As usual. Hunters are #1 OP again. The Stats prove it. [quote][quote]Remember [url=https://www.bungie.net/en/Forum/Post/150027312/0/0/1]this thread[/url]? Hunter's were 100% sure they weren't dominating the Crucible, but everyone else knew it- and so did the stats. The new Hunter trend is to blame Sunbreakers for being OP and demanding an immediate nerf (even though it took the rest of us a full year to bring down Bladedancers to a resonable level). So here I am, ready to once again whip Hunter's off the board. My source is, as always: http://destinytracker.com/destiny/population [b]PvP melee kills:[/b] 1) Stormcaller at 73,322,908 (5.76%) kills 2) [i]Sunbreaker[/i] at 62,387,962 (4.90%) kills - Oh, second? 3) Nightstalker at 62,352,930 (4.90%) kills [b]PvP super kills:[/b] 1) Nightstalker at 98,208,122 (8.42%) kills (yes, it's a support class so it's greatly favour by having teammates around- KNOW HOW TO PLAY YOUR CLASS) 2) [i]Sunbreaker[/i] at 66,272,382 (5.68%) kills - Oh, second again? 3) Stormcaller at 55,027,545 (4.72%) kills [b]PvP grenade kills:[/b] 1) Nightstalker at 56,711,066 (7.20%) kills 2) Stormcaller at 49,601,294 (6.30%) kills 3) [i]Sunbreaker[/i] at 33,351,906 (4.24%) kills - Oh, last? For those of you who are illiterate and/or lazy, here is the demographical breakdown of the Crucible: ~32% play as Titan, ~8% play as Sunbreakers ~34% play as Warlock, 7% play as Stormcallers ~34% play as Hunter, ~9% play as Nightstalkers I know there will be a huge amount of uneducated, inflated, VIP people who got too much love from their mothers, so let me tell you know: 2% difference is insignificant. If you don't know this already, you need to take a course in statistics (and work on your relationship with your mother). So... Are you saying we need to nerf the least effective PvP subclass? Oh, and just a little FYI, anecdotes aren't considered evidence- anywhere, just because you and your friend(s) had your asses handed to you doesn't mean the subclass is broken or OP, it means you're shit and need to git gud (as you said whenever a warlock/titan complained about Gunslinger/Bladedancer being OP for a full year before the nerf actually came). A dedicated player actually went ahead and tried a couple of scenarios, so let's take a moment to read what he has to say: [quote][b]MongrelShadow14:[/b] [i]Honestly got tired of the complaint threads so I decided to take 2 friends into rumble to test. I first tested the defense both with max armor and with the extra armor you can get with a certain chest piece when using a solar based subclass. results: I had 2 snipers used. stillpeircer and black spindle. still has impact of 31 which covers 1000 yard stare and LDR. black spindle has 37 which covers black hammer and eferdeets spear. the 004 sniper was not used but has an impact of 34. snipers were used at point blank so no damage drop off was present. With max armor the 31 impact snipers leave me with a tiny sliver of health. which means the 34 impact sniper and 37 impact snipers will one shot me. With additional armor the 37 sniper one shot me. which means 3 snipers can currently one shot headshot the sunbreaker when they have the most armor possible. the 34 might be able to do it. and any sniper with a damage proc including the 31 snipers will be able to one shot. Next I tested golden gun. The result was the same both times. Point blank a golden gun will not one shot the sunbreaker. but they both leave you with a sliver of health. so if the sunbreaker has literally taken any damage at all and gets hit by golden gun they will die. It's important to note that you have to fully spec into armor in order to live from golden gun. If you don't take max armor golden gun will one shot you. Lastly I tested the damage of the hammer on direct impacts. To confirm my idea that it has the same damage model of arc blade swipes. When running max armor on blade dancer with the extra armor you take 2 hammers to kill. you're left with half of your red health bar. then I tested it against a person with max armor on storm trance but no extra armor and got the same result. to me this means it's got the same damage of the arc blade melee. If hammer of sol does any extra damage at all its so small that it's not going to matter in 90% of situations. Conclusion: the sunbreaker mid super naturally has a slight armor advantage. and it's honestly so slight it doesn't matter in my opinion. you have potentially 4 snipers with out any special perk roll that can one shot head shot. and if you are using golden gun all you have to do is hit them with anything like a nade or knife and then golden gun and they are dead. I understand people don't like that the sunbreaker can even survive it at all. However they are the tank class and all titan sub classes can tank a golden gun. so it's consistent. and hammer of sol has average damage. needing 2 hammers to kill a majority of people mid super. of course if the target has low armor it's a one hit. But everyone is always telling me max armor is the way to go in crucible. so if you aren't running it you willingly accept the concequences. end of story. I didn't test all sub classes on damage with the hammer because the 2 I did test with different situations yielded the same results. Though if someone proves me wrong with footage and explains the situation i'll retract my statement. I also didn't test sword swings or rockets. Simply because anyone mid super (bar golden gun and radiance with no radiant skin) can tank 2 sword swings and if any of the subclasses (bar the same 2) spec for max armor can survive a rocket. simply put it's not a new thing. armor always protected you from rockets and now from 2 burst deaths. and the swords follow the same damage model as arc blade does. Hopefully this thread gets around and people stop complaining about how tanky they are or how stupid strong hammer damage is. EDIT: I completely forgot to mention the shotgun testing done. I managed to survive a conspiracy D headshot at point blank when I had the max armor+ the additional armor from the chest piece. with out the additional armor from the chest piece I die. So High impact shotguns will one shot sunbreakers if they are headshots 90% of the time.[/i][/quote] I'll update this thread on the go.[/quote][/quote]

