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Edited by Wes:
2/7/2019 1:39:07 AM
309
Not Forgotten and Luna's Howl are a Problem
So before anyone throws a fit, I have Not Forgotten. I got a group, I practiced, I succeeded and died succeeded and died over and over again, got good as a team and got it.
Not Forgotten and Luna's Howl are way too forgiving and dominate the game.
The gun does nothing except discourage players from playing PvP, even in quickplay. I get it. Pinnacle weapons need to be strong and PvP players needed something to grind for, but these guns have gone too far in the right direction. Pinnacle weapons should be fun and powerful in the right hands, and 180 RPM hand cannons have a very low skill requirement due to their high stability and recoil direction. This normally results in a slow TTK, but LH and NF negate this entirely with 2 headshots and a body. Ace of Spades even requires 3 headshots to kill. This results in people winning engagements because they have the better gun, rather than the better movement and aim.
As for a solution to these guns, I have no idea. Nerfing them, removing then from QP, or altering them will be met with a bunch of anger and lashing out. My best ideas (not perfect by far) are:
1. Make them exotics. Maybe then people will have a harder time choosing them and their choice will matter more.
2. Make Magnificent Howl activate after three precision hits, making it a 4 shot kill on the first target and a 3 shot kill on the next, as long as you continuously hit crits.
3. Nerf the perk so it takes 3 consecutive headshots to kill. That way the gun isn't as forgiving and requires a larger amount of skill to use appropriately.
4. Make them kinetic weapons. The best primary shouldn't be able to he pairs with the best shotgun in the game honestly. (Precision shotguns need a rework. Dust Rock Blues has very few downsides compared the aggressive frame shotguns.)
5. Decrease their stability and recoil direction significantly. The guns can honestly be spammed and be affective due to the flinch the cause and their stability and recoil direction and still be very, very effective. This is especially true in team engagements, but is also true for 1v1 engagements.
6. Combinations of those above.
I hope the guns aren't nerfed into the ground, but some adjustments are necessary. I don't even use mine.
Edit: The other solution to this issue is one I completely forgot to mention. Buff other hand cannons. 140s should kill in 2 crit 1 body. Balance the others from there. 180s should probably stay the same or have more recoil.
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More hunter propaganda
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3 RepliesJust an fyi, your 4th point loses validation since people can get a Retold Tale with the same perks as DRB. It's also a precision frame that can hit 96 range if completely maxed out for range. Of course, it's a little harder to grind for since you only have so many chances per week to get one, compared to DRB, which can be farmed to the end of time. Those guns are a little too good though, if I'm going to be honest. Chaining a 3 tap kill into a 2 tap with a 180? That's garbage since if you have a 110 with rampage, you can do the same thing, but the overall TTK is much slower and requires a lot more effort. It makes 110s not a desirable archetype. I think either all other handcannons need their recoil toned down so they can at least better compete with 180s in their little bits of range advantage (NF is quite dumb, since you can still 3 tap if you hit those super magnetized headshots at a max range 110 range), or just get rid of how forgiving the 180s as a whole are. Super spammable, high aim assist on top of high bullet magnetism with very little recoil and no need to compensate for any recoil. But there is going to be that guy that wants to defend him getting it, and sure, in a way, yeah, you earned it, so did I. But there has to be a point where you realize, "Why is this a thing?"
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I get killed by a lot of weapons and Luna is just one of them. And I rarely get killed by a Not Forgotten because not many people have it. The only weapon that still drives me crazy is the point in the general direction and shoot Colony. But none of these weapons need a nerf, not even the Colony.
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They should have made it a 110 rpm HC the kills players if you land 2 consecutive headshots.
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1 ReplyI'm sure they need there slight adjustments, but the weapons in this game are not as much of a problem as the sandbox actually is. It starts with them and ends with them. I get having a rotation but the way the sandbox goes about things is ridiculous. There is this thing called slight adjustments and learning how to make things compete with one another. I mean, if I had a chart that tells me every aspect of every single weapon in the entire game? I'd say there's more than enough info there to work with.
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38 Replies🙋♂️ Not Forgotten user here I made a similar post about this although my views are slightly different. I believe Pinnacle pvp weapons should always be strong in pvp. If not then what’s the point... The problems I see are. 1. Every other Handcannon sucks. 2. NF/Luna are too lenient in their 3 taps. My suggestion. 1. Buff other archetypes by a. Reducing overall recoil b. Damage increase allowing 140s to 2 head one body kill. And 2. Rework Magnificent howl by making it give just [b][u][i]Bonus[/i][/u][/b] precision damage. That way the guns will still be good TTK wise but to fully take advantage of it you’d need precision.
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Edited by Cry: 2/6/2019 3:41:30 PM1. While this would be effective in making people unequip them, there's people who enjoy using these guns in PvE, and making them exotic would likely result in them being shelved. 3. This would probably be my choice, if they were to receive a nerf. Since you're already able to get down to such a low ttk, you shouldn't be able to do it with less headshots than 150 RoF hand cannons. 4. We have Retold Tale in the Energy Slot, so changing them to Kinetic doesn't fix this issue.
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II don’t know about you guys, but I could really go for some cake and ice cream right about now.
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Works hard to get a good gun then complains that it's too good. I suspect that you are just in the wrong game, man.
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Stockholm GuardianI Hate It Here - old
Make it kinetic and you just pair it with retold tale, dreaming city shotgun, precision frame -
i dont have a problem with that; i actually i use different stuff; luna is boring like NF is - i dont care about stats; but i think 99 % of Luna/NF-owners do and they use just this one weapon and thats the only sad point...btw i got the luna
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myabe they need to change something about the queststeps.
