This is mainly from memory. Tried to explain everything on the Vanguard v Drifter argument. Tried not to have too much bias for the Drifter. Probably had a ton of spelling errors. Oh well. Let me set the record straight. Here’s why many a person sides with the drifter. Guardians are resurrected with nearly no memory of their past, and are immediately told by their ghost, who they almost always immediately trust, that they’ve been resurrected by the traveler to fight the darkness, give or take. Thanks to the book of sorrows, we also know that the traveler almost always flees any civilizations it helps when the darkness comes. And because of a lore fragment, we know that Rasputin may be the reason why the traveler didn’t flee earth. Long story short it’s implied that he bombed it. Due to this, it seems like the traveler should not be trusted. The drifter also has a heavily skewed viewpoint. He is a liar first and foremost. But he has a point. He was resurrected by the light, and saw how many risen that grew corrupt with power. Ghosts willing to sacrifice many a thing to increase their connection to the light. And that he doesn’t trust his ghost. But we know that he caused a lot of damage in the dark age due to his recklessness. Most of which was not intentional, but nonetheless he caused it. Mainly that massacre in the village. The warlords spotted his ghost and were prepared for war. The iron lords did what they could. We know from 21% Delirium that the drifter has never actually shot a person. Risen included. Which seems to contradict the lore entry for the breakneck, where it implies that he killed a few rats in his bar. Now there’s always the possibility that he was bluffing. But it implies otherwise. The drifter is not with the dark. He said it himself that the Shadows were just as big of sheep’s as those who follow the light. His whole scheme is personal. The drifter trusts no one. He is here to survive. And survive he will do. But always alone. Don’t think he won’t sacrifice you to stay ahead. The drifter admits to holding hostages in at least one occasion. We don’t know the full story, and he cherry picked what he told us, undoubtably. The drifter doesn’t shy away from the things he’s done in the past that would be frowned upon. He’s not afraid to admit he’s done horrible things. Finally getting the Aunor and her whole side, she immediately came off as hostile. She came off as someone blindly throwing accusations and seeing which ones stick. She came off as someone who sees themself as law, order, and executioner. And implying that we killed Cayde was a low blow. That immediately turned many people away from her side. There is seemingly no evidence, other than the bullet that killed Sundance could have been fired by us. Evidence like that is feeble at best. Our guardians have a long list of defending the light and humanity from threats. The black garden The Vault of Glass Crota Skolas Oryx Aksis Siva Ghaul Panoptes Xol and Nokris, although Toland says it wasn’t actually Xol The scorned barons Riven and the ongoing dreaming city crisis Siviks The praxic order knew nothing of the group of fallen hiding underneath the traveler. Their goal is to keep humanity save, and yet the over looked a threat that had incredibly dangerous weapons that would have been a serious threat, had Ada not sent us to stop them for her own somewhat selfish reasons. I also heard nothing from the praxic order about the red legion. I’m sure that someone should have reported the group of giant cabal ships heading straight for earth. This isn’t entirely their fault, but it is something they should have done more about. The praxic order should be doing something about the consensus. I’ll sum it up for you. The consensus is the oligarchy system the last city uses. There were three seats for each of the vanguard heads and 3 seats for each of the faction heads, and one seat for the speaker. When the speaker died, that meant that nothing could get done in the consensus, as the Vanguard never could agree with what the factions wanted. The speaker was a necessary tie breaker. Zavala should have appointed a new speaker, so that the government could function. Although it would likely require a majority consensus vote to prevent him from choosing someone biased to either side. Things were only made worse with Caydes death. The factions now have majority vote. This is why we saw no faction rally’s in D1, the speaker likely would have allowed the factions to grow that much power as they were power hungry in nature. They are likely too afraid to use their new power, despite having majority vote. The last thing they want is another faction war. This is a far more immediate threat than the drifter. And yet the Praxic order is yet to catch on. The only reason that makes the most sense is the possibility that they are in the pocketbook of an existing faction. Or that they are just straight up blind. Aunor herself has acted outside of her jurisdiction in stopping Shin Malphur in the salt mines. Although what she did could be considered good, despite the whole possibility of basically brainwashing of ghosts and guardians, but just because it could be considered good doesn’t mean it is. There are no checks and balances for the praxic order. The praxic order is has little known about them. They act independently of the vanguard. They have nothing to stop them. They “rehabilitate and re-educate” guardians who attempt to commune with the dark. What should be noted is that no one has any idea what either of this two words mean. How are they rehabilitating or re-educating? Sounds like some type of thought police. Could this be wiping the guardians memory? Resetting them by use of the light? I know that many people like me won’t trust the praxic order until we know everything. The praxic order may not have gone power hungry yet, but should the wrong person be put in charge and they might just do something truly horrible.

A fact not many people consider is the lore tab of this season's eververse Warlock armour. Ikora gave Aunor the job of looking into the Drifter. Subtly. She would receive no offical support as the Vanguard appeared to be tolerating the Drifter's activities.