bump

I can't prove you wrong it's your opinion

Out of the new subclasses, most pvp super kills

Love it for pve but what I fvcking hate is that when you tether hobgoblins in the fvucking nightfall and they still 1080 no scope you

Triple jump, Shadowshot is great for crowd control and single target DPS considering your whole team can get constant crits without hitting their weak spot. Most of the upgrades for the skills are useful. Can spawn loads of orbs with light of the pack or lockdown for strong territory control. Vanish in smoke for easy revives in chaotic situations too. Sealed ahamkara grasps for 2 smoke grenades even better. There you go.

[quote]title says it all Edit 1: is *drops mic* a meme now? lol[/quote] Nightstalker is the Shit. I main a titan but I constantly find myself switching to my hunter now cuz I love it. I can trap a whole team in pvp and shut down their supers and I make a Shit ton of orbs in pve. It's amazing. The damage I can do when I get the super stuck on a boss is outrageous.

We can't prove you wrong ever because you stated an opinion and nothing we ever say will change your mind. *mic drops*

I don't dislike mine at all. I finally feel useful in pve. I generate more orbs than anyone now. And really help kill large groups of enemies quickly. My assist record since ttk dropped is 98 and I almost feel better about that than my kill stat lmao

Night stalkers are orb machines I love having them around for pve. Unlimited supers!

Sick in pve, can be used veryyy well in pvp. I cant tho i suck at pvp

I'm sorry, but you suck. Nightstalker is a support class. When used properly, you can instantly shut down any super in PVP. You can go invisible with your grenade, as well as disorient opponents. In PVE, you can anchor down a boss increasing the dps your teammates use. You just prove only one thing with your post: you're [b][i]NOT[/i][/b] a team player; you're just a Rambo scrub, and because you have to actually think about others (i.e., teammates) before yourself, which clearly irritates you, you do the subclass an injustice. I main a Titan and it's very satisfying being a defender. The team rallies around you as you work with them to complete an objective. Think before you say something stupid.

[quote]title says it all Edit 1: is *drops mic* a meme now? lol[/quote] The night stalker can cancel supers and increase damage output

Bruh I was hitting 6.0 and 3.6 kd's yesterday with my night stalker

No pop hammer of sol. I hit you with shadowshot....no more super

Learn your class better.

I can shut down any supers you just suck

I find its good in a raid or strike, but if I'm grinding alone.......ya, it kinda sucks.

I made 85 orbs in one strike so please tell me how it sucks, call me Jordan belfORB

...oh, look... another Xbox kid crying because it's past his bedtime...

I haven't played one too much but I really enjoy having one in my group, the spawn a lot of orbs and between weapons of light and their super that makes all hits crit you can burn down bosses fast.

See, finally someone says it. The gunslinger has all these abilities that make it so easy to recharge your melee and grenade, with scavenger, and bones of ahamkara for an extra tripmine grenade The blade dancer's arcblade is kind of risky in pvp with getting mowed down by a shotgun and in pve, especially in nightfalls, that direct approach could get you killed in seconds. However, escape artist with blink strike is really helpful for get always and you get time to recover and get to a distance. Night stalker, however, seems to lack in usefulness. This may be because I haven't used it for a long enough time. I mean, there are three duration grenades, why not make one of them the magnetic grenade? Plus, the super can be used for getaways, but to really use it effectively as a support class you have to use black hole, eliminating the other choices for perks. Plus the final perks are kind of lame.