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11/2/2015 11:17:21 AM
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The truth of DDOS in Trials

Truth is, 99% of players don't even understand DDOS, and how it works. Here's a very basic informative post to help clear the air about all the people claiming "cheaters" and "hackers" plague the trials. If a person in fact does successfully DDOS you, you will NOT be sent to orbit with an error code, or lose connection to bungie's servers. Here's what will happen. Your router shuts completely down. So unless your router goes red and you lose ALL Internet connection, you have NOT been DDOS'd. If you have indeed been hit by a TRUE DDOS you can attempt to find whomever did it and press charges. (Its a crime). If you received an error code during a Trials match and sent back to orbit with a loss, try looking up what the error code means on Bungie.net. It's either due to your Internet, the servers in which pvp games are played, or the connection between your Internet and the server. If you've been sniped through a wall and claim hacks, what truly happened was that you were in fact shot, but lag and damage latency registered late, and when your console caught up to that information and loaded that you died, it will then automatically kill you in order to "fix" the problem. Have you ever sniped someone and the damage on the screen came up late? That's exactly what happened, but you moved behind cover during the loading process. There are other bizarre cases I've seen where after a round your wins were reset back to 0. I have no proof of this but I simply believe it to be a loading error, where the game and server screwed up and skipped over that coding due to a glitch. That's only my guess, but most likely, they aren't hacking you. This isn't the matrix. There are cheaters out there. I've seen them. But they aren't a plague. Out of every trials match I've EVER played, there has never been a cheater. Lag? Check. Latency? Check. Bullshit? Check. Cheaters? Nope. I've seen one cheater once. Believe it or not, a level 8 Sepiks Prime Strike. (I'm not kidding. He was dancing and pointing at Sepiks taking infinite damage and never dying, he later admitted it in a message he sent me after I questioned him about this) So there you go. The more you know.
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  • Edited by VisageOfAnAngel: 11/3/2015 7:41:30 PM
    A "true" DDoS attack does not necessarily have to shut down your router. DDoS == Distributed Denial of Service; meaning more than one machine. DoS == Denial of Service 99% of these types of attacks when it comes to gaming are straight-up DoS attacks. DDoS attacks require the use of a botnet and botnets are expensive to get time on. Home routers also do not generally have enough bandwidth or protection where a DDoS attack is required. A DoS attack has one goal, to flood your router with excessive packets leading to a slowdown/shutdown. The odds of a single user being able to send out enough packets to overload a modern or router to the point of shutdown while still maintaining their connection is fairly slim. The end result is excessive lag which will kick you from a match and provide you an error code. There's a third option that's floating around in most ad-hoc P2P games where whoever has host simply adds the IP address of whomever it is they wish to be removed from the game to their firewall's filter. This is quite legal (D/DoS attacks are usually government tier crimes in most countries) and there's zero way to track it back to the host short of logging into their router and inspecting their filter list. The result of this type of "attack" is that the filtered IP address no longer is making connection to the host and since ad-hoc P2P games require the host to control everything it assumes that other player quit or lagged out. The person with the filtered IP lags out of the match, an error code is given, and a loss incurred. In closing, that shot you got hit by through walls or the person who jumps out of nowhere is definitely lag. The thing you need to do before reporting them is to see if it's a steady stream of lag in the ping meter. If it is then they probably just have a rubbish connection, but if it red bars at convenient times or if the game plays fine except for when heavy ammo spawns or a CP needs to be taken then it's most definitely a lag switch.

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  • I beat a team of lag switchers 2 games in a row what were the odds lol. Also, I have once before had my two team mates get DDOS during trials one after the other because we were winning. But yes I agree mostly lag. This was last trials season idk what the new season is like because I'm tired of this game rn

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  • Actually I've been ddosed before and it just kicks you off Xbox live and phone and laptops will still work but not desktops, I would know. The guys name was like evo something and it was over the fact that I protected my gf and her friend got pissy because I told him to eff off cause he was a fukboi. So unless you wanna edit your post and fix it, Shut up.

