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originally posted in: Looking for your PVP thoughts
Edited by Woooooooo: 9/9/2023 2:50:23 PM
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So few thoughts for consideration.......it's a long one so apologies! [u][b]1) Lobby Balancing[/b][/u] [b]Feedback[/b] - IMO this should be a priority focus across all PvP playlists. Poor lobby balancing is likely the root cause of a lot of issues and frustrations that players encounter, but it gets confused with things like SBMM or Fireteam Matchmaking. - The current lobby balancing isn't working as good as it could, especially when queuing solo, resulting in either two outcomes - either high skilled players end up feeling like they are having to carry the rest of the team or there is a complete miss-match in team compositions resulting in one team have little to no chance of competing from the outset. [b]Suggestion[/b] - Essentially improve lobby balancing so that team compositions are fair to all players across all playlists / game modes. [u][b]2) Crucible Playlists[/b][/u] [b]Feedback[/b] - The whole CBMM vs SBMM is a never ending debate that neither side will win, but I think both types of matchmaking have a place in PvP. - Quickplay should be the 'social' playlist, where players can kick back with friends, or jump in solo, and have [u]fun[/u]. It should be the place where people can try out different loadouts, weapons, game modes, whilst still enabling a level of 'farm' protection. If you get lobby balancing right you may have the opportunity to remove SBMM, as you'll still be able to deliver fair matches which was one of your original goals for this playlist. Removing SBMM without addressing lobby balancing would just put us back in the position we were in previously, where the outcome of the match was decided before a shot had even been fired and it didn't promote an increase in the total player base. - Competitive should be the place where players compete, test and hone their skills to gradually increase their Rank. Overall Comp doesn't feel like its in too bad a place at the moment as the majority of games feel fair, challenging but not unachievable if you play well, but I'd welcome a review of the points system and reward system [b]Suggestion[/b] - Simplify things and just have two main playlists - Quickplay (Social / Casual) and Competitive (Ranked). Keep the Rumble playlist (it's the only game mode where its every guardian for themselves) but remove the Rotator and Labs playlists, incorporating these game modes into either Quickplay or Comp (whichever is best suited). - [u]Quickplay[/u] - New game modes (i.e. relic) should be introduced straight into Quickplay. Sure they may not be polished, they may not work as intended, but Quickplay has the highest player count and playtime so its an ideal place to test these things and get useful data, without splitting the player base. - [u]Competitive #1[/u] - Simplify the points system, it's overly complicated (although I understand the original intent). It should be as simple of you win games, you earn points, you lose games, you lose points. You can still adjust the amount of points won or lost depending on what the expected outcome of the match, but this should be calculated at team level not individual player level. Again if you get lobby balancing right for those queueing solo it should be an issue - [u]Competitive #2[/u] - Improve the reward system. Players should have a chance to earn all comp weapons (Rose, Mecurial etc) for completing a game. You can still keep a guaranteed drop of the seasonal comp weapon after the first 3 games, but then it should open up. You'll need to give the loot pool of these weapons relatively small though otherwise it becomes an unnecessary grind....we've already got plenty of that [u][b]3) Trials[/b][/u] [b]Feedback[/b] - I'm not even sure where to start with Trials to be honest. Half of me says its time to just let Trials go, never to return, and focus on creating an awesome Competitive playlist, and the other half of me says its a great concept and with a bit of work it could be great again - When the changes to Trials were first announced I actually thought they sounded great and would actually have a positive impact. In practice though, for me, they missed the mark and they appear to have worsened the experience for a lot of players. - Since the changes were made the population of Trials has significantly reduced. I know the changes wont be the only cause, player burnout / end of season do contribute, but they will have contributed to it - It would be really interesting to see some in depth analysis and data on what effect the changes have had. [b]Suggestion[/b] - I hope Trials can be improved but the realist in me says its time to just let it go, so I'm going with that. Re-invest the time and resources into creating an absolute banger of a Competitive playlist [u][b]4) Radar[/b][/u] [b]Feedback[/b] - The lighting effects on some maps / areas makes it near impossible to see the radar, especially if you use default settings. Players shouldn't be forced to have to change their settings to various colourblind modes, which then impacts other elements of the games (engram / enemy rank colours) just to see the radar [b]Suggestion[/b] - Provide the ability for players to change the opacity of the radar and its colour scheme, independent from all other game settings. [u][b]5) Cheating / 3rd Party Hardware[/b][/u] [b]Feedback[/b] - I play on console so I don't experience the same level of cheating as those that play on PC do, but its clearly an issue where action needs to be taken a lot quicker than it currently is, or at least perceived to be. On console, there are still issues through players using 3rd party hardware. You can normally tell when you've been outplayed by a better player, but there are plenty of suspect players out there. [b]Suggestion[/b] - Follow through on your commitment to address the 3rd party hardware usage within D2 and communicate how many players have been banned for using these devices to show you're actually doing something about it, as at the moment it feels like it was just lip service. [u][b]6) PVP Data Analytics[/b][/u] [b]Feedback[/b] - Please, please, please share PvP data / insights with us more frequently, like you've done in past TWAB's / TWID's, like the ones from Jul-22, Nov-22 and Mar-23. - It's rich data, that I'm sure the PvP strike team will be analysing, but from a player perspective having access to this data is hugely beneficial. It helps us understand what's working vs what isn't and it enables us to continually provide data driven feedback on how things could be improved or change that helps the overall aim of the PvP strike team. [b]Suggestion[/b] [u][/u] - Firstly, actually tell players what their overall skill number is, and our skill numbers based on playlist (Quickplay vs Comp) and game type (trials, control, clash). Either in game or via the app is fine by me. You want players growth players can see and feel, providing this is enables this in a very simple way - Commit to publishing PvP data at the end of each season, or every 3 months, that shows the performance of things like; lobby balancing, expected match outcome, volume of mercy games / trials blowouts, average wait times, average playlist populations, playtime per plater, volume and % of players in the different skill brackets, weapon usage, weapon effectiveness etc, etc...and break this down into the different player skills brackets so we can see what the experience of each player tier is really like. Hope this helps.
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  • Good stuff! I'm glad you're even-handed and willing to advocate for adjustments, rather than just saying "Remove X, remove Y." I also appreciate the nice formatting! But, abandon no playlists. Trials included. No more giving playlists the Gambit treatment.

