Going by what you wrote you said “they retire old gear to get more powerful gear to do the newer stuff” (paraphrasing). From what I read in the twab is they don’t want more powerful gear because of “power creep”. They want you to use the new gear and to make them more enticing they are forcing you to shelve the old gear. It’s not better gear. It’s equal to or quite possibly lesser gear they know you won’t prefer to your current favorites.

There would be a flaw in your understanding of what I responded with. I never said “more powerful” I believe my exact word was better. Better because of different perk combinations/random rolls/newer mods. Not the same thing. I completely understand what bungie is driving at with the discussion of power creep. I’m on board with sun setting for many reasons. Thinking back on my personal experiences with this game and the one before it, the memories are of the grind to acquire. Not using the weapon until I was tired of it. I’ll always remember the grind for Randy’s and how long it took to get all those medals and scout kills. Couldn’t care less about the gun now. I’ve made my memories and I’m ready for new ones.

Full Disclosure: I saw an actual thoughtful comment and had to jump in. Here are my two cents— Weapon sun setting has been happening since the start of D2 because of the base changes that were made in the jump from D1. Someone else already mentioned the logic of “Which gun are you going to prefer: static rolled hand cannon A, or that god-rolled Spare Rations?” The static rolled hand cannon was, in a sense, sunset. There are a huge amount of weapons and armour in the game that are sunset by means of random roll introductions and mod application, so technically, sunsetting of weapons is not something new. My thought is that the main difference is that we continue to harken back to the days of D1–there was no static roll on legendary weapons and unlocking the perks required you to become accustomed to using it. That was the key to us “playing our way”. If you were crappy with a hand cannon it was safe to assume that you weren’t going to use it enough to unlock the higher level perks on it. But when you found the scout rifle of your dreams, you ate with it, slept with it and it because an extension of your devastation against the forces of darkness... Or something. My point is that our engagement and involvement with weapons has changed. It used to be that we came to be attached to a weapon out of our love for it and the amount we [i]used it[/i]. Now we are attached to the weapon because we sank 18 play hours into the competitive playlist to [i]get it[/i] and when we finally got around to using it we were underwhelmed but we use it anyway and you’ll have to pry it from my cold dead hands. We have been sunsetting weapons the entire time — just for different reasons and with different names. Anyone wearing that Revelry armour anymore? Anyone wish that they play a game where you only used certain weapons for FOUR YEARS?! I, no lie, ran the entire campaign, up to just before Forsaken, with the same Better Devils hand cannon. I honestly hated the game for it. The same people that are complaining that there is nothing new to use are the same people that are crying about Bungie saying, “put down that stale load-out and try something new”. And let’s be honest, how often are we genuinely disappointed with a new set of weapons? Really not often if ever is the answer, unless you’re so far down the “BunGiE iS tHe WoRSt” rabbit-hole. Running through content with the same stale stuff isn’t what we want—I would like to think that we can all agree on that. Options are good. There will be another Galliard. There will be another Mindbender. Crutches come and crutches go and while I’m painfully salty that I’m terrible with shotguns and my Galliard is terrible and I can’t get another one because RNGesus hates me, I’m sure I’ll find something new to replace it all. And I’m hopeful that I’ll enjoy the process in getting them, too.

