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#feedback

5/13/2016 1:04:36 AM
138

This week's Nightfall really exposes all the poor PVP>PVE decision plus more

This is NOT a 'Bungo pls' post but more along the lines of constructive feedback. For anyone who does not know, the Nightfall this week is the 'impossible to find' Taken Winter's Run strike. The modifiers are specialist, exposure, trickle and fresh troops. [i]As a side note Fresh Troop has been the Weekly Heroic Strike Playlist modifier for 8 months now, change it[/i]. Exposure means you don't get your shields back once you take damage, trickle reduces all ability recharge rates to a crawl (Radiance only gives you 2-3 grenades). Assuming you want to attack the Nightfall in earnest and not blast through it you immediately get punished by a severe lack of ammo. During the section in The Cinders I actually ran out of ALL AMMO 3-4 times. Let that sink in for a moment, I actually on several occasions had no primary, no special and no heavy. At that point your abilities would probably be a good fallback but you can't use them because of the trickle modifier. Everyone misses the occasional shot but even when picking up ammo the amount you get back is so minuscule it goes just as fast as it arrives. Especially given how aggressive The Taken enemies typically are. For most of the no ammo moments I had to wait for the game to give me ammo out of nowhere because enemies weren't dropping any. By the time I got to the boss section I just wanted the whole affair over with. When the boss finally died the two blue engrams that awaited me reminded me why I don't both with nightfalls all that often. The rewards needs to be cranked up during the activity not just post-activity. In addition, prior to year 2 Ice Breaker, Black Hammer and Gjallarhorn were all nerfed in favor of encouraging players to not camp and shoot from a safe distance. However with no ammo, no abilities and no shields - this is the most pragmatic strategy. It goes against everything these nerfs were intended to do. On top of this, the Archon Priest (Taken or not) is yet another boss with a potential 1 hit kill AOE attack if you get anywhere near. The enemies in that area often get shielded by Taken Goblins and there are Taken snipers everywhere. Why bother playing any other way but from a safe distance? TL;DR - unneeded PVE ammo nerfs coupled with modifiers that shouldn't be paired together make a Nightfall that should be fun but challenging into boring grind (if you want to take it on in full).
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  • Patience and time. 22,000 something a headshot on the bosses. Sword is crazy. Any arc fusion rifle vaporizes. Zhalo is just mean. My friend and I laughed all the way through the nightfall.

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    • A high impact sniper(black spindle) with WoL and a tether melted the boss before the adds could even spawn.

