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3/10/2008 4:06:56 AM
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COMCAST USERS: Getting lots of disconnects? This may be why:
Now with edited thread title to be a bit more neutral :)
First off: As Smalls has noted, any number of other issues could be causing you to have internet connection problems - most commonly it has something to do with your router settings. However, I am attempting to raise awareness of another possible cause for the problem, especially if you have already gone through steps to fix your router settings and you often have problems wth peer-to-peer downloading.
Comcast uses a lovely little technology called "Sandvine" technology. This technology is designed to disrupt peer to perr communications, especially BitTorrent. It is known as "Net Neutrality Internet Traffic Shaping." Basically, the Sandvine technology impersonates the person you are trying to connect to in a peer-to-peer setting and sends a disconnection packet to you, which knocks you offline momentarily.
In addition to messing with peer-to-peer downloading programs, this process disrupts lots of other programs that have nothing to do with illegal file sharing and are completely and totally legal.
Guess what game uses a peer-to-peer system to create an ad-hoc network for its games? You guessed it, Halo 3.
Users have specifically encountered issues when using Halo 3 on comcast, getting tons of disconnects. As we all know, disconnects give you -1exp each time.
As a comcast user, I can confirm that they are indeed doing it and it indeed does interfere with Halo 3, as evidenced by the huge number of exp penalties I have because of dropped games (and the reason that I don't play ranked that much)
Not only is this incredibly annoying to tons of people who are not involved in illegal file sharing in any way, it is also borderline illegal. Comcast is acctually being investigated by the FCC and is being sued over it.
Now I'm sure many of you will say "get another internet service provider." Well, Comcast happens to be the largest cable company in the U.S., and also one of the largest ISPs. In many areas, you cannot get a cable connection without going through Comcast, which means that if you want a cable internet connection, Comcast is the only available ISP.
Personally, I'd love to see them get nailed to the wall by the FCC and sued into bankruptcy because they have the lowest customer satisfaction rating of any company in the entire United States, including the INTERNAL REVENUE SERVICE.
But barring that, I'd love to commiserate here with other people this has happened to. Who knows, with enough support maybe we can get the bastards to acctually fix their technology and make it work with Halo 3.
[url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comcast#Net_neutrality_Internet_traffic_shaping[/url]
got almost all this info there. there are also some links that I got the rest of the info from.
A note: I have also noticed that for some reason I experience fewer disconnects if I am in a party with another player and I am also in a private chat with that player. If I am in a party with another player and I am NOT in a private chat, I often experience even more disconnects than usual.
Another note: A number of people have mentioned that switching routers fixed the problem for them. I am going to try this myself, but if you have changed routers and had sucess, please post here and let us know what router you had before if you remember it.
Edit: A little searching on Google has shown me that this is indeed a fairly common problem for Comcast customers, and that direct connecting your xbox 360 instead of using a wireless connection doesn't help the issue at all. I'm going to do some digging around as I can, and if I find out anything that helps I will post it here, though I will have to stop pretty soon tonight as I have class tomorrow. If anyone else finds out about anything, post it here and I'll update this post and make sure to credit you.
Edit2: Now with testomonials, yaay!
[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] LilHairy
This is why i have EXP penalties. I had the wireless gateway (Netgear WRT54G) from Comcast when Halo 3 came out and was lagged out of almost all of my games. I got the occasional 1 or 2 in during the day. I got rid of that and went back to wired internet. All i can say from experience is DO NOT get this wireless gateway with Comcast, it will lag you out of 98%of Halo 3 games(not certain on that statistic by the way, just a guess). I am not aware of other games doing this while using this particular gateway (I am pretty sure this is the only one Comcast provides to you) but i urge everyone do not use this with Halo 3![/quote]
[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] darthbob
As living in a small town in Oregon, Comcast has monopolized the Internet and I, along with so many others (I imagine) are 'receiving' the same issues. For instance, when I'm just casually surfing on my PC, everything's fine. But when I connect to XBL every 30 minutes or so my 'Motorola Surfboard Comcast Provided Cable Modem' will disconnect me.
Quite the Bull-blam!-ery. [/quote]
[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] bongbong03
I agree 100% that this is the problem. I had this exact same model from Comcast and I got booted constantly. Just look at my quits, I have around 50 or so. I'm still trying to recover from what that did to my ranked stats. Its really tough to move up when you are getting disconnected constantly and they still give you the loss. Anyone who has comcast must get rid of this thing now. It is worthless. I got a new dlink router instead of that netgear gateway and I've been working great ever since. It is also a waste of money to pay them $5 a month to rent that thing in the first place. DUMP THE NETGEAR GATEWAY PROVIDED BY COMAST NOW!!![/quote]
[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] SKiTz THEGEMINI
DUDE...seriously...you are my hero! The only cable provider in my area was just bought out by Comcast and the entire city is LIVID! I can't even begin to describe how terrible Comcast's customer service is. As soon as Comcast took over my internet connection became inconsistent and here's the kicker...right after they took over they RAISED PRICES because of the "improvements" in service they claim to be providing.
