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Edited by ShadBerzerker11:
10/28/2019 2:28:16 PM
216
New Raids are too mechanic heavy
D2 raids are/have become too mechanics heavy and any one thing could cause a wipe including glitches. It would be nice if we had an assortment of raids where some were less mechanics heavy. Not fun to bring new ppl in because everyone has to have the mechanics down 100%. For example, more raids like kings fall and wotm, less raids like gos and sos. Focused team mechanics and less sub teams doing different mechanics.
Also the armor drop rate in GoS is terrible!
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4 RepliesMy general tips for anyone complaining raids are too hard is join a clan. And if you say ‘but I don’t want to join a clan’ then quite simply, raiding or maybe Destiny in general probably aren’t right for you. This is the reality - they are not just ‘long strikes’ as some people seem to think. They’re much more complex but totally achievable in a decent team of people all willing to work together.
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Did people just forget how mechanic heavy KF & Wrath were? This is the third post I've seen asking for less mechanics & praising those raids.
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Stick with dungeon if u think that is to complex this raid is really easy. The thing about this raid it just doesn’t have much room for error but that doesn’t mean it’s hard it just u have to pay attention.a reall mmorpg Raif is a lot more complex then this were it takes u a few days to beat not a hour or two
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This is bs, the new GoS raid isn’t anywhere near mechanics heavy. The first 2 encounters are very simple and don’t rely too much on mechanics. That raid is all about showing you what to do and then putting it all together at the final boss. The final boss can be mechanics heavy, but with a good team a single screw up won’t lead to a wipe. Recovery is easy if you know what you’re doing. I like the route they went with D2 raids, since post RoI raids were the best in D1. Mechanics make the raid interesting and rewarding to learn. To address the glitches, I expect them. No game really has something like destiny raids do. All the algorithms and coding involved seems very difficult to get perfect, given everything that goes on within just a few seconds.
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1 ReplyEdited by Abyss: 10/28/2019 6:36:30 PMSo you are praising kings fall.... that in the final boss fight if someone missed a single jump your team wiped .... meanwhile the garden of salvation is actually the first time in a while i had fun in a raid in d2's entirety These mechanics are so simple as well and REALLY easy to pick up. Its simply the execution of the more important mechanics that is screws you over like the jumping puzzle of kings falls final boss.. plus even in the third encounter of the garden of salvation which imo is the one where people perhaps struggle the most because of a the tuber strat that suggests rotating the shooters of the eyes depending on their position instead of designating a person a single section to always shoot (the latter strat is way more effective). meanwhile the biggest offenders for being mechanic heavy are in my opinion last wish and spire of stars Kings fall is also the raid that paved the way for all of the mechanic heavy raids to date.
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It’s a raid. Ever play the D1 raids? Yes you could solo them but still.
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2 RepliesWait. King's Fall wasn't mechanics heavy? The final two fights were a nightmare of one person screwing up and forcing a wipe.
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2 RepliesYour opinion is wrong. Datto said in his latest video that raids are too easy. Expect Bungie to make them even more difficult.
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There is a reason vault of glass was recognized as one of the best raids on destiny, it was both challenging, it had its mechanic which wasn’t too hard to figure out, the fights with bosses were engaging, the loot was fantastic, the final boss was memorable etc. on D2 I have never been so bored on a raid to the point I actually had to stay quiet in order to do am encounter, most of the time I just had to listen or call out stuff which compared to vault of glass wouldn’t happen all that much. If you needed to get cleansed in vault of glass you simply ran to where you had to go and regroup with the team, no one had to call it out or anything. If someone died the whole encounter wouldn’t just fall apart either which is why D1 will always be better in every way compared to D2 raids.
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5 RepliesYup, there aren't any 'hero moments' where half of your team is down and yet you're able to still yank out an encounter from the depths. Now if one person misses the one minor thing, raid over, wipe.
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No. GoS isn't even that hard or mechanics heavy.
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1 ReplyThis was definitely the case with raids like the Leviathan and SoS and debatably Last Wish, but I feel the more recent raids have definitely been less mechanics-heavy. CoS really only has two mechanics used in the entire raid: switching buffs and needing buff/ unbuff to kill things. SotP really just has reading the map and that tells you how to do everything. GoS really just has the tether, motes and enlightened, however admittedly the final boss is a large difficulty spike.
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Kinda doesn't make much sense to me to ask for less mechanic heavy raids and then ask for more raids like king's fall. Don't get me wrong, spire of stars is kind of a mess (loot isn't even worth the effort), but I'd say GoS is fine since it can be a bit forgiving in some parts if your team is good enough. The mechanics themselves in that raid also aren't really big of a deal, aside from the final encounter which...it's the final encounter so it's supposed to step it up in difficulty. Legit, the second encounter in that raid is probably the easiest encounter in D2.