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  • Just to point out. The problem that people that play 20 hours a week had with lobby balancing was that the lobbies weren't balanced competitively they were balanced... the way they were. Still much better than sbmm though. Just hope the cbmm isn't the cbmm from summerish 2021 to last year when sbmm proper began. It's really much better sbmm than what it was before too. And the proof is that the population stayed as high as it did. Old sbmm would have been 200,000 on dt in pvp. I agree that there's a lot of potential with comp. If trials is really that past it's prime maybe that's okay. It had a long run and the game is very different now in terms of whether elimination is the best mode for competition given that guardians are more able than ever to eliminate large numbers of things quite easily. Trials shouldn't go anywhere though. Maybe it should actually keep going in the direction of being a trial. Just with a significant change to the game type(s) and thinking about doing something drastic with the card system. There's things that can be done to that mode to really make it a pvp players paradise. Especially if comp is going to stay strategy exclusive and people are going to want the cbmm in quickplay to optimally balanced.

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  • Shouldn't the playlists that are geared towards "casuals" use SBMM? Especially when there is no penalty for losing and no incentive to win

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  • About the casual playlist. I would strongly advice that it should be freelance. It's far from casual when a six stack "just having fun with friends" enter the lobby.

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  • I'd still suggest having fireteam based matchmaking to avoid that issue. Whilst it can still happen (6 stack vs 6 solo's) it's not a common occurrence, it's just a horror show when it does. I'm not a fan of freelance playlists as they split the player base into different pools which increases issue with wait times etc.

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  • The casual list could be freelance only and the competitive could be for teams.

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  • Great post!

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