Comcast FOR THE COMPLETE AND UTTER LOSS!
And there's nothing I can do about it. >:([/quote]
[Edited on 03.10.2008 10:25 AM PDT]
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C'mon buddy. You can't just be throwing Comcast into the most hated companies in the U.S. [url]http://consumerist.com/consumer/worst-company-in-america/worst-company-in-america-2007-the-final-big-board-245261.php[/url] You also cannot say that its above the IRS. In 2008, Government agency hate list went: 1. FEMA, 2. TSA, and 3. IRS. [url]http://www.zimbio.com/TSA+Rules+and+Regulations/articles/6/Most+Hated+Government+Agency[/url] You can't just throw Comcast ahead of The Service. I'm proud to work for the 3rd most hated.
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Xbox LIVE (the service you use to connect to other people, also the service which match making uses) IS NOT and DOES NOT use ANY Bit-torrent ports. or connections. Bit torrent and Xbox LIVE are SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO far from each other on the internet spectrum that is not even funny. I'm a comcast user. I have NEVER lost a Halo3 game due to connection problems nor have i EVER been disconnect from live. Here is a tip on how to solve most of online problems #1. Get a GOOD router. Not some $20 one. Like a $50 one that is compatable with the Xbox 360 #2. Tell the good router to open all ports that the 360 needs to play online #3. Dont be downloading bit torrents while playing on LIVE. that will get you disconnected because you will choke your upload and get disconnected.
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] XGC Sun Goddess Seriously?? This really sucks! I just switched my service from AT&T to comcast. AT&T was horrible. I wasn't too happy with the service I got from them either. I just moved and we got comcast. I haven't played Halo yet since I moved, but I really hope I don't experience all these problems. And if I do, I hope it's not often.[/quote] if you live in oregon or washington i am not sure of other places havin this but here in washington and oregon verizon brings the server to your house so i got 30 mps download and 11 or 9 mps upload. for 45 bucks good deal in my case. [Edited on 04.21.2008 9:33 PM PDT]
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Change Title to: PROOF That Comcast Users Lag Up A Storm! lol soisoisoisosoi glad i have roadrunner, u should invest in TWC, even tho they suck =) at least u know what ur talkign about...
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News Update, 15.Apr.2008: [url=http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2704,2284026,00.asp]Comcast Reaches Agreement with P2P Companies[/url]
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I have Comcast as well, and I also live in Washington. I call Rockets? stop arguing with smalls, he is only trying to show how much he thinks he knows. If or while he read your first post along with many others it would have answered many of his own questions. I have been following the whole Sandvine news from the beginning. My reason? That stuff has been a big interest of mine from why back. I started out playing Halo1 on XBConnect and I did tons of research over a period of close to 2 years trying to find ways for the best possible connection through my PC, Modem, Routers, switches ect.ect. Comcast says they support XBL, if you read they also say you shouldn't have to forward ports because Comcast already is set to allow it but is something you can check with your Router or modem. Something you should know though small is that it is"Fact" that Comcast does use Sandvine, Also "Fact " Halo3 does use a P2P protocol, and also "Fact " that there is a 68% Know number of Comcast customers Sandvine does affect. I had some issues because a Tech person told me about installing a Amplified splitter to boost signal levels to my TV's and cable modem. Come to find out it was giving to strong a signal and can cause the same issue for disconnects. There are many factors that can play with your internet connection and that is why people are here reading this now. To learn what they can. To some what educate them self. So now, who are you to say that it's not Sandvine.? I also have a friend that lives a 45 min. drive from me and he also is a Comcast customer. When we are in private chat our mic's cut in and out in the lobby mostly, when I am doing it with other NonComcast people I dont have that issue. For me when I have a issue with something I am not quick to blame anything. I want it resolved so I go through a process of elimination to get to the root of it what ever it might be. Right now for me many things are pointing to Sandvine. I'm not even going to get into which router I use and what my settings are set at. I have my own Cable modem which is the same as the one Comcast uses and because I do make good money doing what I do I am always up to try new and better for testing. I even ran all new HD Cable and Cat6 cables through out my whole house and was told by a Comcast Tech that I did a very nice job in my network room. So for me? In Washington state? Yes I think Sandvine is playing a roll in my issues.
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Lifetime EXP: 450 EXP Penalties: -143 Total EXP 307 Comcast Netgear = Sucks
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This happens to me all the time with Comcast.
