[quote][b]Planet Destiny[/b]: There’s a lot of interest and focus on PvP, so there’s a lot of really good questions and ideas being floated around on the community. So where do you go if you’re the community right now and you want to… you have a cool idea for a playlist or you want to help influence what’s going on, where do you go to read that stuff? Where do you see that influences you? [b]Leif Johansen[/b]: Oh man, I’m on like Destiny Reddit like twice a day. I try to catch people like, if that stuff gets upvoted, I see it for sure and it gets kicked around. And I know the other designers do that as well. Uh I mean, I use the Bungie forums as well but honestly I have a little bit of a harder time sorting through it trying to find the gems. Um, it’s… [b]PD[/b]: I understand that! (lots of chuckles all around) [b]PD[/b]: They don’t have the best interface on there for navigating [b]LJ[/b]: It’s crazy because like an ideal start is one very specific thing, but once it’s gotten kicked around you know… Bungie, it comes out in another incarnation that you wouldn’t expect. We’re lucky that you know, people care that much that they’re pitching ideas. I’ve read some pretty sick stuff on both forums actually and it’s tough because PvP it might be one very specific piece of tech that we need to do that and immediately that like, well now we need to make it bigger. You know if we’re going to be associating tech with it. Like if there’s a specific scope for the mode it’s associated with. Like you can’t have this mismatch where it’s fairly easy for the designers to make a pretty decently sized experience, but it comes with a huge engineering cost with it and you’re like, if we’re spending that, we might as well just go bigger. The machine is always unpredictable in that sense. [b]PD[/b]: It’s a rabbit hole [b]LJ[/b]: yeah[/quote] Came across this today and I find it pertinent to share with this community since we are all here everyday talking, debating and sharing ideas on making this game great again. Unfortunately, the thought and passion that you put into your posts here on Bungie's forums are apparently looked at with a degree of disdain by Bungie themselves. It's not something we all haven't known for quite awhile now (and this obviously excludes Cozmo, who left Reddit to come here and tries like hell to keep us in the loop), but to hear a Dev say that they and their fellow Devs prefer Reddit comes as no shock. What I found interesting was the reasoning that it's hard to find gems on the Bungie forums, because doesn't Bungie.net work just like other forum sites in which liked posts get upvoted and trend to where Bungie can see what topics are popular? That's were everything becomes convoluted. For those who've been here, it's dark history. For those who are newer to the game and community, it's a story of "Algorithms" Over the course of year one, there were many topics that took over the forums. From locked out content, to vault space, to optional matchmaking, to weapon balance, there were many posts that generated hundreds of likes and in some cases thousands. Unfortunately the only place those posts existed was the "new" tab. Some of us suspected censorship with popular hot stove topics being kept from Trending and Highest Rated. Bungie (after enough of an uproar built about it) claimed it was algorithms. Then suddenly it became possible to remove any post from both Trending and Highest Rated simply by giving it a single dislike. Eventually Bungie corrected that, but at the same time, they disabled the Favorites tab for a month. When posts weren't able to Trend or be Highest Rated, the only way to participate in popular discussions and find them was to like them and search them on the favorites tab. When Bungie disabled the Favorites Tab because in their words it was "causing headaches", within 2 weeks it had killed off every popular post they didn't like. Intentional? Who knows, but it definitely was convenient. Now the new Favorites tab has a limit to how far back it goes. So the more posts you like, eventually you won't be able to go back and find ones you had thought important. I understand why Bungie did this. They were tired of seeing posts on topics they didn't want to address top the forums for weeks and months, so they changed how the system works. Of course this is censorship, but it's censorship they could pass off as maintenance. Which bring us to the forums that exist today that Leif feels are difficult to "find gems" on. My response would be to ask where he is looking, because there are awesome posts that are liked and bumped daily on here and they can easily be found on both the "new" and "trending" tabs. Knowing Bungie though, they browse the forums and don't want to be bothered with topics that might sting or ask for things like matchmaking which they despise, so they've given their Devs a guilt free bastion of watered down feedback with the Highest Rated tab. Go search it right now and show me where the hot button topics are. No offense to anyone on page one of Highest Rated, but it's a cross sections of general posts. Go see how far you have to dig to find this gem by[b] Kabr[/b] https://www.bungie.net/en/Forum/Post/190932707/0/0 I'm sure most of you saw this gem by[b] H TOWN BALLA 80[/b] addressing Mr Parsons https://www.bungie.net/en/Forum/Post/188868653/0/0 Certainly can't see why Bungie wouldn't want this on Highest Rated by WakeyBake https://www.bungie.net/en/Forum/Post/190972689/0/0 I point these out because I've known for a long time that I'm on a list at Bungie and my posts cannot go up on Highest Rated (and if they do they can't stick), but I want people to understand that it's not just me. It's all of us who come here everyday that have formed this community bond and who still try to hold out hope for what this game could be. You only need to go to page 3 of Highest rated before you start getting to posts that haven't been bumped since last November and yet they're above the 3 I linked and the ones I linked have more likes. But a post with 105 likes from November asking for Shaders to have a preview (yes, I'm serious) is page 3 of Highest Rated for the Devs to read. Yeah Leif, no shit you can't find gems if that's where you're looking. I'm sure Bungie will say there's another gremlin in the algorithms, yadda, yadda, yadda. And again, I mean no disrespect to Cozmo because he is awesome and everyone should wish we had more like him at Bungie, but the overall approach that Bungie have had with this forum community since launch has been pathetic and all the vitriol and toxicity that exists is a direct result of their treating us as second class citizens to the Reddit, YouTube and Twitch communities. Hell, even twitter is the place to go for news before finding it here when a user links a tweet. So what is the answer and were do we all go with this? Not sure. I've glanced at Reddit, but honestly the Bungie app is way more efficient for communicating on mobile and imo finding relevant topics of discussion. But maybe we all need to go there and join that community if we want to have our thoughts and opinions heard by Devs. I know I used to post with a lot of hope in my topics, but now it just feels like beating our heads against a wall. Anyway, take this for what you will and do with it what you will, but I feel it's time to shine a light on this for everyone to see and understand that as much as one person (Coz) can try to fight for us and get us heard, there is a year of bad blood and disdain for us built up by the rest of them over year one that we're fighting uphill against.