hammers that take some aim and skill with some pretty damn good survivability. [quote]1. Buff the Thermite Grenade to kill in 2 waves of flames. This grenade is currently the most laughable in the game. Even if all 4 waves hit, it still won't net you a kill. The grenade can also easily be seen and avoided. This will slightly buff the Sunbreaker's neutral game.[/quote] I'm fine with this. Lightning grenades kill in 2 so no reason this can't. [quote]2. Fix the bugs with the Super and Melee modifiers. There have been countless times where I've landed a hammer or melee only for it to net me little or no damage. I'm not asking for buffs here, just for the modifiers to work as intended.[/quote] Don't make the mistake thinking Sunbreakers are the only subclass to suffer from hit detection. The proximity detonation bug needs to be fixed too. [quote]3. Flameseeker I understand hammers were overpowered, but the nerf to Flameseeker was just ridiculous and unneeded. Hammer tracking was horrendous to begin with when The Taken King launched. Now, you'll be lucky to even notice a difference in your hammer's initial direction. What I'm asking for here is to completely unnerf Flameseeker and to increase the speed of the hammers when choosing this node.[/quote] I like the increase in speed. Rather than tracking, I'd like to see this perk remove the arc similar to how Lance makes the Nova Bomb go in a straight line. [quote]4. Fleetfire This perk is decent, but it lacks in PvP. The Stormcaller's node Pulsewave has more speed then when this perk is stacked up to 3x, which isn't an easy fate in PvP.[/quote] I disagree, a single stack is noticeable and if you get 3 kills from HoS your pretty buffed by the end. [quote]5. Unnerf Cauterize Alright, bear with me. Currently, this perk is the go-to for Sunbreakers. Both this perk and the 55% damage reduction were nerfed in the update a while back. This combination of nerfs completely neutered the super game. I want to bring back both of these modifiers, BUT make it so you can never have both of them activated at the same time. More on that later.[/quote] Absolutely not. The 3 second cool down is so you can't go running through a team healing on every kill. Cauterize combined with the high lethality of the Hammers made for a too strong of a combo. [quote]6. Fire Keeper This perk is also lacking in PvP. Standing still in a Sunspot while having your super active is one of the least beneficial things you can do. Everyone is meanwhile running away from you. What I'm suggesting is that this perk grants 55% damage reduction in your super. Now, don't start freaking out. Let's think about this for a moment. Fire Keeper will pressure players to pick Scorched Earth instead of Forgemaster or Suncharge. This makes it even harder to net kills with hammers, but you will benefit with increased survivability. Also, both Cauterize and Fire Keeper are in the same tree so they can never both be active. And besides, even if they do pick Cauterize, you can kill them in one headshot with high impact snipers.[/quote] You gain an overshield from a sunspot which is usable outside of your super as well. And it's not like you can't move from sunspot to sunspot. It actually makes assaulting teams easier cause you limit their moving abilities while gaining a fresh overshield every time you enter one.

The sunbreaker should have everything improving its neutral game removed and just have its super game be the classes single focus

Doesn't the Hammer have the longest duration of any wandering Super?

Sunbreakers were supposed to be the equalizer for Titans. As a warlock and hunter mostly, I haven't ran from a Sunbreaker since the nerf. Supers are supposed to be super. Nerf the nerfs. @bungie #balance

My biggest issue is grenades and hit detection on super. Even using the sticky made it often just rolls off of the enemy if/when they jump (the easiest time to peg a guardian with a nade) the activation timing even is garbage for that grenade. Also tracking column is broken now, which I am ok with, since before the super was like having a max ammo truth 2-3x a round lol

I honestly can't tell if this is a joking post or not... First point, the gunslingers' grenades, throwing knife, and super are all very good. But their neutral game perks are GARBAGE. Circle of life? Scavanger? C'mon. Second off, I seen more Sunbreakers in Crucible than defenders, voidwalkers, and stormcallers. Their entire class is in a pretty solid spot right now. I've seen people who can use it to great success, you just need to actually be good at the game. And what, how many buffs did you suggest? Six? I'm pretty sure that's even more than the amount of nerfs it received. Changes like un-nerfing cauterize and buffing a grenade are completely un-needed. Other changes would result in a more broken subclass than we had before. TL;DR : Based on personal experience, Sunbreakers are still popular and viable in Crucible, and don't need said buffs. Also, props to you for voicing your opinion in a cohesive and intelligent way, and actually suggesting changes. Don't think for a second that I'm hating, I'm merely against your opinion. I respect it nonetheless.

Bump. #TitanMasterRace

Try sun charge, Come back and tell me its under-powered after you one-hit an armor of light titan.