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Destiny 2

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Edited by TJ_Dot: 11/14/2020 10:21:03 PM
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Seeking suggestions for a Power leveless Destiny. Why stop at reverting sunsetting? Use it's passing as more evidence to the faults of the Power system as a whole.

I think it's about time we take a harrrd took at the actual purpose of power in this game and if there really couldn't be a better way. I'm sure most will just look at it as the cut and dry method of progression so that you can actually get to the point of being able to do higher-level activities. It's that vain sense of progression every season that I feel like I see more and more complaints about overtime like: 8 layer RNG to get an average clearance level to content. The constant reclimbing of the same hill with the only thing really mattering being the power difference between two beings and not the values themselves, eventually capping out. Power tries to be canonical as a reflection of how strong our Guardians are [i]really[/i] getting, however, this feels faulty (Crow saving Osiris with a sunset sword?) and is more of the arbitrary game mechanic for the sake fo game, except with even less purpose. Do we even really need this system, or could we do something better? I feel like we can. There are already relatively describable difficulties within the various power deltas, from grey dregs you'll find on Earth, to the red boys worth actually paying attention to, the red skulls that are scary, and the question marks of death. What if we translated some of this to enemy specific difficulties? Like other shooters, let's use Halo for an example, an easy grunt is quite literally nothing, while one on Legendary can actually mess you up. How would this be any different from Destiny? Easy grunt you're just way overleveled while the legendary one is up in red skull territory. It's somewhat of a parallel, it just looks different. Would this be better? It could feel relatively the same, but could also be slightly different: For one, instead of some random 1050 thrall, it could just be designated as 'Easy' with an appropriate icon or something else distinctive. Raids can get their easy mode for learning/teaching at the expense of rewards. Can get even harder for more. RNG could be effectively eliminated from player progression. What would have to replace this RNG in the level things drop at and still provide about the same sense of progression, such that the "power grind" is not lost, but liberated of RNG. I feel this could be easy, XP. XP is very much still a thing and only serves the season pass and artifact, it used to serve character level too. Why not bring this back? Was anything truly wrong with it? Character levels used to serve as the gates from content, too low and you just wouldn't even be allowed in. We can learn something from that. Don't need to level gate everything to the extreme, but somethings could probably benefit from having them. Something like Trials. If everyone starts at say 0, so do cheaters, which means quite the road ahead in order to even attempt to ruin people's time. Could easily be a deterrent if it's just too inconvenient. I want to develop this more with the community with feedback or other ways to make it better. I would love suggestions because I truly think we need a change for the better, the system Luke designed for four year olds has grown to be tediously arbitrary and overly dependent on RNG where it is unnecessary. Plus, you can't power cap things when there is no power, let the sandbox control what people want to use, not some stupid number.

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  • Power leveling is literally all we do in this game. It's pointless and boring.

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  • Power NEEDS to be more rewarding because it really does just feel like a difficulty slider every season. You don't keep anything from growing power, not even the tiniest boost to stats in any way. It exists solely as a way to gatekeep players from just obliterating content and every season it always feels exactly the same. Theres no permanence to what you get from spending HOURS farming it besides a number that makes you kill one set of enemies just as fast as the respective power enemies last season and the season before that. There is no real growth to playing the game other than when bungie tunes the sandbox. It's a loot game where everything is basically pointless, including the loot, because 9/10 times it's just going to be used as infusion for something else you like better to make you kill that same acolyte with a different color in the exact same amount of bullets as last season. There's literally no permanence to the game, not even weapons or armor anymore and they've only made this feeling of exhaustion worse. I don't have any solutions on how to fix it because I honestly don't think you can. It's not a proper leveling system, it's just an artificial gatekeeper, nothing more and nothing less.

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      While the LL system sucks, changing it to an easy-medium-hard slider is antithetical to the game’s (wannabe) RPG structure. I think they should invest more in expanding those RPG elements that currently amount to “look i jump different : )”. The game’s about space magic, for god’s sake, you’d think progression would be tied to making your actual character stronger, not trying to get bigger numbers on identical gear that’s somehow better despite being, you know, identical.

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      • https://www.bungie.net/en/Forums/Post/256410076?page=0&sort=0&showBanned=0&path=1

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      • Personally, I wish they would throw out the let's reset them every 3 months. It's at the point where power level and reaching max level are a pure waste of time.

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        • I think I'd rather go back to the days of Forever 29 at this point. At least then we could be raid relevant even if we didn't have any raid gear, even if only for the normal mode.

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          • I’ve always hated the progression system in this franchise. Vertical progression ( your lv ), and horizontal progression ( weapon loadout, armour perks, character build ) should be independent from each other. However, in Destiny, horizontal, and vertical progression are linked together. The whole entire system has always felt counterproductive.

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            • You just described Destiny 1 Good job Boyoo. Don't fix what's not broken Bungie.

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              • Remove the caps. Every Legendary moves you up.

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              • Power leveling is the main way that Bungie can get you to spend more time on the hamster. This is the one thing that I don't see them EVER changing, so long as this leadership stands. [b]You're honestly wasting your time. [/b]When will this forum get this!?

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                • They need to let you infuse gear between characters again. Say your Warlock needs 1250 Gauntlets but your Hunter just got its second pair of 1250. Just pass them over and infuse. Problem solved.