Posted somewhere else... but hey I poet work into it. [b]The Only Way Sunsetting Works[/b] Listen I’m not totally for or against sunsetting the legendary weapons I have used for months and even years at this point. But Bungie, you need to understand one thing. After sunsetting, if you continue to release similar guns with the same perks in the sandbox, this will be one of the biggest failures in Destiny history (You will be kissing your fan base goodbye). In this case players will just feel like they are grinding for the same guns they have already earned all over again. We should expect from you bungie, that after sunsetting, there will be a new and diverse meta in PvE and PvP. New perks, and I mean [i]a ton[/i] of new perks in all archetypes, so that weapons feel fresh and modern. In order to take our minds off our old gear and to ensure we aren’t banging our heads grinding for the same rolls we farmed for back in season of the drifter, we need new perks never seen before in destiny history. I’m thinking basically all vanilla D2 perks should be cut. Sorry, no outlaw, kill clip rampage etc. I’m ok if perks released in the past two seasons (vorpal, lead from gold, etc) are preserved because these perks have had shorter lifespan as. But only as long as there is a hefty pool of new perks. Boys if you don’t want power creep and you don’t want to regrind the same weapons, this is the solution. It will take a lot of work and creativity from bungie. That’s the point. We need fresh content, stuff that we can talk about and be excited for, stuff that we can test the viability and fit into our builds like the good old days when perks felt fresh. The rest of this post is open to your thoughts and perk suggestions you would like to see. Feel free to post ideas and if I like them I’ll add them. (I’m not feeling particularly creative right now 🤷‍♀️). [b]Perks!![/b] 1. Double Kills increase reload speed of partially reload mag. 2. Sprinting with gun in hand charges the gun, increases damage and/or adds AOE splash effect (set amount of sprint time required)(thinking like turning your primary into a hive boomer after sprinting a long time). 3. Using a class ability gives you a temporary period where shots come directly from reserves (magazine doesn’t deplete but reserves will)(maybe cool on a shotgun, sniper or GL). 4: Getting a precision kill temporarily slows nearby enemies (like firefly but adds slow effect instead of direct dmg). 5: Getting a melee kill temporarily buffs your weapons rate of fire to the next archetype (so a 600 smg would temporarily be buffed to 750rpm). 6: Precision shots increase target acquisition/aim assist, stacks up to 5 (sniper perk). Not all perks have to be complex, they just have to be [i]different[/i] Edit I do not balance video games so And these perks will have to be balanced carefully around PvP that goes without saying.

This is really cool and I agree on your point here. If you you are going to do it, don't make samey weapons.

[quote]So, I posted this somewhere else, and I'm curious on some thoughts here (actual thoughts). I keep hearing this is disrespectful of time, but I disagree. I think this needs to happen. So....is that what other games that do this are doing? Are they being disrespectful? In final fantasy XIV, every 3 months my gear becomes obsolete and I need stronger gear to do higher end content. My class doesn't really change. How I play mat not change too much. But my gear does. Is that disrespectful? Because I don't see it that way. Most FFXIV players don't. Same for wow. They've already made the stance that they're going the mmo route. And stuff like this is, I'm sorry, in the mmo route. It's interesting to see the reactions on here as gear falling behind is very old news to me, but foreign devil magic to shooter gamers or gamers that don't experience other grind games. I spent a month in final fantasy grinding for a legendary weapon....for its look. I'm not alone in that. Glamouring/transmog sounds great to me. Thoughts? EDIT: I greatly appreciate the interesting discussions people are having on this post. I'm happy to see what people's thoughts are on this topic.[/quote] Bringing another game into this is a case of apples and oranges. Do you have any of the long grind weapons in D2? Nerfing them after that effort isn't just disrespectful of the players time, it is dishonest behaviour by a developer who said, in 2014, we will respect the time you put into the game. It is all so totally unnecessary. They could introduce season long mods that ONLY go in the new season weapons making them the go to weapons and then doing it again the following season. They are wrong about power creep. That isn't down to the weapons it is down to light.

[quote] Bringing another game into this is a case of apples and oranges. Do you have any of the long grind weapons in D2? Nerfing them after that effort isn't just disrespectful of the players time, it is dishonest behaviour by a developer who said, in 2014, we will respect the time you put into the game. It is all so totally unnecessary. They could introduce season long mods that ONLY go in the new season weapons making them the go to weapons and then doing it again the following season. They are wrong about power creep. That isn't down to the weapons it is down to light.[/quote] I do actually! Not forgotten, Luna's howl, revoker, all the pinnacles except the grenade launcher.... I've spent far more effort for other weapons in many other games. And, as what is happening here, they eventually became obsolete. But wouldn't that just end up us using the same weapons over and over again?

Here is the flaw in your logic. Those games were [i]designed[/i] from the beginning with that in mind, and have in depth class systems that allow for build diversity. Destiny isn't designed that way, and doesn't have those features. Also, Bungie's version of transmog is likely a very transparent cash grab (I hope they prove me wrong on this, but so far the precedent says otherwise) ESO also laughs in your face, openly, because once you hit the 160 champion point level, [i]any[/i] item you earn is useable in [i]any[/i] content... from over [i]five[/i] years of gear... That is an MMO. Destiny is not

