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Destiny 2

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5/25/2024 10:06:10 PM
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Aspects, Fragments, and Fairness

I want to start by apologizing for such a long post but I felt like there was a lot I needed to get across. I will put the TL;DR here at the top and then you can see my full argument beneath it. TL;DR: Stasis Warlock builds will feel worse and unfair in comparison to Stasis Hunters and Titans in TFS. There’s no reason Weavewalk should limit Warlocks to only one fragment when BoW allows for 2 fragments and is a far stronger aspect. Even Whirling Maelstrom gets 2 Fragments and offers more to the Strand Hunter kit than what Weavewalk gives to Warlocks. After seeing the subclass/ ability changes coming in The Final Shape, I want to talk about how unfair I think the landscape will be. Now I know everyone thinks that one class or another is treated unfairly in comparison to the other two, however I believe we can all agree the current state of Aspects and Fragments is completely unfair to Warlocks. I’ve made a post similar to this one before but I truly don’t think Bungie understands just how bad the Fragment slots allowed by Aspects will feel to Warlock mains come TFS. More specifically Stasis Warlocks. Strand Warlocks are already feeling how unfair the current state of Aspect and Fragments are for them. Understandably Stasis Warlock currently is the best performing Stasis class and it is in a good spot according to Bungie and I think wider community sentiment. I do agree that Stasis Warlock is a really good class and performs well in even endgame content. However, in TFS after the various buffs to Stasis Hunter, Stasis Titan and Stasis as a whole, I think Stasis Warlocks will feel the pain of only being allowed 4 Fragments max for their Stasis subclass whereas Titans with newly massively buffed Diamond Lances will have 5 Fragments and Hunters with the amazing changes to Grim Harvest (alongside other Grim Aspect changes) will also allow for 5 Fragment builds. There are some very potent builds that are only possible because of being able to use 5 Fragments. We’re also getting 2 new Stasis Fragment that will directly synergize with the reworks to Stasis that will be a lot easier for Titans and Hunters to play around with than Warlocks and will definitely impact build crafting. This isn’t just a Stasis problem either. I think Stasis is the most obvious pain point and will be more noticeable in TFS but there’s also unfairness in how Strand Warlock is treated. Weavewalk is not worth the trade off of only one Fragment and it’s actually insulting that Bungie thinks it is when Banner of War exists. I could just be missing out but how many Dungeon bosses are getting 1-2 phased by Weavewalk Warlocks? What Pantheon solo challenges are being completed with Weavewalk Warlocks? Threadlings even with Threaded of Evolution and Swarmers are not worth a single Hunter Whirling Maelstrom. Is the invis and DR really mattering that much when BoW offers healing and melee damage increases for the WHOLE team? This isn’t even taking to account how free Woven Mail is for Titans. I don’t think that the way Bungie intends for things to be and the way they play out in the actual game is congruent here. I definitely don’t think it’s fair and I do NOT want BoW Fragment slots to be nerfed. I’m only seeking for things to be brought up in parity. All of this to say that I think Bungie should allow for Stasis Warlocks to have one of their Stasis Aspects allow for three Fragment slots and Weavewalk should be brought up to allowing two fragment slots instead of just the one we have right now.

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  • My perspective is stasis warlocks will have more potential build into frost armor than hunter since they get frost shards just for freezing an enemy while hunters have to kill chilled enemies to produce shards.

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  • I mean yeah I personally think the fragment slot limitations should be scrapped but that might just be me, only thing really holding stasis warlock together is osmiomancy, agers with battle harmony especially in final shape is the only competitor

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  • I personally feel like stasis warlock is garbage. Why would I sit and wait for abilities to freeze enemies when I can outright kill them in half the time with any other subclass or even just a gun tbh. Besides strand does stasis better than stasis given that suspend is just a better freeze since you get to deal damage without breaking out if that state, and even the new frost armor is just a worse woven mail. I would’ve liked to see it explode upon expulsion by either damage or timing out to set it apart, and deal more damage in a wider aoe with an increased number of frost armor stacks. Back to the main point though, even in endgame, you can use pretty much almost anything to outright kill enemies far faster and without all the drawback of stasis. Bleak watcher is a cool aesthetic and everything but that thing takes ages to freeze one guy when I can just gun em down. There’s no real benefit to stasis in general. Hunter at least has a ton of ways to deal direct damage without requiring follow up, or minimal effort plus massive damage increases. Titan ain’t that great but the super in the right conditions can be crazy (though in general.c it’s not good either). Shadebinder doesn’t have a shatter ability which makes the ease of use far less than that of the other two classes, and the super is genuinely terrible outside of PvP and requires an aspect to be even mildly useable. Frostpulse is garbage given it requires you to be hugging someone with your rift, meaning you’re probably gonna die mid animation. Iceflare is nice but again, freezing does nothing if use when everything else in the game outright kills with more efficiency, and harvest is just a glorified fragment. Weavewalk fr needs a second slot and there’s no reason it shouldn’t have one. Also keep in mind there are far more aspects for warlock that are downright terrible in comparison to other classes/subclasses. Look at Chaos Accelerant. It is the only grenade buffing aspect that requires a charge up animation and stop super regeneration, and yet it is downright worse than the rest. Having a large vortex is useless given the suck of the regular gets the job done itself, axions are useless in PvE, the charged scatter is far worse than uncharged, and HHSN is a genuinely terrible ability now (Nevermind that they are giving titans HHSN on steroids in TFS). It should be more powerful given its drawbacks. Lightning surge is the only melee aspect that requires you to hug enemies and doesn’t even have a damage or air payout to be remotely worth it. No melee aspects on either of the other classes require you to be in their faces and actually allow you to reposition mid melee. Access to many aspect benefits almost always requires a kill where the other classes don’t need a kill (titans and hunter have multiple ways built in to grant them their class verb specialties for void, and warlock has one, which is pretty much exactly the same as using the fragment with very little benefit added). Even prismatic looks like a joke. No real theme. Just a bunch of set and forget abilities and one that’ll get you killed. This ain’t even considering the MASSIVE deficit warlocks have in terms of melees and supers. Warlocks aren’t a support class and shouldn’t be treated as such. One super and one ability don’t make them support, just like hunters aren’t pure utility and titans aren’t pure tanks because of one subclass. It’s an identity they were forced into with forsaken and the only way to break out is for Bungie to actually solve the problems the class has or remove classes outright so abilities can be looked at without bias.

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    1 Reply
    • Edited by hate n payne: 5/26/2024 11:03:59 AM
      Warlocks will always have the potency of the top but bottom feeder in design. If you train hard enough with the Warlock, the mastery it can showcase in power is vastly strong. However, it comes with a high deficit and in it is not easy to master and it grounds you. The Hunter on the other hand is the most hand out character I have ever seen in a shooter. It lives, breathes and sleeps what each class should be like in its identity. There is a reason most players flock to Hunters in general, Titans due to tankiness and Warlocks as a necessarity because Bungie has aligned the identity with how the enemies are orchestrated versus how the character is labeled by design. Hunter: Rogue, Thief, Assassin, Ninja, Archer Titan: Crusader, Knight, Sentinel, Berserker, Barbarian Warlocks: Mage, Warlord, Magician, Cleric, Wizard I mean these are the many concepts that come to my mind but not limit to by others. We need to embrace the fruit not the funk.

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    • Fair,is imaginary.

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