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    • This is going to sound a viciously cruel comment, but the issues you've pointed out reflect more on a lack of skill and planning than a lack of ammo. I say this for very good reasons, so please hear me out. Earlier this week, a friend of mine and I two-manned the Nightfall a grand total of 8 times in succession. On our first run, we even gave ourselves a unique challenge of being forced to only Fusion Rifles. I ran Telesto and he ran Queenbreaker's Bow. We only ran out of ammo at the boss and only because we played it safe and camped on the rock instead of actually staying in the arena. After all, it is hard to pick up ammo when you're being a coward hiding up in the rocks, but that's why Bungie gave us synths isn't it? We knew what we were up against. We didn't even have maximum reserve ammo for our weapons, but we pushed through. We planned out builds, we picked weapons that fit our playstyle and complemented each other, and we proceeded to utterly devastate the strike time and time again with minimal problems. If you found yourself in a situation where you were COMPLETELY out of ammo, you did something very wrong. You either wasted too much primary ammo on Majors instead of Special/Heavy, you used your trickle-limited combat abilities really poorly, or you just chose some bad weapons to go into the encounter with. It is impossible for me to understand how you fully depleted your ammo multiple times throughout a single run unless you were running this thing solo. I understand people do it on a weekly basis, but they understand the risks and limitations that go along with that. They plan it out ahead of time. Surely you, and others like you, are capable of doing the same. I am not going to hide behind the guise like I don't understand why you are quick to bring up the Year 1 Go-To weapons (Icebreaker, Black Hammer, Gjallarhorn) because I used Icebreaker like a crutch. I didn't want to actually become a skilled player back then. It was easier to "play it safe" and just trying to survive, but it was also extremely boring. I embrace the challenges the game sets up and I purposely try to take things to the next tier because I find the challenge to be fun. I know that not everyone else feels that way, but they are also so quick to say make an argument that is tantamount to "I need a crutch because I want it!". You can still play it safe, you know. Seriously, Double Fusion Rifle Ammo + Queenbreakers Bow + Second Thoughts and a few Synths and its all the same. Synths aren't even hard to get anymore. I buy close to 100 a week just because I have an excess of glimmer and it is something easy to spend it on. The worst part is that I only play for like 10 hours a week, so you do the math. The mixture of modifiers and player's own limitations are why I enjoy the nightfall. If you want to go into something and wipe it out like its a joke, go run Strikes. Complaining that content that is supposed to be a challenge (and is when compared to Challenge of the Elders) is too difficult is petty. Before I wrap this up, I also want to point out a major error in your argument: Your topic title is about PvP changes affecting PvE, yet you spend far more time complaining about the mixture of modifiers than you do actually making points to make this part of argument even apply. The closest you come is the following paragraph: "In addition, prior to year 2 Ice Breaker, Black Hammer and Gjallarhorn were all nerfed in favor of encouraging players to not camp and shoot from a safe distance. However with no ammo, no abilities and no shields - this is the most pragmatic strategy. It goes against everything these nerfs were intended to do." Mind you, these were made at the end of Year 1 BEFORE the PvP Nerfs were implemented. You openly ignore the fact that you can get a large number of perks to help keep ammo in your reserves with Y2 weapons: Partial Refund, Triple Tap, Rescue Mag, Replenish, Performance Bonus, and even Perfectionist. A lot of these perks are underrated, but absolutely SHINE in situations like what we experienced with this Nightfall. Seriously, Rescue Mag is probably the strongest perk for Exposure since you spend most of your time floating around that critical level, meaning there is a 25% chance of getting a whole clip back just by taking any minor amount of damage. The weapon doesn't even need to be active to it to work. The PvP nerfs amounted to literally nothing. The issue is that you can't adapt. Take some time and figure out what a functional loadout for you REALLY is and then get back in the game.

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      • Well written. Fully agree. Bungie: Give us back our reserve ammo. Get rid of the crappy modifiers. Try making the game fun. The result might surprise you.

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      • BUNGIE, GIVE US BACK OUR GOD DAMNED RESERVE AMMO!

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      • Edited by Guardian5429: 5/16/2016 7:13:27 PM
        IDK, IMHO, this week was the easiest Archon- related strike I have ever faced. Had to alter my modus operandi at the Big Boss. But an easy three runs and done. Each seemed easier (and quicker) than CoE when doing points this week for a single toon. Easiest, by far, was my Hunter in retrospect, but it actually took the longest because it was first and I didn't quite know what to do yet... Scout rifle, fusion, and rocket launcher was best loadout IMHO. Used Pike for the middle to conserve ammo. And a little stealth and shotgun for spammy mid-boss types... Can't wait till next time. (Something I never thought I'd say about the old Archon. But the Taken one seemed to be a pussy in comparison to the old gun in his cell guy) Bring on Omnigol, I wanna make her scream. ;-)

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      • I soloed the NF this week. Died once with self res. Only ran completely out of ammo once at the boss. Just gotta play it smart, camp a lot, and make that ammo run whenever you get the chance

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        • as long as the pvp players are happy bungie ignore us pve players what i am trying to say is BUNGIE ONLY CATER TO PVP CRYBABIES

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        • Did I bump this? No? Bump

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        • Aren't Nightfalls supposed to be hard? Just saying.

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          • The ammo nerf is ridiculous! I swear I can go a whole area without even finding a green brick and they said they've increased the drop rate? Bullshit!

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            • Bungie pve boss logic: Taniks for example, Fully automatic rocket launcher to destroy you from any range. Instakill floor stomp of you get within 30ft of him. It used to be worth it to shotgun bosses for massive damage, now that's not even worth it anymore.

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            • This game turned into a big pile of sh!t after all the nerfing and nerfing they have done. Keep up the good work guys

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            • Bungie doesn't give a shit what their players want. Simple as that.

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            • Ive been stating for a while, if you use a three of coins on your first nightfall run on a character, your guaranteed an exotic engram drop along with your post game rewards! They need to return nightfalls to there original glory!

