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7/20/2017 5:50:09 PM
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Those few cheese instances are not grounds for changing the pace of mission and strike play. They better ramp it up a bit, those changes in conjunction with the movement changes have made the game feel much much slower all around.
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It's not the cheeses themselves specifically. I think it's more than attitude we have. Supers are like our trump card, supposed to turn the tide with a flash of power. But people are treating it like a heavy weapon. I think the direction Bungie is trying to take the game, is one where we use our supers when we need to, not just because it's there. Like a real wildcard. As I've said previously many times. Everybody on the forums agrees that they hit super cool down too hard. Everybody thinks they should reduce the cool down. The issue is by how much.
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Modifié par KeNzEn : 7/20/2017 6:14:47 PMAt least back to D1 levels. I could care less what PvP thinks, they've already done enough damage trying to find balance between the game modes.
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So if it was noticeably faster than the beta, but not as fast as Destiny 1 (so in the middle) why would that be bad? When you say "at least" to D1 levels, you mean you'd like it if the recharge rate was faster?
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Yea, D1 levels are perfectly acceptable. I guess I can't connect to your argument or stance. I have not witnessed a negative with supers in PvE outside the cheese instances we spoke about before. Even with the cheese there is no reason to slow the pace of PvE when we have way more enemies on the field of battle to contend with from what I've see thus far. You can clearly feel in the beta the pace of battle has been slowed dramatically. Why would I agree to slower gameplay in PvE when there is not a negative to the current levels??? I wouldn't accept anything less because the current setting are fine, if it ain't broke don't mess with it. With that being said we know why... years of "Fist of Panic" bitching has brought this game to new lows... Omg I got killed by a super!!! Nerf!!!!! -blam!- me.
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If D1 levels were fine, then Bungie would have left them alone. Bungie could easily have left PvE recharge rate alone. But they chose not to. Because they want it to be less frequent, which also makes it more meaningful. This is Bungie's vision. Get with it and stop blaming PvP.
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Dude you're clueless... where have you been? This is not a new argument.
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I'm not saying it's a new argument. I'm saying that's not the ONLY reason.
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I don't see how they could have different rates between game modes, it's never been the case in the history of the game. This is clearly a PvP effect.
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What about Mayhem? Trickle? Daybreak? Obviously they can affect the super charge rate. They want to keep it the same, but currently it only works for PvP. What I'm saying is that they should buff the recharge rate for PvE a little. If they want it to be slow, okay, I understand that, but it can't be so slow that it takes away from the fun. That's my point. You PvE players need to accept that they want it slowed down.
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I don't have to accept anything. I just won't buy it. If there going to dumb the game down and strip the one thing away that made the game play sticky and engaging then I'm out.
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What I'm saying is that we should get a compromise. Reduced, but not as reduced as we just experienced. If super frequency is the only thing you liked then yea you should probably leave and never come back. By all means, you need to do nothing except eject the disc and delete this app.
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Of course super frequency is what I liked, it set the tone for encounters, where and when to pop it. The devs from Vidocs for D1 talked about this very topic all the time the whole "30 seconds of fun". That's what they built and for that reason they intended the game to be played as such. Taking that away can backfire on them. That 30 seconds of fun is what kept people playing even when there was nothing to be gained...The game was fun!
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Yes, but we can't have 30 seconds of fun...every 30 seconds. Do you see what I mean? It takes away from everything else. The fun will come, just a bit slower.
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Why can't we? And you're being a bit extreme when you say every 30 seconds, when you said 2-3 minutes before. Of all the things in Destiny that needed attention this was not one of them. Never going to see it any other way. I've put up with the content droughts thousands of repetitive strikes played etc...because of the gameplay, you mess with that and create a negative...you're blowin it in my opinion.
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Modifié par ThyGreatestFlame : 7/20/2017 9:04:05 PMYes I exaggerated but the point I am trying to make with that, is that of instead we have 30 seconds of fun every 5 minutes instead of 2 or 3, that would not be so slow or so bad.
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It can be when we now have double or more threats on the battlefield! Inverted spire strike, there are two instances when you get swarmed by hounds, melee on cool down, grenade on cool down, super on cool down...enemies are to close to engage with guns due to movement and the fact that they are literally on top of you. Now I've run this strike probably close to 50 time now, do you know how many deaths happen in these encounters alone? This is just bad!!! Those enemies are even hard, you just don't have to utility to deal with them other then running away or jumping! If you're gonna increase the enemy count why not leave it alone. You've essentially created the same level of difficulty for the 3 minute gaps! We should never in an engagement not have the tools to deal with said engagement. Not good!
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You're talking about near the drill sites right, where you have to use the Cabal cannons? I've said elsewhere that we are made to go long stretches without our super, and then struggling unnecessarily. Those moments that you describe are prime moments for using a super. But it needs to be those moments ONLY. I think that's what Bungie is trying to do by reducing the cool down, it just didn't work on this go around.
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Yea, but they can't dictate when we decide, that negatively effects gameplay. if I have no other choice but to use my super at specific instances because I don't have the utility for the engagement. Might as well at that point put the game on rails if they get to choose when I use my abilities. Now, that is just a strike, scale that to a nightfall or a raid and there is no way the community is going to accept this change...just my two cents.
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I think they need to increase the charge that each enemy gives you. Then, when there are less enemies, it won't charge as fast, but then when you get swarmed, it will charge faster and can give you the boost you need.
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Now that's not a bad idea!
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It's the result of good discussion. It's as much your idea as it is mine
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It was a good discussion, clearly we care about the state of things, comprise doesn't escape me either, I like you have a perspective and passion for a game that has captivated me since E3 2013 by what it can be in terms of its potential. I know there are hard decisions by leadership at Bungie to be made, that doesn't escape me either. However a few key ingredients have given this game its staying power...and those things are fragile, tweaks in either direction could really upset the whole order of things. And so evolution is necessary but caution is a must when we're talking about this particular ingredient. I want Destiny to be the best it can be, like you. The troublesome part and why I don't envy Bungie is that everyone has a different opinion. It's conversations like this that NEED to happen to flesh out the differences and find compromise. Thanks for engaging and pushing, truly appreciate it guardian!
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You put it well, likewise!
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Yea cause you know best right? The reality is the super DOES effect the entire follow of play! If you didn't think so then you wouldn't have posted your original stance. Come on man...
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Yes, I know that supers have a profound effect on gameplay. Why the -blam!- do you think Bungie reduced the recharge? It's obviously because they want us to use it less. I'm not the one who asked for slower recharge. Do you understand that? Bungie made that decision all by themselves. THEY DONT LIKE HOW MUCH WE WERE USING OUR ABILITIES. THEY. NOT ME. BUNGIE. So they reduce the charge rate. We can all see that it makes the gameplay slower. Couple that with low power ammo availability and the game feels like walking pace. Boss fights feel.. grueling. I agree!!!! That's why I said they should buff the charge rate a bit. So it doesn't feel this slow and grindy. Just because I don't want it to be at current levels it does not mean that I want PvE to be boring!!! I want supers to be effective, but they can't be so effective that we can rush through PvE and that the game becomes easy. A lower recharge rate works. It's a good idea. It's just that this application was too much. That's all I'm saying.