[quote]Here is the flaw in your logic. Those games were [i]designed[/i] from the beginning with that in mind, and have in depth class systems that allow for build diversity. Destiny isn't designed that way, and doesn't have those features. Also, Bungie's version of transmog is likely a very transparent cash grab (I hope they prove me wrong on this, but so far the precedent says otherwise) ESO also laughs in your face, openly, because once you hit the 160 champion point level, [i]any[/i] item you earn is useable in [i]any[/i] content... from over [i]five[/i] years of gear... That is an MMO. Destiny is not[/quote] No that is ONE MMO. That is not how final fantasy XIV and wow works. Your gear becomes obsolete every 3 to 4 months. Though you're totally right about the class system for diversity. As for the transmog it sounds like it'll be both in game or can be cash bought, not fully cash bought. As for whether or not destiny is or is not an mmo....no it definitely isn't like one of the standard ones. But they are going that route. How do you foresee this playing out? I agree that it did not start this way in the beginning. It seems like they've had an identity crisis for a long time and just recently come to terms with where they want to go.

They still don't [i]know[/i]. They are travelling the path of least resistance, driven by a Director who PLAYED an MMO but never actually worked on developing one... As I said. There are gaping holes in your logic

Exactly how do you think research is conducted? I mean I'm not going to sit here and say I know what their process is and researching and studying other types of games and other types of archetypes. I don't. but to me it seems pretty illogical to think that they would not do their own research. You don't have to play the game completely to know how an MMO works. Yes you do in fact need to play it, but you can also study deeply it's archetype, how the game functions, what's the philosophy behind some of the activities and things that happen in the game.. It doesn't seem like just playing an MMO would give you enough information. That's just one method of data gathering. That's contextual inquiry.

[quote]Exactly how do you think research is conducted? I mean I'm not going to sit here and say I know what their process is and researching and studying other types of games and other types of archetypes. I don't. but to me it seems pretty illogical to think that they would not do their own research. You don't have to play the game completely to know how an MMO works. Yes you do in fact need to play it, but you can also study deeply it's archetype, how the game functions, what's the philosophy behind some of the activities and things that happen in the game.. It doesn't seem like just playing an MMO would give you enough information. That's just one method of data gathering. That's contextual inquiry.[/quote] And yet Bungie are now five years into what is little more than a Beta, and want to change a unique game into a pale copy of an MMO, just to make it fit the laziest fix possible... Also, their "research" led them to believe it would take the community a week to complete an activity that most people don't even like... after an event based around bounties... which their research didn't note people were already burnt out on... Great research there...

[quote][quote]Exactly how do you think research is conducted? I mean I'm not going to sit here and say I know what their process is and researching and studying other types of games and other types of archetypes. I don't. but to me it seems pretty illogical to think that they would not do their own research. You don't have to play the game completely to know how an MMO works. Yes you do in fact need to play it, but you can also study deeply it's archetype, how the game functions, what's the philosophy behind some of the activities and things that happen in the game.. It doesn't seem like just playing an MMO would give you enough information. That's just one method of data gathering. That's contextual inquiry.[/quote] And yet Bungie are now five years into what is little more than a Beta, and want to change a unique game into a pale copy of an MMO, just to make it fit the laziest fix possible... Also, their "research" led them to believe it would take the community a week to complete an activity that most people don't even like... after an event based around bounties... which their research didn't note people were already burnt out on... Great research there...[/quote] Oh I'm not saying bthey did it right in some of their implementations, and I don't really know how this will play out in this scenario. I get you're salty about it, and I don't like this season event either. This was a miss. So, what will happen from here? I think it's also important to understand the turmoil that company has been facing over the last few years. Not to give them excuses, but to be clear about all day points.

They have been in "turmoil" of their own making for [i]years[/i]. In the end, it is all just excuses for why a supposedly "professional" company act in a totally unprofessional way... As to salty... Not really. I think it is a major mistake, and highlights the major issues within Bungie as a company. I just probably won't bother after next season, because I play games for entertainment and if it is no longer entertaining I will go elsewhere. Simplicity

Bungie needs to do something similar with armor, where wearing an armor set gives you bonuses. And attribute points are given on level up and assigned where you want your build. Be it intellect, strength etc... those types of stats have no purpose being on armor

Thank you. (I'm currently champion level 727) the grind is real 🤣

Lol, I am 701 I think. I just chill, play content I fancy and do stuff during double xp events lol. There is soooooo much to do in ESO lol