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Destiny

Discuss all things Destiny.
6/4/2016 5:09:00 PM
107

Huge weapon perk imbalance, weapons too reliant on certain perks

Agree Perks need restructuring

948

Things are fine as is

315

I was just watching a video on YouTube where a player named Kackis had a FWC Variable Machine Gun drop for him with an incredible roll that basically made it usable whereas usually it isn't, and it got me to thinking. How many times have I had to use a weapon for infuse materials, or scrap for parts, because of the horrible roll it dropped on me with? Well the answer is, far far far far far more often than not. It's not even remotely close. I have a ridiculous amount of hours in this game and yet, most of the weapons I consider usable or ones that are my favorites have either come with good solid rolls from a vendor, or were from orders I sat on until the Gunsmith finally had a good roll on a weapon. FYI, I'm rank 67 on my Titan with FWC and have gotten about a half dozen Variables over that time period. Anyone want to guess how many lasted longer than the day it dropped? That's right, zero. Perks should add to a weapons usability, not create usability. I have a very small handful of weapons that dropped for me from an activity, ranking up, or decrpyted because of the certain combinations of perks required to not just make a "God Roll", but to make a weapon usable in the first place. There are a number of weapons that absolutely require a strong stability number in order to be good, and yet come with a base stability that make them worthless. Most weapons that can fire faster than a scout rifle NEED stability and lots of it to function properly and the faster your fire rate the more stability you are going to require. Auto Rifles are the biggest culprits, Machine Guns and Pulse Rifles as well, and Fusion Rifles due to the way the spread patterns with stability. I'm thinking Bungie should restructure the way Perks work or are laid out tier wise once again, as they are not all created equal, and some are much much more important to a weapons function and ability. Maybe even add more choices or another tier altogether. I had a Final Duty drop for me the other day after completing CoE that had Guerilla Fighter on it... A perk in the running for worst perk ever. While that might have been nice if it was an option or an extra, nope, that was a force fed perk that I can't see any real use for in this game. In PvE there might be a few areas or situations were you can take cover and shoot from behind it, but not many cases at all. In PvP, I dare you to try something like that. One of those Speedy Gonzalez shotgunners are going to blink across your line of sight, land in your lap, and end your silly ways right quick. I'd love to hear some ideas on how to better this situation, but one thing is for certain, most perks are crap, there's a handful or good ones, and some guns need the better ones to even make them usable, let alone good. And I for one am sick and tired of how ridiculously horrid my chances thus far have been in getting weapons that I can actually enjoy and use competitively. I keep getting blues out of my purples for those of you with nightmares from those days, and while I understand that should have a chance to happen some of the times, it shouldn't happen the overwhelming most of the time which is where things are now.
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  • Combine this with all the calls for nerfing and you will get every weapon being the same. There are hundreds of weapons and the point is they should be different. And some can have or need specific things to make them useful or only useful in certain situations, like ToM. It's called variety. Otherwise you'll have hundreds of neutered, cloned, pointless weapons that all feel and act the same. That's my opinion on it.

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    • I just think that out of the hundreds of perk possibilities, only a handful are actually worth a damn. Every auto user wants DoP type stability rolls. Shotguns want range, range and range Fusions want range. Stability and hot swap Handcannons want stability/range and LitC Pulse and Scout want maxed stability and full auto Snipers want Hidden hand and ability regen perks. I mean when have you ever gotten say a good handcannon with Grave robber and Exhumed and thought "dude, f*cking awesome!!" *Never

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    • You are very right. You know what I was thinking? How about every time you get an endgame weapon or encrypted engram weapon you have a choice of 3 randomly rolled weapons, like the gunsmith has right now. That way everybody has to work for the gun they want, but has a bit more chance of getting the right roll on the weapon.

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      • A lot of people didn't like weapon rerolling because they didn't like getting killed by certain perks in crucible. I don't see a problem with it myself. It's still random. You just have more chances to get something decent or usable. It would probably be difficult to code, but even if they brought it back they could do it like the division. You can pick one slot to reroll, and then all the others are locked. You can reroll several times but it cost more each time.

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        • I think I am the only person in the world who doesn't care about rolls.

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        • Bring back reforging

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          • I enjoy trying new weapons, regardless of perks. If I haven't tried something yet, I'll test it out. Then, I'll look closely at the perks. If I like the feel of the gun, I keep it, as a placeholder. To remind me of what to hunt for with better rolls. I never stay with a specific weapon type. Autos for a couple weeks, then switch to hand cannons or scouts. Keeps things interesting.

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          • Edited by ThisMahSwamp: 6/6/2016 2:22:08 PM
            The vast majority of weapons require a stability perk (or two in some cases) to even be considered usable..... Structurally speaking, the archetypes of certain weapons also need to be looked at a second time. The LMG detailed in the video should natively have exceptional stability....it makes sense. Whereas, the stability on higher impact LMGs should be lower....which they aren't, which makes 0 sense to me. Anyhow, that's just getting weapons usable, perks are a whole other ball game.

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          • It's Monday morning, and I'm Bumping so that Bungie can see what was trending and being talked about over the weekend.

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          • Getting garbage rolls everytime is getting pretty annoying.