She stops Shin in his pursuit of justice outside of her jurisdiction, then she goes on to make out that she finds it hard to believe that the shadows would continue their work even after being "reeducated" despite suspecting that the Drifter is bad because he's associated with the shadows. She's all over the place and doesn't know where to stop. She works outside her jurisdiction and fails to listen to one older and more knowledgeable than her, while thinking the people whew arresting aren't as bad as the Drifter, despite her suspicions being baseless there too. She's not evil, just stupid and stubborn. She shouldn't be in a position of power like she is if she's willing to overthrow the Vanguard authority over a baseless suspicion, same goes with the entire Praxic Order. The allegiance quest line showed that they don't belong as a part of the Consensus, they are a rogue element who answer to nobody.

This is all snitch talk.

If you choose the Drifter you get your new darkness super right off the bat when the time comes. Choose vangard and you have to kill 500 warlocks from headshots with single tube grenade launchers. Kills with other guns reset progress. Run 50 strikes and pay 25 enhancement cores. Snitches get stitches.

Solid points. I would very much like to meet Aunor someday. As I do Shin. And Efrideet (I wasn’t there when she was) Aaand Saint-14. Aaaaaaand the newly resurrected Uldren Sov [spoiler][b][i]ALL REMAINING GUARDIANS WILL BOW TO THE PRAXIC ORDAH[/i][/b][/spoiler]

The drifter's sheep will never accept this truth but at least it's there for any who chose to acknowledge it, as is they way of the light.

The Praxic Order is closer to the CIA or FBI. They aren't that bad. They actually sound like a group that I would join.

The more i learn about Aunor the more i like her. I actually didn't know most of this stuff. Glad i sided with the Vanguard.

It's like Hilary or Trump

As per most of my lore extractions goes, i usually follow what popular lore Youtubers such as Mynameis byf, Myelin Games and Evade. The problem I have with this so called Praxic Order is the fact besides limited facts about them, maybe only a selection of armor pieces such as Heart of the praxic fire or a blue Warlock bond back from D1, there's really no sufficient evidence to trust these Praxic Warlocks. In my view the Vanguard is crumbling, the Hunters have no Vanguard since the unfortunate and sorrowful demise of Cayde -6 and the remaining Vanguard seem to be weak. Where leadership falls, so too does the followers. As for the Drifter, he may have done some things that not even he is proud of doing, but can you blame him? Living out there, seeking more from life and venturing out into the unknown? Personally, as long as I can trust the Drifter, my allegiance is to him.

I went with drifter. Nothing against the Praxics but the Vanguard is about to crumble. It’s not about loyalty at this point. There is loyalty and there is arrogance. This is not a down with the ship kind of deal here when the ship is the tower with innocent people and everybody else. People who cannot defend themselves. They need strong leadership, not saying that’s drifter but it sure as hell isnt zavala. That has been very clear. I won’t kid myself either, vanguard is too by the book for me. They wouldn’t welcome a dredgen anyways. Drifter is about survival and with soooo many lore cards and leaks leaning towards another collapse, I’m rolling with the survivalist. The guy has seen it and experienced it on a whole other level. Makes me sad but I can’t follow a group I don’t believe in and unfortunately that’s not the Vanguard anymore. Guess I’m a traitor. Drifter gets it in my opinion. He doesn’t even care when people don’t choose him, sure he calls you a snitch but he even says he understands. Don’t dig the whole holier than you vibe from the Praxics either but hey that’s just my opinion. Don’t see why we can’t figure out a way to use the darkness for good. It’s just another weapon in your back pocket. I love being able to go into crucible and gambit and take out guardians but at the end of the day it’s just my style and I’m not shooting ghost. If it came down to killing good guardians and decent people then I’m 100% out. Challenge me on the other hand and it’s a different conversation, especially if it comes down to my life or theirs. This is just my opinion and where my head sits in the game currently. Can’t wait to be able to walk a little bit more on the dark side, doesn’t make me bad. There are countless other people that are ready for it too. No need for division though. This next game and in all these games it has still come down to humanity vs alien race etc. and in that fight I will always make sure I’m with humanity and guardians. Everything else amongst ourselves is just petty fun and rivalry. Not sure if this post really goes with the theme of the original or if that answers the question or anything, but just wanted to say where my heads at and what I think. Ready for us to really get a game where we can be unique and make our own choices in this incredible universe. So much potential.

I don’t believe people joined the Drifter because of his “charm” (ok that’s a lie, they definitely did) but I believe people also joined him because of the illusion that was presented before them. “Side with the Drifter? Or side with the Vanguard?” Now obviously it’s not the vanguard you’re siding with; it’s Arnour. people only see the vanguard. A group they no longer trust. I sided with the Drifter. But that’s because I personally don’t believe in the strength of the city or the vanguard. And having done the vanguard side on my other character, I can reinforce that idea. They’re not strong enough to lead because of the events that have brought them down. The red war left the consensus without a leader and forcing warriors to be politicians. Forsaken left the vanguard weaker and one entire class without representation. There is no strength in the vanguard. Without a hunter representative they cannot be what they were in D1 and D2 (pre-forsaken). The presence of rogue lightbarers and groups like the shadows of yor, or gambits new breed of Dredgens, means they cannot effectively keep the peace. They are becoming ineffective in the effort to govern the city successfully. However they’re still needed. Leaving just the factions to dictate what occurs would lead to faction wars 2.0. The vanguard has some of the most authoritative figures and represents the most “important” people of the city. Whilst they are weak they are needed. This needs to change. The Vanguard needs to grow stronger in order to help more effectively.