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9/9/2016 10:52:03 AM
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The fallen aren't actually evil?

If you think about it, the fallen never had any direct correlation with the darkness, they are considered minions of the darkness because we called them that. In reality, the fallen are just like us. They are a race on the brink of extinction just trying to survive. They even worshipped the traveler, or as they call it, "The Great Machine." All the times we fought them, they've been fighting for their survival, not our destruction. The fallen are just trying to rebuild their old glory and honor, while trying to resist extinction from our hands. Therefore, the fallen aren't really evil, we are the real monsters, we're no better than the vex, hive and cabal.
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  • Evil to us. Kinda like saying the [url=http://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_law]-godwinslaw!-[/url]'s weren't evil. But they both commited mass genocide.

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  • I only consider the taken and hive truely evil. The rest not so. The fallen want their God back and will do anything to get it, but they took the wrong approach and thought they should kill us, cabal just want resources or maybe flee from oryx or study the traveller in secret, and the vex (now this is just my theory, not nessacarily true) only began to worship the darkness to try and defeat oryx, they are a defense mechanism from Charlemagne who made them and became their first mind to defend humanity (notice how the vex never attacked us until provoked, and still don't attack earth, plus they worship Rasputin and seem to know when he's going to strike, also "an evil so dark it despises other evil, maybe because that was their original function, destroy any evil attacking humanity, because oryx is darker), but due to their ability to time travel, all of them worshiped the darkness, and became a sort of evil, though a part of Charlemagne still exists and controls them to a certain extent.

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    4 commentaires
    • They shot me first so they are evil..

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    • They're not evil, they're desperate, and that makes them even more dangerous.

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    • Earth is pretty much under Fallen occupation. If this game was rated M there would be more details on the genocide the Fallen committed.

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      • Modifié par Milo : 9/13/2016 1:30:36 AM
        What if in Destiny 2 Bungie takes a Halo 2 approach and makes The Fallen our allies? Like combine our efforts to fight off The Darkness. We already have Variks, so they wouldn't be too foreign to us.

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        • 1
          Oh the Eliksni want us dead. They think we stole their Traveler, and want to kill us all. However, they are just like us in terms of once being children of Light.

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        • C'mon Bungie, let us go recruit the Exiles by rite of combat for Variks already! Obviously not all would join, so there would be no need to redo events on the Moon, but it would open the door to events like "protect Eliksni from attacks by Fallen House (insert name here) while they evacuate" and "Capture Fallen Ketch for use by New Eliksni House". Thoughts?

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        • New raid "Wrath of the Machine" Fight against: fallen Fallen name for The Traveller: The Great Machine Possible revelations about the travelers intentions may be ahead

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        • This is how I see it: Humans and Fallen are alike as you said. They just want their Great Machine back. Cabals just arrived to Mars to escape the Hive (They're a jungle species, hence why they need masks to breathe the Martian air). I don't know what the Vex are up to, or if they were ever here in the first place (weird time theories). Lastly, the I know that the Hive are the direct product of the Darkness.

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        • I should mention that they attacked us first without trying to establish contact with us. They just assumed we stole the traveler and slaughtered us for no reason. I might also say that the fallen are doing somewhat better than we are. They control almost all of earth and hold a few areas on Venus and the moon. They're just fighting to get the traveler back, and they think that can only be accomplished through our destruction.

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        • Tell that to those who died at Twilight Gap and the Battle of Six Fronts when the Fallen attacked the last city, heroes like Ana Bray who were killed permanently by the fallen. Do they have their reasons? Sure, but that doesn't change the fact that they are our enemy. If they get their way humanity goes extinct, so it's as much a fight for survival for us as it is for them.