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  • Edited by stealthkiller22: 11/4/2015 9:56:06 AM
    everyone router different i have been ddos it kicked me out of game no error code said i couldnt sign into psn network down checked router just internet light went off i couldnt do anything for next 5 mins not even use google on my computer we were winning 3-0 all of sudden match froze when all this shit happened even messaged my mate it was then 2 vs 3 then attacker went to attack my mates as they were still gonna win after it was 3-3 they made it 4-3 then 2nd mate got kicked so it was 3 vs 1

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  • OP doesn't know what he's talking about.

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  • Let me explain a DDoS attack You're holding a funnel. Pouring a tiny stream of water down the funnel. Everything is going smoothly. All the water is falling through the funnel and getting into where it's supposed to go. Then a salty motherfûcker decides to pour a bucket of rocks into your funnel. Now none of your water can flow through the funnel. As there are too many rocks for the funnel to handle and it overflows until there is no more water flowing. No flow at all.

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  • I know I've been DDOSed when my girlfriend and I meet in the middle of the house to ask each other what the -blam!- just happened (her tv show shuts off).

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  • I have to assume that there are a lot of times where random events just appear like cheating. For instance, I was playing ToO with my clan last weekend. We were in the 4th or 5th match of a close series and one of the opposing members popped Hammer of Sol on us just to disconnect at that very same instant. We couldn't have asked for a more convenient time for that particular individual to lose control of his character... and I'm sure the other team called us cheaters because of it. But the guy just happened to disconnect just then...

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  • See that search bar in the top right corner? Type bukaah. Look at his recent ToO games. See the 2v3 games? There are a lot. When I heard about this scumbag, the guy who played against him had to reset his system. The internet worked fine on his computer, yet his xbox couldn't connect to Microsoft. Look again at all those 2v3 games & tell me whether or not he's cheating.

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    • Got really pissed off at some guy dancing around with infinite Hammer of Sol on my team. Just left a bad taste in my mouth, watching him act like a piece of shit in a goddamn Legacy match. Hope he got reported :(

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    • [quote]If a person in fact does successfully DDOS you, you will NOT be sent to orbit with an error code, or lose connection to bungie's servers. Your router shuts completely down.[/quote] Firstly, this statement is false, but I'm curious, if the router shuts down, what happens?? The game will most definitely detect a loss of internet connection, or at the very least an unstable connection, and produce an error code. Second, unless you have an obscenely fast internet connection and a piece of shit gateway your equipment will not just "shut down." The ISPs already limit the bandwitdh of your internet connection, it's not going to just push more data through because a bunch of requests have been sent to your machine. A DDOS attack affects the ISPs routing mechanisms, which in turn affects your internet connection.

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    • There are other ways to screw it up besides DDOS. You can, for example, insert a FIN packet to close the connection. One packet kicks you to orbit. Also, a DOS (distributed or not) could cause serious latency without hammering the player's router completely.

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    • Actually my friend got kicked from the game and still was in my party and received a message from the other team asking him if he liked being kicked. We thought they were just trolling until he sent another message saying good luck with trials because Ill be kicking you the whole time. Sure enough every game we played he got kicked. Explain that.

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    • I think the issue isnt every one claiming DDoS, but people purposely lagging. Usually by uploading/downloading huge files causing large ping spikes making them jump across map from others Pov. Or by knowingly go into PvP with internet that is unstable, which can give advantages.

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      • Sorry mate, you lost me when you said the servers that pvp games are played on. This demonstrates you have no clue what you're talking about since this game uses peer to peer connection, not servers.

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      • Exactly. We got packet'd by this one team and it dc'd my teammate then me one round later. Systematic picking one by one, we each had to has resst our Xboxs and reset modem/router. I have a clip of the kids too but don't really care, I already got to the lighthouse on all 3. What should I do w the 5 min clip that shows them packeting us?

