TLDR at bottom cuz this was way longer than I expected: I agree with your points on performance in the sense that you have to try and learn from playing. I am not a great Crucible player, and you can check my game records to see that (I was better close to two years ago on PS4, but then I took a break for a while, switched to PC for Beyond Light, and only recently got back into PvP). However, you'll also see that despite my struggles, I keep playing. Each game I play, I try to work on my technique and learn something from opponents. This is a mentality that needs to be adopted by the 'weaker' PvP players - its supposed to be a competitive mode, and there are certainly many players who fail to grasp the concept of competition. With that said, I strongly disagree with the 'YOU are the problem' point you've made. As I just said, you made fair points about the weaker half, but you know what? [b]The stronger PvP players also have to change their mentality[/b]. For every post from a mediocre player complaining about Trials being too hard, there's a post somewhere from a good player complaining about SBMM and the Flawless pool. You're clearly active on the forum, so I imagine you saw it last week - complaint after complaint about the flawless pool being unfair. The same 'great' players who tell the lower performers to get better came here and complained that they had to play people who were equally as skilled. I've made an analogy comparing this to Major League Baseball before, because the biggest flaw in the logic of 'good' players is that they think when a bad player faces another bad player, the game is easy for them. MLB teams have farm systems composed of minor-league teams to develop players. Imagine that you take the best high school prospect in the country, and put him on an MLB field against MLB competition when he turns 18. Guess what - he's gonna get blown out. However, if you put him at a lower level - say, High-A ball in the minors - he could likely compete and succeed. There's different levels to competition - a High-A player vs. a High-A player will be competitive, as will an MLB player vs another major leaguer. However, an MLB player vs a High-A player will be a blowout in favor of the major leaguer. Both the high-A and MLB games are competitive, but the MLB is played at higher stakes. This is where the flawless-pool and rewards system comes in. The 'good' players should have an option to play at the higher-stakes level of competition, [b]and[/b] there should be an incentive for them to do so. Bungie hasn't figured out the second part yet. Personally, I think there should be a 5th passage available from Saint after you go Flawless. When you buy this passage, you only play in the flawless pool, but have a much easier way to obtain adept weapons. Furthermore - by all means, players have got to improve. Its important for any lower-end player in any PvP game to build their skills and become better over time if they want to compete. With that said, getting stomped 5-0, game-after-game (since you're constantly matched against so-called 'sweats'), is [b]not going to help them improve[/b]. Have you ever been in the weight room? If you've never lifted before, and you try to bench-press 315, guess what -- you're 1.) not going to lift it, 2.) not going to make progress, and 3.) probably going to hurt yourself. There is no benefit to getting slaughtered because it doesn't give players time to analyze the game, and test a counter-solution. Progress is made by playing people of equal or slightly greater skill, not by A.) playing weaker competition, or B.) getting blown out by players out of your league. The only scenario in which option B helps develop skill is if you're getting blown out by a teacher who's giving you constructive criticism to improve. That's my take on the situation. Both parties need a different mindset. TLDR: Bad players need to accept where they stand, and gain an understanding of the competitive nature that comes with this type of game mode. They need to seek to improve and build their skillset in order to compete, instead of complaining that the mode is 'busted'. Good players need to understand that These bad players can't improve if they get stomped religiously. Further, they need to stop complaining about playing other good players since they want this mode to be 'endgame' for the 'elite' players - a good player stomping a bad player is not an elite performance; that is the expected outcome and is simply normal.

LMAO, this is funniest post I've seen on here for quite a while. Hey, why don't we get all the solo players stop playing (since they're apparently the problem) so it can go back to being a toxic pool of sweatiness with an ever decreasing playerbase then this guy can make a post blaming the solo players for not playing the mode... I mean it's hard to miss the point so much, it's actually impressive. Kudos for that, I guess. Lol.

Exactly, it's easier for the forum complainers to whine about sweats, matchmaking, teams, meta and everything else under the sun then to blame the real reason for thier lack of lighthouse visits: themselves. They expect to show up and have the adept gear drop at thier feet with no effort, they think THE endgame of pvp should hand out its rewards for them Sim because they que'd up for it

[quote]"every" season bungie is not to blame, sweats are not to blame, streamers and content creators are not to blame, YOU are to blame.[/quote] It's the players attitude thats to blame every season. Generally they want loot for less effort. They don't play for the challenge. It's all a transaction. This is why the playerbase at large doesn't get better. This is why they shouldn't whine either. Put the work in and commit Or Stick to patrols Your choice. To OP: Don't worry about the likes man. You know when it's 0 it's because you struck a nerve. You said the truth and people can't stand to read it. I made a topic months ago about the community at large - (a much harder pill to swallow if you will) and got 0 likes but 255+ responses. It stayed at top 5 for a good week. Lol.

I agree here. I feel like some people have really unrealistic expectations that this matchmaking or some future matchmaking will solve all their PvP problems. Bottom line is bad players and bad and good players and good. Trials is a gamemode populated with good players.

If you drop an egg on a pan the right way, you can easily crack it open the rest of the way without having egg shells everywhere so the egg can cleanly go down your vacuum cleaner hose. I just thought that was interesting