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                  • Edited by ZoniCat: 11/15/2020 5:40:42 PM
                    I think light level is fine but how we get it is not. Raids and Trials should be the only way to acquire pinnacle level gear, so 51 - 60 Nightfalls, even GMs, and Iron Banner should drop level 41 - 50 gear Playlist activities should drop 21 - 40 gear And everything else drops at 20 or below.

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                    • You have spoilers in your post, might want to mark them. I think power level as a whole could be done away with, but within destiny’s world, it’s such a big part of what a guardian is. I think a final power level DLC where we progress to the max light possible, and then once we reach that top-tier potential, it finally wakes the traveler or something. Then at least there would be a story/lore/canon reason why light level/power level is no longer used. Then from there, have a balance system where certain activities are harder, but instead of getting light/power to make them easier, we get mods, abilities, perks, etc. A much deeper and more comprehensive build system for our characters would help this a lot.

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                    • Lore: A Guardian’s power comes from their connection to the Light, to The Traveler. Actual Gameplay: Lol, you can’t survive a bunch of Dregs? Better go put on this higher number blue gear, f*cken scrub. It could’ve been simple: Rep’ing up with factions, completing quests, and endgame activity completion/mastery authorizes Guardians to use higher tier equipment, no numbers needed. Gaining experience with The Light and in combat with that gear upgrades it until it can be Masterworked. Light level can still be a thing, but it’s only tied to experience, not gear. If Sunsetting has to take place, simply take each tier of gear and bring it down every couple of Seasons. Just explain it as Guardians needing to find new equipment every so often because their connection to The Light is too strong for our gear to withstand for long periods.

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                    • The game was better without "light" level, like the early D1 days tbh

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                      • Edited by LikwiD_SmOkE22: 11/15/2020 5:09:03 PM
                        Slot leveling is already in the game.. Just fkn apply it already.. Remove modules.. Use cores for masterworking gear only Idk about an easy medium hard area thing .. reminds me of what assassins creed did w their recent games where I can't travel certain places without my dudes teeth been knocked down his throat.. Im just trying to synchronize my view points homie.. Lol I know .. Two entirely different games.. My point is it just doesnt sound appealing to me.. Also.. Fix the XP system I mean holy shit people are really popping variks bounties to bp lvl 100 .. XP should be higher in activities vs 1 bounty where you need to shoot 25 enemies w a machine gun that gives you 11k XP I know I'm going off in different directions .. But its getting frustrating playing this way

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                      • Edited by CrazyWiz0: 11/15/2020 3:53:49 PM
                        I hate power grinding I don’t have time to play a 24 hour day like streamers making it sound easy. that’s not easy for casual playing. Same bs grinding every season sucks it’s not gaming it’s a chore for me as a casual

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                      • We deffinitely dont need the power system. If they want to increase difficulty of activities, just give us 3 different contest mode settings. - 10, -20, - 50. We stay at a static power, and we can jump in different handicaps as we perfect our builds. Easy fix.

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                      • Please no. The issue isn't power levels. Rather the issue is how the leveling system works. The artifact hurts endgame a lot and the road to getting better gear is nothing but a checklist. They need to return to D1 leveling system where all you needed to do was strikes and/or crucible until you hit a level where raids were possible and then the raids provided endgame level gear. That endgame gear could then be used for hard mode raids and/or trials. It was a simple clear cut system of leveling that felt meaningful and not a pointless grind. Oh and if they brought back the concept of being over the activity's power to gain power advantage that would be amazing.

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                        • I think the best solution would be go back to the +10 between seasons. It'll make the pinnicle grind meaningful cause the further you get into it the further you are in next seasons power grind. Maybe have a large increase of a hundred or so for dlcs and you should have a decent grind without it being unbearably long. Less people will have issues with not hitting the pinnicle cap cause they will be in the actual pinnicle grind earlier in the season. And I'm of the camp that sunsetting will be better for the game in the long run and I've experienced that no amount of arguing about it will change either of our minds.

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                        • I just wish we had a normal leveling system, with distributable skill points awarded at each level. I remember when "grinding" meant hunting down an item with perfect rolls... not hunting down an item with +1 level to then infuse into an already perfectly rolled item.

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                          • every season since 750 iv actively avoided max power i just wait till next season to play current season content ill be doing this until something stops me... i dont raid because im solo, i dont play trials cus its shit and i do play iron banner but im better so i win power level is just away for bungie to time gate content... sun setting dosent affect me because i ignore it

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                          • Edited by NightWolf: 11/15/2020 5:45:43 AM
                            Woow I see you stopped complaining about CBMM...now power system has to suffer....bro just play the game and stop crying....

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                            • I didnt read the whole thing, apologies if i missed something. I personally thing power level never is or will be a problem. destiny as a game is about tje grind, and increasing your power. Removing that would make a very stale game where you collect items and just do endgame content immediately, or it will twist the weapons/armor to be extremely mission-oriented (ie only nightfall gear can drop with x perk that is needed for super nightfalls) and that would limit what gear you can earn.

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                              • There's nothing wrong with the system they have now, all they need to do is make sure that whenever you earn a powerful or pinnacle it is for the lowest power item you have.

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                                • Yes. Kill the RPG elements. That's surely the answer. #satire

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