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      • What people don't understand about the cheating in trials, is its just like rng, you can get lucky and never find a cheater, or you can be me and have run into a few. Op can use this in his post if he wants but here is an explanation of what DDoS is and what it means, and chances are you aren't DDoS'd it's more likely to just be a regular DoS attack. DDoS and DoS are essentially the same thing, that both accomplish the same task, the only difference is DDoS is designed to be harder to trace. Now, with that out of the way lets get to this explanation, DoS - Denial of Service Attack DDoS - Distributed Denial of Service Attack Essentially how these two type of network attacks work is by spamming you, the people initiating the attack will send a very large quantity of fake packets of information to your router, in an effort to deny you access to your routers service. I'll give you this metaphor so you can better understand what's actually happening. You're playing a game with your sibling and you are using a deck of cards. The game is you have to sort the deck of cards by value and suit in under a minute. Your sibling stands there and hands you cards as you sort them for the game. (This is the metaphorical equivalent of playing destiny normally, each price of info is taken in by your router and processed and sent to your console) Now the DoS begins, in terms of our metaphor, your sibling now is handing you cards, but some are in a suit you don't recognize, some are made up, some are scribblings on a piece of paper, but you have to sort them all. Now, these fake cards and normal cards are mixed together into one big deck, are handed to you at break neck speeds and just as before you need to finish this task in a minute. Of course you cannot finish sorting the cards at that point, and this is essentially what happens to your router. Just for good measure, DDoS is the same as before except your sibling has a few dozen friends over and he splits the deck evenly between them all and they all hand the cards to you at breakneck speed. Now with DoS and DDoS, you will not get an Internet connect of any type if you were indeed hit with one. When I was, I had to physically unplug my router and wait like 5-10 minutes before I plugged it back in and then I had internet back about 10 minutes after that. I am tired of people saying they get DDoS'd every match because you didn't.

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        • Imagine thinking you can come on to a video game forum and profess knowledge of net code or packet flooding. It's not all kids who read these forums and you sir have much to learn before you attempt to "educate" others on such topics.

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        • Edited by TheCurlyWolf: 11/3/2015 12:15:29 AM
          Errr...not really. I'm a network admin, and my job is all about signal security and integrity. You can be bombarded with junk packets (that is basically what a DDOS is, not mention it's probably not a Distributed Denial of Service which requires a botnet or zombie slave systems, but a plain ol' DoS using on or two systems running a script.). These packets can swamp the router with more requests and info than it can handle, and your connection to Destiny's servers get timed out because your end didn't respond in time (it can't, it's trying to handle all those junk requests and packets). This is why last Christmas many couldn't sign on to Xbox Live and PSN, those services were receiving too many requests/junk and could not service legitimate requests and your connection eventually times out. The reason they shut down the servers at some point is to black out the connection, the botnet stops pinging and sending to those servers; then they analyze data and try and filter out any active botnet devices. An EXTREME DDoS could crash a server, but essentially causing an OS collapse with the overload of data (like a stack overflow) but your run of mill ToO cheater probably isn't investing $3,000 in a botnet.

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          • This happened to me, router went completely off

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          • Very good but let me explain to you the truth of 'game servers', truth is, 99% of people don't understand how games are played on Destiny. I saw this post about how it works one time and it's a really good explanation of how game servers and P2P works in Destiny. [quote]The central server (bungie side) collects and puts clients (your games) into games with another, then designates one as 'the host'. After the initial matchmaking, bungie's servers are out of the picture (more or less). The chosen host by the central server is the one who acts as your 'host' until the game u are you playing is over. Getting lag on your end (red bar) has nothing to do with bungie's servers, as they are out of the picture by the time the ping colors are relevant. You can have the biggest, fattest, most awesome-tastic direct fiber line with all the bells and whistles... and it will mean exactly dick if the game host is on a 'normal/crappy' cable connection. To be absolutely CLEAR: - When you are PLAYING (actually PLAYING) destiny, another player IS your host, ALWAYS. - When you are WAITING (load screens, match-making, etc) to play destiny, BUNGIE is your host, ALWAYS.[/quote]

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            • deckers dont exist yet guys no need to panic

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              • Wow 99% of players? So interesting. Hm, did you know that 84% of players make up statistics on the spot? The more you know.

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                • was ddosed last week, sniped this kid and instantly got booted offline from everything, no error codes no nothing. no devices could connect to my router for 10 minutes. kinda retarded that if you have the knowhow you can see everyones IP adress ingame

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                  • I have been in a game where my game reset 3 times back to 0 we won but i felt bad because we were losing the first two games lol

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                  • Not sure what happens to us 7-0 going to orbit and all of a sudden my freind says "They all got disconnected ha" I was like "I'm the only one here with all of them " They joined there game and got error codes and I was left to die

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