I know it is going to draw some similar negative attention to me but I kinda agree that it sucks and I would thoroughly love to see both those guns literally vanish from PvP altogether but on the other hand they are only really adequate in PvP and people are naturally going to seek the guns that give them an edge. Bungie has the stats and evidence that shows the trending popularity of people's load outs and everyone knows TLW and UR dominate with rush tactics. However I'd like to have the option to play PvP with a no exotics restriction as a playlist. This would certainly encourage me to play more PvP...a lot. lol and the 'git gud' comment are hilarious... Especially as a defense for the guns that require zero skill. I mostly run a Badger CCL and a Queen's Choice. Why? I enjoy being able to challenge a sniper at range and the headshots are quite satisfying...and as for a sidearm...so few people use them but the satisfaction of surprising a dude rushing me and ending him knowing hes pissed a little sidearm got him...but the number of times I've killed striker Titans while they try to panic havoc is the most satisfying of all and it's effectiveness amazes even me at times. Is it the best? Not really. Is it satisfying... Yes, When it works its a lot of fun :)