Ah yes. Tell me more about your ability to live on $9,089.60 a year with your ideal minimum wage.

Don't get me wrong, capitalism is great. Very good at creating efficient industry, innovation, allowing consumer choice, ect. But as we hit the point of practical post scarcity and peak automation, we're going to have to seriously rethink our system.

When people here are arguing that minimum wage should not be livable, yet they don't complain that soldiers in the military earn less than minimum wage. The priorities of this forum, I swear.

See THIS is why i love the US. When times get tough you realise... well atleast i'm not in the US!

When the minimum wage was first created when the cost of living was much less than it is today. Most people didn't drive cars. Most people grew their own food. The cost of living changes based on all types of factors and that'd have bee pretty evident to you if you had actually looked into reality instead of being you. Go try to live in New York City on a federal minimum wage. You'd -blam!-ing die. If anything this thread shows your lacking in comprehension of a maco level economy. The cost of living is a variable. It is not constant. The wage should be ever changing to match the cost of living (the original intent) and not to tied to an ever changing variable as if it's always constant. http://www.dol.gov/featured/minimum-wage/mythbuster Please actually live in reality like the rest of us, but hey we know Cruz supports are all bat shit insane so whatever.

The job I have lined up after I graduate college will pay 36k a year. After spending over $1,000 a month for rent, all of my insurances, all other bills, and saving up for grad school, I will still have trouble. Minimum, while it shouldn't be used as a career, should be higher than 7. 25(what it is where I live).

*looks with sheer disbelief at his computer screen*. The Bernie Sanders flu really has infected this country as much as the Trump virus. *slowly puts his face in his right hand as a gradual face-palm*. [i]This[/i] is where you are wrong. You are claiming that raising minimum wage [i]does not[/i] have any effects to the [i]economy[/i] and only benefits people. Here's how it works: according to the general rule of supply and demand (hopefully you were paying attention in school for this one to know what it is, but then again knowing that you're a Bernie-head, you would probably say: "corporate corruption!!"), the more accessible a certain currency is, the more the prices will rise, as the value of the currency decreases the more it becomes accessible. For example, consider the economic disaster of the Spanish Empire in the seventeenth and eighteenth centuries. The more gold they stole from the oppressed natives in Central America, the less value gold possessed in Spain (and eventually all of central and western Europe, as they traded with many nations in Europe at the time), as gold was flooding the upper class and eventually the middle and lower classes. As a result, inflation skyrocketed because of all the gold (that was afterward almost useless) that infested the entire economy; everyone suffered for it (what they should have done was to keep it all locked somewhere or have a gold standard, but that's another story). Anyway, my point is, something will lose value to people the more common it is. Take (I know, I know) Uncommon or Rare armor in Destiny as another example. At the very beginnings, these armor variants were always a pleasant surprise to encounter. However, when you got up to higher levels of experience and Light, they evolved into practical junk that you only find useful as armor scraps; they are so weak [i]and[/i] common, they lost significance, as you think: "Oh, I can just kill twenty or so enemies to get another Rare engram". The same applies here. The more common something becomes, the less people will value it (as it becomes easier to obtain and they do not have to worry as much as securing it), so the value itself decreases soon afterward; it's only paper money after all (at least in the U.S., and I know it's not [i]exactly[/i] paper), so that just makes it all the more susceptible to this effect. Raising minimum wage would not do much in an economic crisis, as it would only make it worse if it has to do with the decrease in value of money (I'm not saying I know the solution to these problems; I'm only pointing out what would make them worse).

D4T5 N0T H0W 3C0N0M1C5 W3RK

No. Minimum wage should be adjusted per state as the median average cost of living (since some counties are going to cost more than others) divided by 2080 hours. (40 hrs × 52 weeks) And adjusted for inflation annually. Along side this government aid should be cut back. If government aid pays out enough to average more than minimum wage across 40 hours it becomes more benificial to sit on your ass. This is how we move the economy. The market would fluctuate wildly for about six months before buyers and retail settled out. After that we could get back to actually having a strong middle class.

Problem solved: let's build robots that can do everything else a 16 year old burger flipper or a 50 year old illegal maid can do and not pay them. Japan already has hotels and restaurants staffed by robots. American can kill two birds with one stone. Oh, yeah, I forgot. Robots are for nerds and geeks.

Show me someone nowadays that can live off of $4.37 per hour.

So, the middle class has been in the decline since the 70s. As has real buying power for the middle and lower classes. What's your point again?

