So I've been a hunter since y1 I have played every subclass and mastered them. I currently main a golden gun because of how much fun it is. I do however use blade once in a while. I no longer use Nightstalker in crucible I use that class strictly for pve to make orbs. The Nightstalker class is broken right now. It is the second best class in the game apart from sunsingers. It needs some balancing. I will describe in detail what is broken about it, how to fix it and why I no longer play Nightstalker in crucible.
[b][u]Why is Nightstalker broken?[/u][/b]
The thing that is broken or "op" as many of you may be more familiar with is the shadestep and the smoke.
Shadestep is beyond broken especially if you are playing someone who sweats or is actually good with the class. You may run into the causal player who uses it and does bad with it. Those who can actually use it (regardless of scuff controller) can not only annoy but use the maneuver to get away with a lot of things they shouldn't. That ability to spam shadestep and dodge any grenade is broken. Every class has a grenade that should be effective to other guardians no exception. Also while in shadestep you usually don't take damage and confuse the shit out of everyone around you. The ability to be immune is horrible and you can spam it 2 times in a row without a cool down. Also after shadestep you can almost immediately jump or shoot your weapon and this can be a pain in the rear, especially if you were really trying to kill the person and they suddenly pop up out of no where and turn on you. It takes no skill.
Smoke is broken the range of that melee is beyond any grenade in the hunters arsenal. It's funny that smoke is a melee too it should honesty rather be a grenade. It can attach to you and do damage then after it does damage over time and blinds you. And if the person is shadesteping around you while u are in smoke, you can begin to tap the respawn button because you will die. The range in smoke is too far also, there has been many instances where I am out of the smoke yer somehow still in it. It is ridiculous how far the smoke extends. Also it should it should not deal that much damage to you. It's pretty much a super/grenade you can regenerate every 29 seconds.
[b][u]Ideas on how to fix them[/u][/b]
I will start off by saying buff the super cause tether is garbage in the crucible but I won't go into detal
To balance shadestep It is simple add a longer cool down after every shadestep. That way you can't spam it and you actually have to time it right. It is not a jump like blink u shouldn't be allowed to use it 2 times per cool down. Also remove the immunity from grenades. A grenade should deal damage to you no matter what whether it be an arcbolt or an axion. Also maybe add some frames after the shadestep that way people can't jump or shoot right after just like you did to blink.
To balance smoke it is also simple remove the damage over time from it and shorten the area of effect. The smoke will still deal impact if you are stuck with it and maybe buff the damage a bit but after it should not do DOT. It don't mind if I'm blind in it or w.e..
[u][b]Why I don't play Nightstalker in the crucible [/b][/u]
Apart from everyone wanting to use that crutch class in a "sweaty" (only 1 subclass per teammate allowed) it is not fun. When I played shade I literally got massive amounts of hate mail during pubs. I had never gotten so much rage. When I played shade I thought I was one of the best players in my friends list. I though I was unstoppable. Then I switched to a different subclass and I didn't do so hot. I did good just not amazing. Then I began to see how much of a broken piece of shit Nightstalker really was. After every shadestep and wombo I no longer felt satisfied and actual felt like a chump. So I decided to quit that class and never some back just like I did with sunsinger.
Feel free to comment below. If you need a trials carry/help/just want to play crucible feel free to add me.
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2 RepliesAll I hear is "wah wah wah"
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5 RepliesThe stupidity on these forums never ceases to amaze me.
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1 ReplyI personally just think it's -blam!-ing bullshit that shadestep negates all tracking, other than that I could care less.
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No nightstalker is not broken. It might be really good buts it's not broken. Sunsinger however might be a little broken and if it got nerfed warlocks still have storm caller which is really good too. Take away nightstalker, hunters have an average PvP/PvE class (gunslinger) and a shitty bladedancer that's only good for going invis. So stop asking for nerfs and instead ask to buff other classes like sunbreaker, defender and bladedancer.
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3 RepliesNightstalker is balanced. End of conversation
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1 ReplyNo. Stfu.
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Hunter is fine except maybe for Blade Dancer.
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The only thing I'd do is be able to double jump while in smoke
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Nothing is broken lol god i hate nerf posts so much
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There's nothing wrong with nightstalker. It's a defensive subclass so shade step allows you to retreat easier. You still can be shot throughout the animation so I don't see what the big deal is since you can see where they are moving to and it has hardly any distance to it unlike blink. ALL of the grenades suck on this subclass and if it weren't for smoke you would almost never see a kill come from one of them. It's the only class that allows me to dodge firebolt grenades so until those get nerfed, nightstalker better stay untouched.