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            • https://www.bungie.net/en/Forum/Post/204229728/0/0

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            • Bump

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            • Edited by Aulakauss: 5/15/2016 12:57:34 AM
              If you have Queenbreaker's Bow, that has a larger backpack as it classes as Fusion Rifle. Use your +[TYPE] Ammo armor pieces wisely. I finished it after my team quit out at the boss once, and again with two people using: Warlock//SUNSINGER//328L Notable perks used: Fireborn, Firebolt Grenade, Angel of Light - Hawksaw (For redbar adds, Axion Darts) - Queenbreaker's Bow (For Yellows, distance engagement, Boss damage, Arc shielded enemies) - Baron's Ambition (Arc Damage) Using caution, Self-Res as a safety assurance feature (only had to use it once each run, and it was my fault for being overly aggressive) in combination with Special Synths, some tactical kiting and use of Angel of Light to peek over stuff to take shots, I was able to do it. Was it a pain in my ass? Yeppers. Was it feasible? Yes it was. Was it fun? ..Not particularly. ..However, I have no idea how I'd have managed it without Queenbreaker. Seriously, that thing saved my ass. ADDITION: Exposure isn't what it once was. Think of your base HP bar section as your Shields/Health in a normal mode. It regens moderately quickly and seems to take about as much damage to deplete as a regular allotment of Shields/Health; when it turns white again, it's basically equal to you being fully recharged. I abused Exposure to my advantage and it ended up making this possible where I think I would have failed without it. If you hang back for a bit and let yourself get to about half charge (it does recharge slowly on its own despite what the modifier description states), you actually gain a buffer to abuse for short runs from cover to mop up Goblins or grab munitions.

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            • Edited by The 7th fall: 5/15/2016 12:24:09 AM
              Don't forget that Bungie put an invisible barrier near the rocks on the Cliffside where it was safe to snipe enemies and the boss himself without having to go out in the thick of the mobs. This nightfall would definitely have to be the worst because I was constantly running out of special and primary ammo... to top it off I get crap rewards from the nightfall AND that twitchy Aksor didn't drop his exclusive shotgun when I killed him 3 times. I dunno why Bungie made us so pathetically weak in Y2 for nightfalls, back then even if it was just for 10 minutes it was fun and I felt powerful... now my guns are not even shadows of their former selves, my abilities do buggar all most of the time, the rewards from nightfalls are mostly crappy now, no flaming skull buff or rep buff for the week, and no fun nor challenge.

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            • Just did a nightfall, ran out of special while at the boss. Had already used a heavy synth so was on cooldown. Saw a brick of special across the map, remembered my sniper has shoot to loot.....oh yea, no special ammo to shoot. LoL Wish Bungie Would put the shoot to loot perk on primaries again. I so miss that blue scout I had with shoot to loot.

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            • It's stupid. Sometimes the ground is covered in bricks but other times I can go 30 minutes without getting a single ammo drop.

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            • Edited by Snake: 5/14/2016 4:18:41 PM
              i would prefer if nightfalls went back to year 1 styles with a random burns and shield match and kick to orbit on team wipe rather than this shitty trickle and exposure bu11sh1t almost everyweek which creates camping parties and makes the nightfall last 3 times as long as it would have in year 1. year 1 also alowed you to use different subclass' in the nightfall for fun. year 2 (more or less) focus' on a single subclass for safety. also give back the good old flame head and boosts for completing it.

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              • Did the nightfall 8 times this week (finally got the taken shotty) and never once ran out of ammo. What are you guys talking about?

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              • Soloed the nightfall, but yes ran out of ammo more than once!!! It would be nice if you would just separate Pvp and pve. Then all these STUPID ammo and weapon nerfs wouldn't be needed, oh wait they weren't needed, bungie did them to keep a few Pvp crybabies happy!!!! Most people didn't want them. Thanks again bungie!!! The needs of the few outweigh the needs of the many!!!!!

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              • Edited by Moonman: 5/14/2016 3:52:43 PM
                You see you bunch of noobs? This is exactly how you make use of the feedback section and ask for a nerf, rebalance or overhaul if necessary. You don't go "hurr durr nerf mida". You take your time and you write all the problem and if possible, a potential solution.

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              • I had the same thing happen when I ran Nightfall again last night. Synth was on cooldown so I just had to wait for the game to give me ammo.

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