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6/22/2017 12:13:01 AM
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Destiny 2's weapon system: Reality vs Perception

So ever since the DRE reveal, there has been a lot of talk about the new weapon system. There have been many posts claiming it will limit play and many more claiming that all these changes are the result of PvP. I understand players are concerned about such a big change, particularly without the context of having had a chance to actually try it out yet in the confines of Destiny 2. With all that said, I have played it and of everything I experienced playing the D2 PvE, the new weapon system was hands down my favorite change to the game and I'm not alone. Mercules904 (who's probably the preeminent weapon tester in the game) said when asked what it's like going back to D1 after playing D2 [quote]It's painful to me, actually. I never realized how much nicer it is not having special weapons all the time. D1 feels broken after D2[/quote] Now I know there was good reason within the D1 PvP experience to make these changes in D2. Weapon balancing was a shit-show as Bungie were never able to figure out a way to evenly balance out a system in which 2 of our 3 weapon slots were capable of OHKs. Ironically what is generally perceived as the best era in D1 PvP was the House of Wolves when DoTs mattered and served as a natural counter and suppressor to OHK weapons. We all witnesses the spiral out of control of specials and heavy after Dots were destroyed to where ammo nerfs were used as last ditch stopgaps. We all know the frustration amongst the community with Fusion Grenades. D2 PvP will certainly benefit from all OHK capable weapons being classed together and lead to a hopefully much easier system to balance (which by default will lead to a more stable game overall), but to paint that as the only reason for making the change is simply false. These changes were made with as much or more thought to PvE than they were PvP and again, having played it, I found the system to not only offer more interesting choices of loadouts, but just a much more fun and diverse play experience. One of the quotes about D2 I have issue with is [quote]Special and Heavy are fun. Those are going away at a rate of 50%[/quote] Well here is the hard truth behind that reality. They aren't being used much in PvE anyway so 50% of a fraction of kills changes what? I wanted to get an idea of how Primary, Special and Heavy weapons are actually used by players in Destiny 1 PvE so I did some research and found some interesting numbers. I reached out to Jay at Destinytracker to try to see if there's a way to get aggregate numbers across time periods, but for now I pulled the kill percentages by weapon class in each PvE activity on the most recent day those stats were available 6/3/2017 Here's are the kill percentages by activity for overall weapon class as well as detailed by weapon subclasses for that day. [url=http://i.imgur.com/UVrxpg9.jpg]Story overview[/url] [url=http://i.imgur.com/LJVBlp6.jpg]Story detail[/url] [url=http://i.imgur.com/oHbW3Zr.jpg]Strike overview[/url] [url=http://i.imgur.com/hMmKvLe.jpg]Strike detail[/url] [url=http://i.imgur.com/vinDkhZ.jpg]Raid overview[/url] [url=http://i.imgur.com/xNamf7B.jpg]Raid detail[/url] [url=http://i.imgur.com/xNamf7B.jpg]Patrol overview[/url] [url=http://i.imgur.com/y8H0Sja.jpg]Patrol detail[/url] Now these numbers are from a single day, but spread over weeks and months, the numbers are pretty consistent and what becomes clear is that by making this change to the weapon system, Bungie is allowing us greater use of the weapons we use most. (It's also pretty clear why MGs are going away as well) The reality of Destiny PvE is that Primary weapons are the lion's share of our kills and situations that dictate special and heavy weapons generally can be approached using either. The other reality (and the numbers back it up) is that we spend the majority of PvE sitting on special and heavy ammo until those specific situations arise. Destiny 2 is not Destiny 1. Yes it's still Destiny, but everything has evolved including mission and strike structure. Granted we only played an abridged first mission and one strike, but it's enough to see that it's its own game. The fights are more dynamic. There are more enemies on screen to contend with and we have more options at our disposal to fight those enemies with. In Destiny 1, I sit on my special and heavy ammo and use each vary sparingly. In D2 I was constantly swapping between my Pulse Rifle and Hand Cannon during the strike and