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I agree with your suggestions and appreciate that you can be honest about this. It all reminds me of right before when Sunbreaker Titans were nerfed. It was so clear to everyone that they were too powerful, yet there were still many that were defending the subclass right to the death because they were scared about having the power taken away. Ramblinnn is an example of a player who has made great use of the Nightstalker's abilities yet can admit that it needs a nerf. I remember hearing him ages ago in a stream saying that shadestep needed an increased cooldown time - that you shouldn't be able to spam it twice in succession so quickly (just like you said). If he can do this, I hope more others can do the same and get behind this idea. I also think that Smoke could use some changes. It just has the ability to do TOO much. It slows, it blinds, it takes away the radar, and it can provide extra damage/invisibility. I think the blinding... and even the loss of radar should be given for free, so that it essentially works just like the Call of Duty smoke grenade. However, the slowing down of people (without damage) should absolutely be made a selectable perk just like Envenomed and Vanish in Smoke. Where that leaves Snare I do not know, but it's not as if many people are using that perk now anyway.
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So... you quit it out of some weird sense of pride/morality, because you got hate mail for winning? By the logic in the rest of your post though... every class and their subclasses are overpowered because each has dedicated players that bothered to be good with the class. If everyone isn't bad with it, then it must be overpowered... that's essentially what you said.
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Edited by maximus1NYC: 5/3/2016 12:21:24 PM
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Smoke is fine, shade step isn't
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1 ReplySo bungie sould just need whatever is decent or good at the moment
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Lol tether is one shot in PvP if you can aim lol and shade step is easy to trace.... Hunter is balanced no changes needed except that the huntards needs to stop crying for nerfs
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2 RepliesShadestep is fine. There are no immunity frames. I actually gunned one down while in its invisibility stage. I got the I See You medal. If you want to change the cool down for shadestep, then you need to change the cool down for blink and twilight garrison. All 3 have the same cool down concept. Smoke grenades have the combination of being blinded, slowed, poisoned, and suppressed to set you up for an easy follow up kill. Removing any of these traits makes it not worth the effort. Even if the other 3 effects stayed the same, if I don't blind you, you could gun me down. If I don't slow you, you could run away. If I don't poison you, I might not do enough to you before the other traits wear off. If I don't suppress you, you could super me.
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1 ReplyMaybe you are just better with that subclass than the others. I personally don't like using void. I will if I'm tired of the other subclasses. For PvP I'll use bladedancer if j want to abuse blink-shotgun or if I'm playing a match of rift. Anything else I stick with Golden Gun. Cause yaknow, double grenades & throwing knives. Oh and the super can be okay.
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1 ReplyI personally think nightstalker is one of the strongest classes in the game. Not as strong as sunsinger (nothing is), and just a little less strong than striker. Just don't play it as an aggressive class. It's all about evasion and zone control. Use smokes and grenades to lock off areas. Wombo combo enemies that are clumsy. Use tether to shut down objectives and supers.
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1 ReplyHunter main since pre-launch I wouldn't mind a slightly longer cooldown on shadestep, I think they should keep it so that you can roll twice in a row, but maybe add a cool down after it. I think they can keep the grenade immunity though. The only reason I say this is because most grenades in this game can already be avoided regardless of subclass. Plus without this, sunsingers would be even more rampant in competitive play. Lastly the smoke grenades. Again, I'm fine with how the smoke grenades perform. I don't believe the radius is too big, plus you can't throw them as far as grenades with fastball. I think having a strong smoke grenade makes up for the subclass lacking any good normal grenades. Voidwall and vortex are decent for zoning, and work with the wombo combo, but other than that they're pretty bad.
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2 RepliesNightstalker is one thing than can counter sunsinger
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1 ReplyAs soon as I saw shadestep the first time I knew it was a bad idea to put in the game.
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2 RepliesI feel the same way. That's why my hunter just stays on blade dander every where I go.
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2 RepliesEdited by Sixclicks: 5/2/2016 4:46:59 PMIncrease the cooldown on Shadestep. Leave smokes alone. That is all. I mostly play Gunslinger as well, but only because they're way more lethal than Nightstalker. 2x Throwing Knives, 2x Tripmines, and Golden Gun. That said, my Scuf controller will be arriving in a week, so maybe don't nerf shadestep lol...
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2 RepliesI find keen scout one of the best perks in the game for pvp, more so in a sniper meta lol. I play all three characters (I suck with a titan...) and often find it the easiest as a hunter, though I do enjoy my warlock more (with exception of how slow the jump is lol)
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2 RepliesAnd that's why I refuse to follow meta and use what I like to use... gunslinger with Universal remote and sidearm/fusion or hard light/Paleocontact with next big thing/plan c.