Always a pleasure to do some good research for the community

Seriously this. I would have posted something similar if I had the patience. This post /thread

[quote]All right so I dissagree with a fair few points in this post and I will explain why in a calm and orderly manner as you have seen fit to do so for us. First, watch this video once if you wish or simply the sections I mention below if you want to get straight to the point. [b]1. Damage reduction[/b] I read in your post that Sunbreakers get equivalent damage reduction as other classes such as Blade Dancer, Night Stalker, Sun Singer and Storm Caller. However, if you watch the video between [b]1:25 - 2:22[/b] you will see that, with [b]the same high impact sniper headshot[/b] : Normal Damage (including on Gunslinger) : 417 Most Classes with damage resistance : 209 Voidwalker (poor little guy) : 230 [b]Sunbreaker : 188[/b] Thus, by calculating a simple percent reduction by conparing to the weapons base damage we can find each classes damage reduction while in super Gunslinger : 0% Voidwalker : 45% Everything else : 50% [b]Sunbreaker : 55%[/b] With a Titan's minimum armour being 198, even a titan speced into better recovery or agility would still be able to survive this with life left over, not to mention surving a Golden Gun bullet, a Nova Bomb and quite a few ticks of Storm Caller lightning. [b]2. Character Stats[/b] Now, on to character stats. You say that the Titan is at a disadvantage stat wise due to his agility and regeneration. This is true since this is how classes were built to begin with. However, Titans now have a subclass which allows them to conserve their stat advantage while compensating for the disadvantages quite well. Agility : despite what I have seen of your thoughts on the subject, most of the community agrees that a Titan is still one of the fastest classes due to skating. It might not be as useful in tight spaces or for turning, but for a Sunbreaker with lots of damage reduction that isn't as much if an issue as getting from point A to point B fast, an issue which is solved with skating. Recovery : contrary to what you may believe, Cauterize and Hungering Blade are two very different perks with very different effects. [b]watch video from 0:00 - 0:35[/b] Hungering Blade : only activates on melee or super kill which must both be done in close quarters melee. Additionally, the recovery of Hungering Blade regenrates health first, then shields Cauterize : activates on melee, [b]grenade[/b] and super, two of which can be used over medium to long distance depending on skill. Contrary to Hungering blade, Cauterize [b]regenrates both health and shields at once[/b] resulting in an overall better recovery. [b]Perks and builds[/b] The first and most important point about the Hammer of Sol is that it is very powerful. It will one shot kill anyone whithin it's blast radius, except for a super charged player at the very fringe of the blast, every time without fail. At one point in your post you mentionned Flameseeker and how it was inferior and blocked other perk choices. I agree that Flameseeker is not an automatic godmode and that it's effects are more to tweek your aim and help for general lack of good aiming when in 3rd person, making Explosive Pyre a generaly better choice However, with the aid of Immolation Gauntlets (the only Sunbreaker specific exotic and frankly one of the few viable choices to them at the moment) Sunbreakers are now able to wield both of the previously mentionned perks at the same time, resulting in very large blast radius, very powerful hammers which correct their course when they are within a certain range of the enemy and explode when near as if they had Grenades and Horseshoes. This, in my eyes, is quite powerful indeed. As for your comment that using Forgemaster blocks powerful perks, I vehemently dissagree. As fun as Suncharge and Scorched Earth may be in general, they are not a part of ideal builds in crucible : one forces you to enter melee range which defies the advantage a Sunbreaker has over Blade Dancers and shotguns, the other prevents the use of Cauterize which is pretty much the best perk in its tree. On a closing note, the main reason people are frustrated by Sunbreakers is because of their innability to kill them with normal weapons. As you said, that is a normal thing, a super is a super for a reason and it should be hard to kill a super using regular guns, and indeed it is hard for most. Getting a couple shotgun rounds off or landing a crucial sniper shot is a difficult feat for any player, and one many have devoted much time to perfecting. That is why having the Sunbreaker come in and essentially destroy the general rules by which every other super in the game has functionned for a year (since, as you say, the past is important) frustrates these players who have spent so much time learning to counter supers. I hope you found my comment respectful and enlightening and would much appreciate a well thought out and courteous response when you finish reading it. Ther is no tl;dr, read the post please[/quote] Well written and exactly my opinion aswell. And I Would like to see the statistics of titans average k/d now and before sunbreakers. Would be interesting.

There you go cold hard statistics and logic. "Books, books too heavy for Titans." My problem is not that the sub-class is OP, found ways around Mythoclast and Thorn in Crucible, it's the fact that it wasn't thought through. There would be less need to nerf things if they are balanced to begin with. Do Titans need a class like this to balance with other classes? No. People who complain about Striker and Defender being under power weren't using them right. The thing that started it was a statistic from who knows where that the majority of "top tier players" were playing Hunters. That is only correlative not causative. In other words that is not proof that playing a Hunter gave them the edge to be top tier players. People choose classes based on many things, many of them irrational and aesthetic. Personally I liked the Hunter jump ability in PvE. Who's to say those same "top tier" players might not be "top tier" despite the class they use. Secondly "top tier" is not defined. It is assumed that it refers to crucible players but that isn't clear either because there is a lack of a source. It is also unclear if it refers to Objective (like Control), Deathmatch (like Skirmish/Trials), or Rumble type playlists.

Im not sure where ur trying to go with this post lol. Granted i am a dumbazz but still.

See i understand that but the fact is its now the best offensive class in the game.

You do play titan some what your warlock id like you to play Gg and try going up against a hammer and find that the slight health you have left is petty and annoying seeing you need another gg shot or he'll most likely just regen his health in a second. And yes you main titan.

That's the opposite of taking it out of context. It's not like it matters anyway - I play all 3 classes.

Just because I say I play as a Titan, that does not make anything I say bias

There goes what? Plus you're still changing the subject

I'll edit it if it bothers you so much.

Yeah, I got used to saying that because it's that sh*ts always directed at me so I just learned to assume the position.

Well if you don't really play anymore you will still have an opinion on certainly things, but I see what you mean.