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Edited by Art Vandelay: 12/21/2015 4:45:31 PM
392

The Sniper meta is worse than the Shotgun meta

Coming from a guy thats been using high impact snipers since the LDR 5001. The main argument for "what takes more skill: snipers vs shotguns" is that snipers are harder to use because you have to land headshots. I just don't see it like that though. The truth is that snipers are so much safer to use. You can distance yourself where you cant be killed fast by the majority of meta weapons, you can pop in and out of cover and still get kills. Even if you miss, youre safe, the same cant be said about shotguns though. With shotguns, you have to put yourself at risk, either by pushing past the half way mark on the map, going into the other teams spawn, etc. You need to be agile and use your character's mobility. Its not easy to do. Sure, you can get one easy kill. But most of the time you end up trading, either with the guy you kill or you die by his teammate because you put yourself at risk. And in trials, trades are bad for the shotgun user, because they have to advance to get their close range shotgun kill, so the shotguns dead orb will usually be un-revivable whereas the orb that was killed by the shotgun will usually be on his teams own side, so it is usually revivable. With snipers, you can get one kill and safely walk away. And the fact that shotguns and fusion rifles aren't as good as they used to be, everyone is now sniping, and playing almost risk free. Pvp has mostly come down to a game of pop-in pop-out where whoever gets the first snipe has the advantage. The only risk you put yourself in is getting sniped by someone else. Playing that safe should not be so rewarding. This has nothing to do with high aim assist. As a sniper main I know nothing has changed about snipers since vanilla when it comes to aim assist. Im not "one of those guys." I genuinely believe the reason people have gotten so good at sniping recently is that [i]everyone[/i] uses them now and we've gotten so much practice with them. Nothing to do with aim assist. All Im saying is shotguns and fusion rifles, and even sidearms need to be buffed so they get more usage. I actually liked the HoW meta better because shotguns were extremely good but still had that risk factor to them. They could still be stopped dead in their tracks or could be traded with. Nowadays its almost unsafe to walk around any corner because there is already a sniper aimed down it at head level. I find myself hitting down on the dpad to see around the corner in third person every time I get to a corner. Its not a good meta at all. Bring back shotguns and fusion rifles! Again, this is coming from a sniper main. Tl;dr Shotguns take a ton of awareness and use of your character's mobility and you have to put yourself at risk for every kill, but snipers are almost risk free to use. Shotguns didnt deserve to be nerfed and should be buffed along with fusions and sidearms to give them more usage.

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  • Yesterday i went to rumble, every single game everybody was running like crazy around the map with shotguns. By my third game i knew my " no time to xplain" was not enough to counter them. Swith to last word and finish second. The first place got 25 kills and die only 8 times. Shotguns are still op and most people go with the last word bcs is the only way to counter the blink+ shotgun combo or go shotgun which i dont do( not even in the shotgun meta). The new " sniper meta", " sniper are op" is what you get after the shotgun meta, by now 90% of the pvp players are running around with shotguns. The last word is op?, no but is the only primary thats going to save your ass if a hunta or warlock are blinking and shotgunning and thats not cheating thats playing smart.

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    • [quote]That's because you understand balancing mechanics and others don't. Usually it's a skill thing tbh. Which is interesting because you do not fall in the highly skilled category in this game... Ever played a Moba or MMO on a highly skilled level? People simply don't understand what certain weapons/perks can do, if they don't have the skill to realise it. There's a phenomenon called https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect "The Dunning–Kruger effect is a cognitive bias in which relatively unskilled individuals suffer from illusory superiority, mistakenly assessing their ability to be much higher than it really is. Dunning and Kruger attributed this bias to a metacognitive inability of the unskilled to recognize their own ineptitude and evaluate their own ability accurately. Their research also suggests corollaries: highly skilled individuals may underestimate their relative competence, they may erroneously assume that tasks which are easy for them are also easy for others, and they may incorrectly suppose that their competence in a particular field extends to other fields in which they are less competent.[1] The bias was first experimentally observed by David Dunning and Justin Kruger of Cornell University in 1999. Dunning and Kruger have postulated that the effect is the result of internal illusion in the unskilled, and external misperception in the skilled: "The miscalibration of the incompetent stems from an error about the self, whereas the miscalibration of the highly competent stems from an error about others." "[/quote]

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    • Its unbelievable how many people say sniping is hard... It's not Lmao

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      • Just played a game of full sniper opposition and it wasn't fun at all

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      • Bullshit.