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          • I disagree with this. For one, I'm sure it's Bungies way to make you keep playing for that roll you're looking for being on a faction. And two, it gives those garbage rolls purpose for infusing or for materials. If we didn't get garbage or less then better of what you're looking for, then you have trouble getting rid of a lot more weapons and start complaining that there is even less space to store stuff. Or maybe, on some weapons it'll a garbage perk, but will be one of your favorite weapons. Like with me, I hate the perk exhumed, but on 3 different guns I like to use have it, but one is an omolon gun so it swappable. But, it's on one of my favorite weapons which is Grasp of Molak which the perks are red-dot oas, grenadier, injection mold and Exhumed. Even with a garbage perk that has never really been used, maybe once in trials, but it's still a very great gun.

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            • God roll my ass! I have the vanguard machine gun with counterbalance, perfect balance and hidden hand! Your time has come!

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              • Either buff the preexisting bad ones or replace them altogether Furthermore, add foundry exclusive perks

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              • Nah it's ok

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              • Bump. Some perks are just awful and should really be buffed. (Vacuum, guerrilla fighter, surrounded, danger close, underdog) When I get a good weapon and see one of these perks, my heart drops. It's sad to see a weapon I want with bad perks, because I know I'll never use it, and I know it will be a long while before I get that weapon again, let alone get it again with the desired perks. They need to buff a lot of the bad perks in this game.

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              • THATS -blam!-ING BEAUTIFUL!

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              • I made a topic about this earlier (don't know if anyone had the same idea), and this sounds like a place to bring it up. Destiny needs an equipment system where, instead of getting the one solid gun or armor piece, you would get tokens/programs that you could equip to grant certain perks, austhetics, firing patterns, etc. Like, say, you could have a machine gun that LOOKED like the Thunderlord, but it would fire like Super Good Advice and have its perk. Or how about having the Monte Carlo perk on a legendary-style auto rifle that fired like the Arminius-D? Or, for the case of armor, Titans wearing the Crest of Alpha Lupi for looks while it had Armamentarium or Twilight Garrison properties? You would have tiers for tokens/programs that would add reserve ammo, sensor/radar functions, melee/grenade recharging, etc. Like, you could have tier-1 ammo that adds 10% to reserves, while tier-2 or 3 could do 20-25%. Put two different types of the same tier quality (like pulse rifle and fusion rifle) and have a 2-in-1 upgrade. This system would let you put on the perks you really wanted without sacrificing style or having to grind past thousands of junk rolls.

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              • The point you make about stability is especially true for Auto Rifles, Pulse Rifles and Machine Guns. Without god-roles (Counterbalance and Braced Frame) Auto Rifles and Pulse Rifles are (depending on archetype) at best unreliable and, at worst, unusable. Blanket buffs to stability need to be implemented for Auto Rifles and Pulse Rifles if Bungie want a primary meta where ability to kill is going to be measured in terms of your ability to get headshots; Autos and Pulses just can't compete unless they have ideal perks.

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                • The problem really is lack of perk variety (didn't blue level guns have more variety that wasn't carried over to legendaries?). There are what, four or five perks everyone want? I don't think you should be able to easily build "god rolls" though, which is pretty much what reforging did right? Let you re-roll a gun until you got just what you wanted.

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                  • Guerrilla Fighter would work better if it could be used on pretty much any surface and had a much greater stability buff. However, doing that may lead people to head glitch in PvP as much as they do in CoD.

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                  • 3
                    [b]BRING BACK WEAPON REFORGING AND THIS UNFAIR RNG-TO-WIN SLOT MACHINE BULLSHIT WOULDN'T BE SO DAMN FRUSTRATING[/b] I'M ALSO SICK OF ALWAYS GETTING CLASS ITEMS FROM PACKAGES AND MY TRIALS ARMOR REWARDS LIKE BUNGIE BRO WTF THE LAST TIME I EVER SERIOUSLY PLAYED DESTINY, I GOT AN ALMOST GOD ROLL PARTY CRASHER. RANGEFINER, FINAL ROUND, AGGR BALL... BUT WTF, INJECTION MOLD?!?! *dismantled & disappointed* THAT SHIT MADE ME NEVER WANT TO PLAY AGAIN FCK THIS GAME

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                    • Mentioned this in another post but think that some of those perks would actually be better if they did what they were supposed to more often For example geurilla fighter almost never processes for me.. Underdog seems to only work when your literally already dead. They just need some work done to them

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                    • You know, I think if Destiny had a kind of [u]WarFrame[/u] type of Mod Card system, most of you would wet your pants and scream "NERF...NERF...NERF" till the cows came home. Honestly all weapons and armour should be returned to their glorious high status with a few exceptional weapons aside for balancing, then locked permanently in place with Bungie giving everyone the middle finger...!

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                    • Overall I'm not too bothered most drops I've received have been usable, really the only ones that are terrible are hakke pulse rifles w/o stability, and I had a hacksaw that with the up and left pull and poor impact to be pretty useless. But I've had some terrible role thesan and 1k stare that worked just fine just kept till I got something better. And I think some element of randomness with weapons adds to the excitement you can get something better. But I think the big issue is poor stability weapons those should be evaluated by bunjie and base stats adjusted like they did with fusions. Overall an unstable low impact weapon is useless, while a poor stability hitchhiker has risk and reward element to it.

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                    • It would improve things tremendously if they would just get rid of maybe 6 totally useless perks. Exhumed and icarus come to mind. There's also that behind cover one that doesn't work and unflinching which has been tested and also doesn't work. Then there would be more room for decent perks to drop.

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                      • If they didn't nerf the good/decent Year 1 perks to make the shitty perks look viable (sound familiar?), then we'd at least have a point that we can say "good enough" if we didn't get the perks we wanted.

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