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        • They were once very proud and honourable creatures. Every House lived in harmony. There was no ether scarce. No servitors or even dregs. They were Eliksni. Great and powerful and all around noble. When the Traveler left....well the one Kell that pretty much was their idol Chelchis stayed to fight and died. They lost their god. Their most idolized Kell was dead. They fell into savage ways. Their life force ether was drying up. They discovered or created the servitors to help with the ether. Then came their Dark Ages. Left to make their own existence in the void of space. Houses fell and Kells died. New Houses were created with new systems of hierarchy. Like tithing in the Hive ether was given as means to fight and be pirates. Docking arms became a new punishment for dregs. Its quite sad. Then after years of surviving...they found their god. They weren't Eliksni though. They were Fallen. Warped and scarred from space. They saw their god and wanted it back. They think they earned it. They ravaged humanity. They destroyed cities. They thought it left because of weakness. So they were going to prove their strength. Millions dead. But so were there for them. They knew without Traveler like us theyd die. But they lost their honour. Parlay and diplomacy replaced by piracy and savagery. They need the Traveler but have forgotten that we need it too. Have we proven we need it though? Thousands dead at our feet from magic and guns. Fallen wish to prove their worth. By any means. Yes they are now what we call evil. But they wish to survive. Thousands of years lost to these Fallen. Maybe theyve forgotten how to show honour and compassion. House Devils are exactly that. Devils. They pillage and scavenge. But look at Winter. They dig for information not mass genocide anymore at least. Even the Fallen are breaking apart like the Guardians have. House Exile is like Sunbreakers or Osiris. We think Osiris is evil not just for his sick tournament he puts on. House Exile may think the others are evil for what theyre doing. And no House Exile did not massacre the Moon staff. Crota and his merry band of psychopaths did that. House Exile just took up residence away from Winter Kings Devils and Wolves among tge darkest of our foes they never expected us to go back to the moon. Now their home is being invaded by us so they defend it. We are always on the precipice of Light and Dark. Look at our weapons our abilities. Look at what weve done. No good guy can totally wipe out a species Gods without being seen as evil. No bad guy could help the people of earth build the last city. We choose what our guardians do. No just because of puppeteer controls but because we are forging our Destiny. Ten fold we need to wipe Devils off the map. And sorry but i side with House Wolves in trying to kill the Queen. Slavery never worked on earth why should it in space.

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          • Modifié par Oddish43 : 9/10/2016 8:16:49 PM
            As far as I can tell, the Fallen and the Cabal are not minions of the Darkness. The Taken, Hive, and Vex are. The Taken are controlled by Oryx, the Hive serve Crota, and the Vex are controlled by the amorphous thing at the heart of the Black Garden. The Fallen are the smashed and nomadic remnants of a civilization, and the Cabal are part of an interstellar empire of some sort. We don't know if it's brutal but basically benevolent like Rome, or something more in line with 1930's Germany.

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            • Well you have a point but then again... they are here.. in our world trying to take back something that was never theirs. Invading our world to take back the traveler regardless of their past is an act of war. Asides... when i peacefully walk by them they shoot first.

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            • Yeah their story is actually quite tragic and kinda makes you feel sorry for them. They're basically mad at the Traveler for abandoning them to the darkness

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              • Eliksni aren't evil. Fallen are.

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                • True for the most part, but the problem is that the Eliksni attacked us (at Twilight Gap) in an attempt to take the Traveler back. Again, they were doing this as a means for survival, but what if instead they had attempted to negotiate with us or formed an alliance with the first Guardian orders? Variks is proof that not all Eliksni are too proud to bend the knee, so maybe there would have been Eliksni Guardians.

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                • Modifié par Forever277 : 9/10/2016 10:40:57 PM
                  it's all a matter of perspective really, all the races are on the side of good as far as they see it. except maybe the vex and hive

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                • By that logic then nothing is evil in this game since everything is trying to survive, the hive are trying to eliminate us as a threat to survive. Same for cabal and same for vex.

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                  • Their trying to take back the traveler

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                  • But didn't Pera Venj said the assassins Fallen murdered some of the people like crazy during Reef Wars or something at the City?

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                  • First thing they did when they saw me was shoot!

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                  • The Fallen were not evil. The Traveler aggravated them into fighting us.

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                  • Modifié par Bump : 9/10/2016 2:59:22 PM
                    That's probably the reason they're attacking the city. I also think void energy is connected to the advances of the fallen golden age. Notice how Servitors, the remains of a fallen golden age (mentioned in the Grimoire for Servitors), are the only the fallen enemies to use void energy? This is excluding the fallen S. A. B. E. R. but it's interesting to note. Void energy, after all, is a very mysterious energy with a lot of potential, and it would take an advanced civilization to be able to harness it like the guardians can. Our ghost occasionally calls fallen idiots, but we don't give them enough credit really. Edit: Honestly, saying that the fallen aren't evil is kind of one sided. They're not evil, really, but they're a major threat to the city, and their actions toward humans during the collapse were not justified, even if they are trying to reclaim the traveler.

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                  • The house of light is a "group" created for some fallen who joined the city. They follow the traveller

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