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Editado por Corrick II:
2/1/2020 8:08:40 AM
38
D1 raids had a superior balance between gunplay and mechanics, and there was still the opportunity for clutch saves.
D2 has unforgiving mechanics that require coordination between all members of the team. While that allows everyone to be a part of the “victory”, it also means any failure is a wipe and no one is a hero, just an anonymous piece of the puzzle.
Bungie forgot what inspires players and it doesn’t seem like they really care to remember, which is a shame.
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D2 raids aren't for those that have an attention span of a pea.
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Is this a normal thing, feeling like you need to put people down just to feel good about yourself? I hope it's worth it, it's pretty sad, especially over a video game.
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I'm not putting anyone down. The mechanics are simple, I'm merely stating how people that cannot focus will not be able to raid.
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Editado por Corrick II: 2/3/2020 12:33:49 AMFair enough. And what I’m saying is that no matter how simple the mechanics are (which I agree with you once you get the hang of them they’re fine), one random who just isn’t getting it can make the entire raid miserable. The problem is there are way more opportunities for a random to screw up and no forgiveness for that like there was in the D1 raids. Wanting to be a raider and not having regular players to play with sucks anyway, but it REALLY sucks in D2.
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Clutch saves definitely. Now one or two person dies and it’s pretty much a wipe. There is definitely no last man standing saves anymore.
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[quote]Clutch saves definitely. Now one or two person dies and it’s pretty much a wipe. There is definitely no last man standing saves anymore.[/quote] What kind of raids are you doing? If one or two people die on my team, we revive them. We have 6 revive tokens for a reason.
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Editado por SMOKEY D 7: 2/1/2020 11:21:30 PMYeap, I remember carrying shitty players for their raid completions in d1, and in D2 that isn't possible. So basically you suck, can't be carried anymore. Got it, move a long.
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Awww. Feel better? I bet you feel better.
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[quote]D1 raids had a superior balance between gunplay and mechanics[/quote] What mechanics? Shoot stuff as you wait?
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This isnt true. VoG and CE were all about shooting and waiting, barely any mechanics. And most of the mechanics you could cheese, so many people didnt even learn them. Mechanics didnt really start to become a thing until KF. That is the raid that has been the blueprint/foundation for every raid since, hence the reason d2 raids are the way they are. Which are more gunplay/mechanic balanced. Also, you still can have clutch moments in d2 raids. There was one in a GoS raid i did this week. The only difference between d1 and d2 raids is it does take a total team effort for d2, where as in d1 you could 3-5 man most raids.
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[quote]D1 raids had a superior balance between gunplay and mechanics, and there was still the opportunity for clutch saves. D2 has unforgiving mechanics that require coordination between all members of the team. While that allows everyone to be a part of the “victory”, it also means any failure is a wipe and no one is a hero, just an anonymous piece of the puzzle. Bungie forgot what inspires players and it doesn’t seem like they really care to remember, which is a shame.[/quote] D2 raids are not complex. In fact, the most complex raid they’ve ever made is considered the best raid by the majority of the raiding community. Raids are supposed to be unforgiving and an easy activity where you can make dozens of mistakes.
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Another person who thinks people mean “hard” when “complex” is a perfectly justifiable description. Yes, raids are meant to be challenging, but they’re also meant to be fun. And yes, D2 raids absolutely do rely on more complex mechanics and coordination than other raids overall. Saying they don’t doesn’t make it so, it just means you’ve gotten used to them and are fine with the systems.
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[quote]Another person who thinks people mean “hard” when “complex” is a perfectly justifiable description. Yes, raids are meant to be challenging, but they’re also meant to be fun. And yes, D2 raids absolutely do rely on more complex mechanics and coordination than other raids overall. Saying they don’t doesn’t make it so, it just means you’ve gotten used to them and are fine with the systems.[/quote] D2 raids aren’t complicated at all. Kings fall is the most complex raid and it’s the best. If you want brain dead shooting, raids aren’t for you. Go do 1 of the many other activities in the game then.
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Id say last wish is more complex, I'm never doing that last fight legit
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[quote]Id say last wish is more complex, I'm never doing that last fight legit[/quote] That’s probably the only complex part. Seeing how the cheese strat exists, I don’t see a point to counting it though.
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Last Wish is pretty complex if you have people who aren't sure what they are doing. At least on Shuro Chi and Riven for sure.
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[quote]Last Wish is pretty complex if you have people who aren't sure what they are doing. At least on Shuro Chi and Riven for sure.[/quote] That could be said about pretty much anything. Takes one guide video to figure out the mechanics for last with and you’re good. Same for every other raid in destiny from VoG to GoS. Spire is the only one that you might have to watch twice.
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Shuro Chi gets pretty crazy and if you are doing Riven legit that would be tough. Honestly while mechanically simple the heart run is a pain to me. There are plenty of raids I ran the first time and didn't have a problem. But Last Wish, some of the encounters, was a bit of a pain. I think Crown and Spire are the worst in terms of being unforgiving though. They were also made by the same studio. I won't say it was better than VoG but I genuinely have alot more fun on SotP than VoG. SotP just feels like a more condensed, fun filled version of VoG in some ways.
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Shiro is basically just make a kill adds, make a triangle, shoot boss, kill adds, make triangle, shoot boss, simple puzzle, repeat. That’s about as complex as raid encounters have ever gotten. As for Riven, there’s no reason to do it intended way. SotP beats VoG in design, but not in loot. The D2 raid design is far better than what VoG and Crota had. It’s just missing the loot. I think going back to static rolled raid weapons and have them be like ritual weapons would be best. Maybe they could speak to both sides though and make random rolls drop after the curated roll is obtained. It would also be nice to be able to pull curated rolls from collections like what you can do with ritual weapons.
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Oh I hear ya. If SotP had a good lot table I would run that thing most weeks just for fun. The platforms on Shuro chi are awful if you aren't coordinated. One guy doesn't kill a phalanx so he boops two people off platforms and you have to scramble and sort out who is jumping on what while the other people are taking DoT during it. It sucks if not run perfectly. One of the least forgiving raid encounters around. I'd take Val Caur any day over that
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[quote]Oh I hear ya. If SotP had a good lot table I would run that thing most weeks just for fun. The platforms on Shuro chi are awful if you aren't coordinated. One guy doesn't kill a phalanx so he boops two people off platforms and you have to scramble and sort out who is jumping on what while the other people are taking DoT during it. It sucks if not run perfectly. One of the least forgiving raid encounters around. I'd take Val Caur any day over that[/quote] Scourge does a good job with its raid exotic though. Anarchy is by far my favorite raid exotic. It’s a shame they didn’t develop a ToM/Outbreak/Divinity style quest for it. Other than anarchy the raid only has armaments, the shotgun, the sparrow and maybe the scout. The armor is meh and the other weapons are meh. D2 definitely needs to step up its raid loot. The thing with Val Caur is that the stairs will often kill you when falling back to the ground. Definitely the hardest raid mechanic right there.
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I agree with ya. I didn't know about the stairs in val caur though. I must have been lucky
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[quote]I agree with ya. I didn't know about the stairs in val caur though. I must have been lucky[/quote] Hit those stairs at the right angle and you instantly die. Makes for a real awkward conversation when you tell your teammates the stairs killed you.
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Heh dang so it is like being on the right in void for leviathan. Sometimes the game just decides you die.