whichever power weapon I had, I found I used more frequently because there were always bricks dropping and with just the one power slot vs D1's two, it actually encouraged using it more and not holding it for specific situations. Again this is my experience with D2 and yours might be completely different, but until you've had the opportunity to unload an Auto Rifle and instead of reloading, swapping to an SMG to keep burning through enemies, it's hard to look at the changes and really understand or appreciate how much they actually open up play and make encounters more diverse. The last thing I will add is that again, to all this talk that Destiny 2 is all about PvP and PvE is just an afterthought being dictated by PvP balancing... We haven't scratched the surface of what PvE will offer. We've seen half a story mission and a strike. We haven't seen the larger worlds yet, the Patrol missions, the Lost Sectors, the Flash Points, the updated public events, D2s take on PvE arenas, Quests and Bounties. We don't even know the progression systems or economy. So I understand speculation and I understand concern, but I do not accept that D2 is primarily a PvP experience and I don't agree it should keep D1's weapon system. D1 is an incredibly fun game but also one pretty broken in many ways and it manages to succeed in spite of it's faults. What I experienced with D2 was better across the board and I can't wait for everyone to get the opportunity to judge it for themselves.
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  • No, I think you're being too optimistic and kind towards Bungie right now. It's no secret that the biggest problem in any strike or raid is the boss is a giant bullet sponge with crota and oryx being the 2 exceptions. The combination of a heavy and special weapon is the way you deal with this. So far in Destiny 2 we've seen a single strike and as of right now that boss has the same issue of being a giant bullet sponge as every boss we've seen so far. The complete lack of good decision making and giving us another less powerful weapon then making us only have one powerful weapon in the power slot is going to make it a lot more time consuming and annoying to deal with. Unless other bosses and the potential raid bosses are made to have actual mechanics and not just be bullet sponges we will just see what destiny 1 would've been like without the special/heavy weapon slots both bring available. The change was completely sanctioned around PvP as the main complaint in PvP was 1 hit kills or no one ever using primaries. Instead of coming up with a real solution to the problem Bungie just removed the special slot completely and said "there now you can't use a special weapon" and on top of that making it to where snipers, fusion rifles, and shotguns have to compete with the new grenade launchers and rocket launchers? Those snipers better be hitting harder than they ever have and shotguns better be incredible otherwise you're never going to see them. Overall the weapon changes are a step in the wrong direction. Your "weapon tester" obviously hasn't done much endgame because those are the parts where the current weapon system is brought into perspective on how much it's needed. Here are the current most used/most viable weapons for each raid boss encounter in the special and heavy slot: Templar- Sniper + Rocket/Sleeper Atheon- Sniper + Sleeper Deathsinger- Shotgun + Sword Crota- Doesn't apply to dps on crota but a Ghorn is best in slot for downing him and an argument can be made for snipers to keep a single boomer knight on each tower down. Warpriest- Sniper + Sleeper Golgoroth- Sniper (Spindle) + Machine Gun for knocking the orb down. Oryx- Sniper for ogres + Sleeper for staggering oryx. Keep in mind the only person that SHOULD be using a touch of malice is the runner due to immunity to damage. It's not a viable choice for anyone else after the change to how it performs with blessing of light and the argument for the glitch where you can keep armor of light with the touch isn't valid here. Vosik- Sniper + Sleeper, Shotgun + Sleeper, Sniper + Sword Aksis- Sniper + Dark Drinker, Sniper + Rocket (must have field scout, tripod, and cluster bombs), Sniper + Sleeper Imagine doing any of these encounters with one of those options replaced with a scout, smg, hand cannon, sidearm, or any other primary. It wouldn't make sense and in that strike we saw gameplay for it looks like bosses won't be changing much. It's just an artificial difficulty change to force us to take longer to kill bosses.

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