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originally posted in:Secular Sevens
8/6/2013 4:17:36 AM
16

Hey do mathematical / logical truths rely on the physical universe or what.

Because if they don't I think that lends credence to the claim that the universe is contingent, and while that doesn't directly imply a deity (let alone the Judeo-Christian one), it certainly makes explicit atheists look a bit silly.

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  • What you're touching on here is epistemology. What you're trying to distinguish are two types of knowledge. We classify knowledge into two categories: •a priori •a posteriori [i]A priori[/i] knowledge is independent of experience. E.g. 1 + 1 = 2 or the statement "All bachelors are unmarried." Knowledge classified into this category is always true and does not depend on our experience for us to know. I don't need to go out into the world and find every bachelor to know that every bachelor is unmarried. [i]A posteriori[/i] knowledge is dependent on our experience of it. An example of this would be the statement "Some bachelors are unhappy." We cannot know whether this statement is true or not until we've polled every bachelor. I don't believe that a priori knowledge is dependent on the physical laws of our universe. I do agree, however, that our universe is contingent, but I don't think that a priori knowledge can really help us deduce that. A posteriori knowledge, however, does (e.g. evidence that points to the Big Bang Theory, the most accepted explanation of the beginning of our universe by physicists and other scientists). Thankfully, you're logical enough to see that just because it is most probable that our universe is contingent, it does not necessitate the Christian god is the one who created it, or any other divine deity or even something that was sentient. Also, when it comes to mathematics, I would be skeptical of the posts that say our universe's mathematics or logic would be invalid or could be invalid in another universe, if they do exist. 1 + 1 always will equal 2. To reduce this, I would ask whether the concept of "true/false" could be different. The answer is no. Another example would be existence vs. non-existence. This is a basic element of mathematics. There is no in-between. If someone does argue that 1 + 1 could equal something other than 2 in another universe, then they are changing the definitions of what those things are, and thus would not be talking about the same thing.

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