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9 Replies[quote]So before anyone throws a fit, I have Not Forgotten. I got a group, I practiced, I succeeded and died succeeded and died over and over again, got good as a team and got it. Not Forgotten and Luna's Howl are way too forgiving and dominate the game. The gun does nothing except discourage players from playing PvP, even in quickplay. I get it. Pinnacle weapons need to be strong and PvP players needed something to grind for, but these guns have gone too far in the right direction. Pinnacle weapons should be fun and powerful in the right hands, and 180 RPM hand cannons have a very low skill requirement due to their high stability and recoil direction. This normally results in a slow TTK, but LH and NF negate this entirely with 2 headshots and a body. Ace of Spades even requires 3 headshots to kill. This results in people winning engagements because they have the better gun, rather than the better movement and aim. As for a solution to these guns, I have no idea. Nerfing them, removing then from QP, or altering them will be met with a bunch of anger and lashing out. My best ideas (not perfect by far) are: 1. Make them exotics. Maybe then people will have a harder time choosing them and their choice will matter more. 2. Make Magnificent Howl activate after three precision hits, making it a 4 shot kill on the first target and a 3 shot kill on the next, as long as you continuously hit crits. 3. Nerf the perk so it takes 3 consecutive headshots to kill. That way the gun isn't as forgiving and requires a larger amount of skill to use appropriately. 4. Make them kinetic weapons. The best primary shouldn't be able to he pairs with the best shotgun in the game honestly. (Precision shotguns need a rework.) 5. Decrease their stability and recoil direction significantly. The guns can honestly be spammed and be affective due to the flinch the cause and their stability and recoil direction and still be very, very effective. This is especially true in team engagements, but is also true for 1v1 engagements. 6. Combinations of those above. I hope the guns aren't nerfed into the ground, but some adjustments are necessary. I don't even use mine.[/quote] How about they fix the glory point system instead. If people play like 200 games and there win to loss they should be able to move up it comp not trials
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Edited by kindaSketch: 2/6/2019 3:29:07 PMI dont have NF but I have Luna. Solo que'd it except for 150 points for anyone who gaf about the legitimacy of that "skill statement". I haven't played pvp in about 2 months. My argument now is the same argument that I had when Bungie announced these guns. It's an extremely bad idea to introduce a weapon that creates a meta where 1 weapon is grossly dominant and alienates ppl who dont have it. Pvp is just boring af now and all the casual players gave it up. But Bungie knows what their doing right? Oh and everyone who defends it.
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Somebody who can actually make an argument about why something should be nerfed [b][i]and[/i][/b] give tips on how to go about doing so? A rarity in these forums to be sure. Although the people who use luna’s as a crutch won’t likely care and say the gun is fine and doesn’t need any changes, which is a tragedy.
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2 Replieswell I think maybe the should move luna's howl to QP, after this season end, like redix's board sword. Not forgotten should stay to legend comp, and something new should be place in luna's place... maybe a really good enegry sniper with a short zoom scope " cough.. long bow cough" sorry bad cough
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I think Bungee should remove the match win requirement. Make progress based on individual performance.
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5 RepliesI know how to counter those guns, shotty to the face bbbyyyyy, queensbreaker bbbyyy, shoulder charge bbyyyy, honestly you can dust anyone no matter what gun they have if you're better and specd for your specific build.
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2 RepliesOn that note , buff sunshot . ace of spades is sunshot with 3 extra perks (other than explosion). I want my first EXOTIC to be usable in pvp and pve(other than very low health enemies).
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3 RepliesI need advice from an average joe on how to get NF. Then I might grind for it.
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7- Replace zen moment with a trash perk like genesis or field prep
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Edited by WulfPak666: 2/6/2019 2:27:30 PMIf you do make it kinetic, it will be way stronger in pve as kinetic guns have a higher crit multiplier, so I'm all for that. If they make it exotic, give it the intrinsic perk "Rapid Hit" cause Not Forgotten has slow reload speed and rapid hit would pair very very well with Magnificent Howl. The whole gimmick of this gun is that it's a 180 that can 3 tap, making it the only gun in it's rpm that can, unless you run Trust and can keep rampage active or have Last Word. So how would that work.. you kill the first guy with 4 Crits, like any other 180, then the next guy dies in 3. Does the perk turn off after that or would you need to get another 4 tap to get another 3 tap or do you just keep getting 3 taps until you reload or miss? If need be, you can remove the overall dmg multiplier from body shots so it HAS to be crits to kill. I mean (especially with Luna) it is pretty easy to land Crits with the 180 handcannons. Also I don't know man, there is a million other reasons why people hate pvp in this game and it's been that way looooong before Luna was introduced. So to say Luna is the biggest reason people hate PvP is a bit much.
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Making them exotic won’t do anything lmao.
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17 RepliesBuff last word so that Luna’s and nf have no business in short range Ofc they will remain valuable to give a reason for people to grind for it Everyone can get their hands on a last word so that solves a lot of the problems
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They should just add more pinnacle weapons to the pool so that it is not just the same 2 guns running crucible.
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2 RepliesBrah your trash & toxic. I grinded the f*** out of comp for months to earn Not forgotten, and you know what ? The only gun that out guns me constantly on a one v one is the last word and that piece is free. Just because you cant get it doesn't mean it doesn't belong, and I earned mine, and the bragging right to go with it. Pre-Forsaken I was a 2.5 kad and now that has since dropped to a 1.9kad I soloed but skill aint something you can take away.