We over here on the left use the last point at which minimum wage was behaving as it should to further our point. You on the other hand pick and choose a date in which minimum wage was as low as possible to further yours. [b]EDIT:[/b] Oh, look at what happened to the average CEO's pay during the same time span: http://www.essayscam.org/Forum/shared_files/storage/main/ceo-vs-average-worker-pay.png This graph doesn't do the statistic justice as it crunches towards the top, but the point still stands. Edit 2: Mfw he doesn't reply cus he knows he lost; ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Everyone arguing for raising it needs to remember its a minimum wage not a living wage. Why should a 16 year old cashier make a living wage?

[b] [/b]

I was reading an article about the CEO of Carl's Jr/Hardee's. He was saying they're testing automation and heading in that direction. He said they won't be able to afford higher wages along with health care. He made a very good point. What is the viability of raising minimum wage if more people will be unemployed. To me, minimum wage jobs are for high school kids, college kids and bored seniors. If you want to make a career out of it, that's on you. I worked in restaurants and grocery stores from 15-19/yrs old. I foolishly dropped out of college. I wanted/needed more money. Delivered pizzas for a year and a half making $8-$14/hr. Wanted benefits so went to $10/hr factory. I left there went to another factory for $14/hr. I got laid off from there making $17.93/hr. Found a warehouse job starting at $18.50/hr. I got laid off from there in December making over $24/hr. I have an interview for a factory job that pays $15 for temp but doubles if they keep you on. There are plenty of jobs that pay well. Even though I'm stuck working factories, I've always strived to make the most money from that life. I've learned that the more money you're paid at a factory, the less you do. I killed myself at the $10 factory.

Because $4.37 is [i]totally[/i] a livable wage where a person could support their families, and rent at the bare minimum a one bedroom apartment. I'd also like to hear where you got your math from, because with the way you're saying it, I could say something like, "If minimum wage trended with inflation over time, the real minimum wage would be only $0.99!" Numbers without sources always screams out bullshit until the person making the point proves otherwise.

Except if u try to work min wage in a place like nyc or san francisco its impossible to live off od that. Cost of living is a factor too.

Since people seem to like to discuss snapshots in a moment of time I'll do my own. In 1959 a bottle of coke could be bought for a nickel(yes I know coke was a nickel for about 70years because of one bad business decision, but this is not the history of coke, its a comparison of the dollar) .05 to 1.29 (haven't bought in awhile but I remember paying that, if its more it only adds to my point) thats almost a 2480% increase while minimum wage was one dollar (a dollar then a adjusted for inflation would be 8 dollars now) 1 to 7.25current minimum wage has only increase 625% The buying power of the dollar has significantly decreased. To me there should be no such thing as minimum wage, its a stupid idea. Any business that cant properly provide for its employees is not a business but a sponge on society. Look at walmart, the largest employer, largest maker of money, and has more employees per quota on welfare than anyone else. The tax payers make their business model work. Fyi the current employee model did not come from the goodness of a rich mans heart. It stems from slavery, it came down to how can I have slaves but not have to provide housing and food, lookup corporate townships. People fought hard for how the average American can live today. We should all strive and work towards a utopia, even if its impossible, it will make the world a better place. "The average person thinks about the picture while I think about the camera" Vanilagorila Edit: sorry for all the post. Long time toilet gawker never thought I'd reply to anything but im on vacation and its raining and I've been drinking.

It should be raised, but both slowly and slightly. For example, raising it to roughly 9$ over the span of 5-6 years. 1) Prices won't necessarily rise. Consumerism is still a factor, and everyone is perfectly capable of not buying a product. 2) #1, however, has a hole in it. Industries and companies that have been built upon the minimum wage, like Walmart, will inevitably raise their prices. So yes, inflation will occur; however, U.S. citizens are already footing the bill as is. Many/most of Walmart's employees are currently on welfare. I would prefer paying for that increase on my own dollar rather than through tax money.

Average cost of buying car car between 1938 and 2015 increased by 4096%. Average cost of buy a home between 1938 and 2015 increased by 8738%. Between 1938 and 2015, minimum wage only rose by 2900%. Working a 40 hour week 52 weeks a year in 1938 grossed you $520 yearly. A year and a half and you can fully buy the average car. After 7.5 years you can fully buy a house.* *Obviously this is running under making the gross and not spending any. Working a 40 hour week 52 weeks a year in 2015 grosses you $15,080. $11,880 is the poverty line for an individual in the US. You barely beat it out. It then takes over two years to buy the average car. Most opt to buy used these days which results in higher costs as those cars are in less-than-prime condition. And you really shouldn't even think of ever owning a house. This doesn't even bring up the fact the middle class itself is dying out. The disparity between the average income between the middle and upper class is the largest it has ever been. But, you know, having anyone to actually support the economy on decent wages would make way too much damn sense.