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1 ReplyI just think they should start making prestige raids again. Do it like Kings Fall where they make the prestige version of the raid first, then water it down for normal mode. I think the GoS final boss would make a great prestige mode, but it’s a struggle for normal mode, especially since there is no easier mode to learn most of the mechanics on
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12 RepliesI've said it before and I'll say it again, game is getting harder and giving shittier rewards, for me it's ok, tough is getting less and less fun, and more inaccessible to average players, to the point that in about a few months only the "elitists" will play it
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4 RepliesI agree maybe just one run and gun raid would be nice.. something like Crotas End where the difficulty is the architects and not necessarily mechanics that need degrees in quantum physics to figure out.
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4 RepliesNo, they're mechanically vague. Mechanics that make no sense and have no in game application beyond that raid are nonsensicle invisible barriers to create the illusion of difficulty. Fact is, if the game had objective markers and explained how the simonsays simulator worked, everyone would clear raids. All the time. This is the only way Bungie can make sure content is exclusive to a subset of players so small they can pretend it's "hard". They aren't hard. They're boring as -blam!-. Destiny raids have been pretty bad since VOG. And I didn't mind the VOG too much since it AT LEAST flowed decently. D1 raids definitely steal the show in that aspect but D2 it's a mess. I'd love to take a look under the hood of this game and see how the raids were intended to be beat. Often we can't even do that. A cheese is built right in. D2 raids are exactly the kind of content every developer should study. So they know exactly what they should never make.
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2 RepliesDon't know how hard it is to make a bullet sponge raid. Many wave of enemies to fight while fighting the boss. Give the boss 50 million health or some arbitrary number of health. An between 6 people running high damage supers and weapons can't melt the boss easily.
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2 RepliesWait but how are they supposed to make raids "harder" or more challenging without emphasizing mechanics? Surely no wants a raid which is only challenging because the enemies are bullet sponges and/or do more damage? I don't find those to be particularly enjoyable, you're doing the same thing as you do in all the other content, it will just take more time. People will do what they always do and find the safest position to hide and plink away at all the enemies until they die.
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1 ReplyThe raid is gorgeous and I like it, and the mechanics wouldn't be so bad if it wasn't reliant upon lag . The way it is, though, one person with a bad connection will screw up the whole thing. I still think there should be no limit to resurrections and the timers should be slightly relaxed a little. At least for first run-throughs, and "normal" modes.
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It surprises me that people get overwhelmed by the mechanics of raids. They're stupidly simplistic. Garden for instance: Encounter 1: kill hydra. stand in a line from box to a wall. Pick up harpy puke. Kill vex. Encounter 2: stand in a line to link a box and a pole. Kill vex. Encounter 3: team one - shoot the red lights. Team two - take turns playing gambit. Encounter 4: shoot the boss to open portal. Take turns playing gambit. Stand in a line to link boxes and pole. Stand in a line to link pole and cross. Kill vex. Kill boss. Prosper. Really, it's not that bad. It's like people want the only part of the game that takes any brainpower to be a braindead activity. And that's basically the point of menagerie. Seriously if you take to seconds to make a very very small mental checklist of what the mechanics are, you can beat these things.
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7 RepliesBungie missed a great opportunity. All strikes should have at least one aspect of mechanics from a raid. This would give every player a chance to see how the mechanic works. Raid leaders would have a hand teaching raids to new players as well. "This next room is like the stage before the boss in Pyramidion, step on your plates and cover your buddies blind spots" Also, if players are having a hard time with an encounter they can go run that specific strike to get better acquainted with the mechanic. I think it would add to the consistency of the story and help to keep everything somewhat connected in game.
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1 ReplyCrota and VoG are the best raids in my opinion because the focus was more on having fun than perfect communication.
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2 RepliesDatto just made a new video. He wants difficulty levels added to raids... Guess where the raid exotic catalysts are going to be hid behind when they come out. Dattokeep continues to get better, right?
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1 ReplyThe only raid mechanic that I thought was fun and well made/made sense was the whole gathering the three keys to open the doors in the Leviathan raid. It was simple to understand and teach but challenging enough to keep the pressure on as you and your team coordinate add management, key defense, and key gathering. The adds got progressively tougher and more numerous but the strategies were the same, just more skill and coordination was required. It felt great and it was exciting...until you got to the overly complicated mechanics behind the doors. Those were an absolute b*tch to figure out and to teach to the new guardians going through for their first time. 😧
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4 RepliesI waited till I got to 960. Masterworked my Izanagi. Have my Recluse and a heavy machine gun. Watched YouTube for a guide. Ok let's go! Damn. Must have emblem. Oh well. I'll stick to crucible...
