You have to remember that with VOG worlds first, people were still gettiny used to the idea of a consol FPS raid. I mean it was the first real raid on a consol (borderlands 2 had 'raids', but they were not raids in anything appart from name). Also the race to Worlds first was HIGHLY competative and most teams did not broadcast on twitch and every team had to figure out the mechanics for themselves. By contrast 9 out of the top 10 worlds first teams for kings fall were broadcasting on twitch, with many viewers jumping between streams when one team figured out a particular mechanic. I mean the Woblers (kings fall worlds first finishers) were told by their chat that Ayyy LMAO (Verses the stream's team) had gotten all the way to Oryx, nearly killed him then Oryx jumped back up and wiped them. Because of this information, Gothalion and his team were able to kill oryx first as they were prepared for oryx's final clap even though they had never actually seen him do it before. Due to this sharing of information and the twitch community, the raid was finished MUCH faster that it would have been without the information sharing. Datto was about an hour behind the world first VOG completion and it took him about 16 hours. When he broadcast his worlds first kings fall raid attempt, he did not listen to chat, did not watch other streamers or anything like that as he wanted a pure blind raid experience. He finished the raid in about 12-14 hours. I do personally feel that the Kings fall raid is the better raid. Mechanically and from a design and fun perspective. However, I agree with you that the loot is just.... awful. You have a low chance of any loot dropping, and only a 1 in 10 chance that the loot will drop at max light, and it seems to be weighted at 300 light for normal and 310 for hard. You also have to remember how light levelling was in year 1. You would loose 33% damage at 1 level below your targets. 52% at 2 levels, and leveling in year 1 was horrible (it's still pretty bad now but it was a LOT worse). By comparison, now being a 295 will do 85% as much damage to a 300 light level target. And getting to light level 295 without doing the raid was relativly easy, just time consuming. Teams who finished in the top 10 were mostly streamers who play the game 12+ hours a day. 3 out of the 6 worlds first team did at least 1 24 hour stream in the 3 days before the raid released. Full time destiny streamers did not really exsist a year ago. I love VOG, but I prefer Kings fall. Mainly because I think that the conflux and oracles sections go on for far too long and can get very boring considering you are basically just in the same area killing the same enemies over and OVER again. I agree that the crota raid is not even in the running. I have sharpered 5 people throught that raid at a time as I could solo the raid. Kings fall, you could take 1-2 people through who didn't know what they were doing, but you would need a SOLID team to do that.