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      • Wash your mouth boy

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      • Edited by o0o Cowboy o0o: 12/28/2015 5:09:17 AM
        Moral of the story: You losers got what you asked for. Be careful what you wish for.

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        • Edited by The Warrior: 12/21/2015 8:58:04 PM
          I never understood people bitching about shotguns being a scrub weapon when all players with the highest k/D main snipers and there's a reason for that. If shotguns were so "overpowered" we should've seen some outrageous stats from shotgunners. This doesn't happen because most of the time there's a trade off or you get killed. Shotguns: high risk, high reward Snipers: low risk, really high reward How does this make any sense to anyone is beyond mr

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          • Snipers currently have a well known balancing problem: We call it the principle of risk and reward. When something has a lot of risk when used, the reward has to be great. Something that basically has no risk involved, should offer a small reward. Snipers break that specific train of thought, as the reward outweighs the risk exponentially. Snipers are also breaking another fundamental balancing guideline, Bungie enforced very harshly up until now: They are very very very capable at close range, which means that snipers work in a range they weren't intended for. ARs, PRs, shotguns and Fusion Rifles got massive nerfs to curb theit effectiveness in ranges they weren't intended for. Why would the sniper rifle escape that fate?

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          • Edited by jep2003: 12/28/2015 9:06:54 AM
            Bungie needs to nerf both of them so the meta will be fusion rifles and sidearms, I think that it would be pretty fast paced, balanced and fun

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          • Shotguns are easy mode. They weren't even nerfed. All you guys complaining about shotguns being garbage now suck at the game. Yeah, sliding in and holding down the trigger on your invective takes tons of skill....

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            • Dude it depends on the map. Theres a wide and small map and we know who has a larger advantage between that. This game needs also a strategy. When youre using shotguns its not always youll push them. Its either youll come with a right angle or let them come to you. Timing and quick response will help you to be a better shotgun user. And its the same with the fusion rifles. Precision and accuracy for sidearm because its easy to handle,draw,reload and its always have the highest stability and rate of fire. And for sniper users like me sometimes its hard to aim because we have to secure our surrounding before we take a fire. Now everything here is balance theres no need to be buff or nerf.

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              • Here's my two cents. I used to applaud when I got sniped from a close distance while I was sitting them. But now it is happening much more often. If your being shot, I don't think it should be easy to zoom in and pop off a headshot. In my opinion.

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                • Stupid post is stupid

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                • I disagree completely.

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                • No one has got good with a sniper, all they are doing is hard scoping a corridor waiting for you to walk through it. A good sniper is mobile and takes risks etc...

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                • Bump

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                • Edited by JayTeazyy: 12/28/2015 5:56:40 AM
                  So when I was getting -blam!-er in rumble with a shotgun, pulled one out, and dropped a 2.67; that was more skilled than I sniper? Tbh the only reason people are salty about snipers is because they have little crucible experience. They don't know how to out think someone. Check my second most recent game in my hunter, 4/6 (not including myself) were sweat players (who I also know very well)who regularly use a shotgun, while I snipe mainly. [spoiler]thats why I don't shotgun. 2 ez 4 me[/spoiler]

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                  • My prudence says hi! Low impact, decent ROF..... Had it since vanilla.... I have yet to see ANY sniper out class it.

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                  • I agree completely, me and my team played trials last night and we decided to try out Limited sniping since Twilight gap doesn't have too many sniper spots. We did fairly good in doing aggressive flanking movements but even with the advantage of having plenty of cover and tight spaces to work with we still had difficulty closing the distance when we needed to. One team that we played against decided to hide at the very back of alpha spawn and just camp from there for half the match until the time started to run down because they were too chicken to come after us. It was so annoying that they had no skill in close quarters and had to rely on their crutch snipers to do any damage.

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                    • No it's really not

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                    • We need some buffs

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                    • Everyone nerfed shotguns into the ground what did you expect.....

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                    • And you whiny twats caused it. Accept your consequences!

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                    • Edited by Oliver 1025: 12/28/2015 4:19:35 AM
                      Here's what you need to do 1. Delete Your Warlock 2. Delete Your Hunter 3. Delete Your Titan 4. Uninstall Destiny 5. Throw Your System Out Your Window [spoiler]JK[/spoiler]

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                    • just went flawless on back to back cards with a fusion rifle then shotgun against mostly snipers just learn how to move around the map boys

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