As a carry-on from that other thread, I posted this on the Anarchist memes page: [quote]The man was a textbook narcissist. Spinning it around and turning antisocial psychology into a case of baseless misogyny doesn't help anyone - least of all the victims.[/quote] To which the AM admin responded: [quote] [url=http://bellejar.ca/2014/05/24/elliot-rodger-and-men-who-hate-women/]"No. We have no evidence yet that he suffered from any kind of mental illness or was under any sort of treatment. Immediately claiming that with no proof to back that fact up leads to the further stigmatization of the mentally ill, and contributes to the (incorrect) assumption that mental illness equals violence, and vice versa."[/url][/quote] I then responded with: [quote][url=http://www.ibtimes.com/elliot-rodger-ucsb-shooter-internet-history-reveals-mens-rights-movement-beliefs-wake-mass-1589849]" Rodger’s family confirmed the identification and said he had Asperger’s syndrome and struggled socially, but was receiving psychiatric help. . . While his first videos were largely harmless (to anyone but himself), by his last video, titled “Elliot Rodger’s Retribution,” we see him turn to violence without much thought about anything but his own vindications. His narcissism became such a dominating part of his personality that he felt morally justified to murder."[/url] The mens' rights movement is not a movement of misogynists, but of course it will attract such individuals. Narcissism, social difficulties and misogyny aren't mutually exclusive in any configuration.[/quote] The admin responded with: [quote]"The mens' rights movement is not a movement of misogynists, but of course it will attract such individuals." Misogyny is the ideological core of this movement. [/quote] I responded: [quote] I have no interest in debating such hostile, partisan and fanatical sentiments.[/quote] And then some guy out of nowhere decided to get his two pennies in: [quote]Why is the suggestion he may have had aspergers even relevant? In what way does that kind of autism lend itself towards violence? To say that he had aspergers as if that's some kind of explanation is just ableism. School and university mass murders are not rare in the US, yet despite this only one has ever been committed by a woman. This has everything to do with masculinity. It's patriarchal terrorism, pure and simple.[/quote] To which I said: [quote]First of all, I didn't at all suggest Asperger's was the cause of the violence. I'm merely highlighting the fact that what the admin sourced was incorrect - he did indeed have mental health problems. Not to mention, the social exclusion resulting from Asperger's can lend itself to the point of view Rodger eventually came to have. Also, to suggest the correlation between male suspects and school shootings as somehow indicative of patriarchal violence is laughable at best. Males have a higher capacity to develop antisocial disorders of the mind, and coupled with rejection and social difficulties, Rodger's is a prime candidate for developing such a disorder. And no, "only one" has not been committed by a woman. There was Brenda Spencer in 1969, Laurie Dann in 1988, Jillian Spencer in 1996, Latina Williams in 2008 and Amy Bishop in 2010.[/quote] Somebody came in and said: [quote]Narcissistic psychopathy is not Asperger Syndrome. After reading quite a bit of this hateful, vile, racist, misogynist's manifesto, I'm absolutely sure he didn't have even the vaguest form of autism spectrum disorder. So sick of that trope.[/quote] I said: [quote]I wouldn't characterise him as a psychopath, however. Nor did I say Asperger's syndrome is the same as narcissism - I wasn't even aware he had it until I linked that article.[/quote] Somebody else said: [quote]So he's an anti social psychopath or he isn't? I see some flip flopping here. If you're going to boil it down to men are more likely to be anti social - well women are more likely to have bpd. Psychology is also gendered did you know that?[/quote] So I said: [quote]What flip flopping? I never claimed he was a psychopath. I also don't see what relevance BPD has on the situation, since it doesn't necessarily entail antisocial behaviour.[/quote] She responded: [quote]Looks like you require more psychology classes then.[/quote] I say: [quote]If you're implying that psychopathy is synonymous with ASPD, then you're unfortunately misinformed. While the latter is a prerequisite for the former, the former has important distinctions. I'd also appreciate you not being supercilious.[/quote] [b]LATEST UPDATE: [/b] Some other guy jumps in and says: [quote]The vast majority of mentally ill people, including people with personality disorders such as NPD, are NOT any more likely to be violent than people without mental illnesses *posts about six links*[/quote] I respond: [quote]First of all, most of those sources referred to "mental illness", which is dubious when discussing personality disorders as it has come to mean the more traditional issues that can be more readily identified as an actual illness. One of the sources - I can't remember which - cited drug and alcohol abuse as a bigger risk factor, but failed to recognise the propensity for such behaviour which can result from having a personality disorder. NONE of them mentioned Narcissistic Personality Disorder and the only one to mention something similar was Harvard which said: "Personality disorders. Borderline personality disorder, antisocial personality disorder, conduct disorder, and other personality disorders often manifest in aggression or violence. When a personality disorder occurs in conjunction with another psychiatric disorder, the combination may also increase risk of violent behavior (as suggested by the CATIE study, above)." And the source which states people with mental illnesses only account for 4% of violent behaviour makes me incredibly wary of their definition of "mental illness", since the average score on the psychopathy checklist among North American prison samples are at 22 - which is three points below the psychopathy cut off point of the UK - while a fifth of them score above 30, which is the cut off point for the US.[/quote]