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I might be lucky but I really never got D/c in 1500 games on halo 3, and have used comcast for the past well . ever .... anyhow I'm, not naysaying anyones complaints, I believe them all, I used to have problems when I first got it, but I threatened to swap my whole apartment building to a competing company "Verizon" and they removed the fraudulent Connection fees and whatnot after I told them I was getting cable anyhow they should be lucky I called them at all, They told me it would have been illegal but I mentioned that they had no clue whatsoever anyhow. I got my fees reversed for the internet and tv setup, I installed everything and they wanted 200$ for dropping off a box and a 3 way splitter ... F-them, Anyhow I use a wired hub "D-link 604" with 2 comps on the network and my xbox 360, and everything is ok. I do agree though Worst Customer service ever, They will never do a thing for you besides suggest you upgrade your cable service, or put you on hold. On a side note, it is an old apartment and only had 2 cable inputs for 5 apartments, a tennant had some trouble and called comcast, I helped the guy find all the wires and stuff and he was asking me if everyone was "stealing" cable or what? I told him to mind his own f-ing business.. of course we all pay for it, A-hole we all have boxes they know it ... He wanted to know why 5 apts had 2 lines in from the service, Well hmmmmmm. who maintains and installs these drops ........ all the cable companies from the past 20 years to current date? thats why it's messed up. anyways they added 2 more drops, but we had a 2 huge cables into 2, 9 way splits ... lol. and as I said I showed him where all the cable feeds go and he acts like he found them .. What a tool. [Edited on 03.10.2008 2:18 PM PDT]
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Happened to me about a dozen or so times, always when im in the middle of a ranked match. I call comcast and they say everything is fine.
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Lx PATCHES x7 I respect your opionion thats the first I have heard on the customer service. I am surprised about that it wasnt that bad a few years ago when I was there. I dont beleive the bit torrent problem causes lag but thats my opionion I havent actually investigated it. What I did say about the HFC plant is correct though. Most likely that is a bigger issue than anything else. The biggest problem with Comcast started with Mike Armstrong at AT&T Broadband, their main intent was to get as many customers as possible without even worrying or thinking about how they would actually keep the thing running. Comcast came in and took over, and have been very aggressive buying out as many providers as they can all over the nation. The office I worked in has 5 times the number of people working in it today and from what I hear of my friends still there, they are overwhelemed with trouble tickets. I think they have clearly bit off more than they can chew. I will give them credit though they are spending a ton upgrading their plants so eventually they will probably be the best option in the bigger areas anyway. In the smaller cities I would go with someone else. [/quote] As far as the BitTorrent thing goes, Sandvine also hasn't been around very long. If you weren't working there in 2007 you probably would not have heard about it at all - BitTorrent themselves didn't notice it until August of 2007. I respect your opinion as well and I don't want you to think my post was a personal attack in any way. There are alot of misconceptions about Sandvine because it is very new and Comcast has done a very good job at keeping it under wraps (they have gone so far as to pay people to fill seats at FCC hearings so that their opponets wouldn't be able to get in). I do think personally that they have bit off more than they can chew and are having trouble servicing rural areas effeciently, as from what I have seen and heard from others and people on this thread, those people who live closer to metropolitan areas don't seem to be having as many problems with Comcast. Whether this is an infrastructure problem or a Sandvine issue, we can't be sure of, because Comcast isn't going to be forthcoming about anything Sandvine related unless they get sued or the FCC forces them to. Your best bet is to investigate all your other alternatives before blaming Sandvine. In my particular case, I'd say things are pretty well narrowed down to 1. My router 2. Nodes in my Area or 3. Sandvine. As my problems with internet connectivity become much more pronounced any time I use any sort of torrent or peer to peer software and particuarly with Halo 3, I am inclined to believe that Sandvine is indeed the issue here, but I am going to explore all other alternatives first. But people should be aware that this could very well be their issue, especially if they are about to go out and spend a bunch of money on new equipment that may not improve their online experience at all.
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Thanks for clearing that up. hopefully the FCC will get on this big time and everything will be back to normal with no more bull-blam!-. And i thought I was the only one ha.
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I respect your opionion thats the first I have heard on the customer service. I am surprised about that it wasnt that bad a few years ago when I was there. I dont beleive the bit torrent problem causes lag but thats my opionion I havent actually investigated it. What I did say about the HFC plant is correct though. Most likely that is a bigger issue than anything else. The biggest problem with Comcast started with Mike Armstrong at AT&T Broadband, their main intent was to get as many customers as possible without even worrying or thinking about how they would actually keep the thing running. Comcast came in and took over, and have been very aggressive buying out as many providers as they can all over the nation. The office I worked in has 5 times the number of people working in it today and from what I hear of my friends still there, they are overwhelemed with trouble tickets. I think they have clearly bit off more than they can chew. I will give them credit though they are spending a ton upgrading their plants so eventually they will probably be the best option in the bigger areas anyway. In the smaller cities I would go with someone else.
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Flash2k7 No internet connection is perfect. Unless your on a T1 network or get Verizon Fios (or similar) this is bound to happen at some point to everyone. I have comcast cable internet and rarely have any issues. I have fewer than 20 EXP penalties and most of those happened right when the game was released, in december when xbox live was messed up, and recently when grifball was crashing my xbox. I rarely have any issues with comcast and when it seems the internet is being weird it is generally always my router. It is a netgear but not provided by comcast. It is good practice to reset both your router and cable modem once a week to ensure your connection to comcast remains near the top of their list of active connections. Comcast's blockage of BitTorrent should not effect halo3 or xbox live as they must operate on different ports and connections. Finally, if comcast offers you anything other than the modem refuse it. What ever they give you will be locked down and barely usable, just get the modem, it will work with any commercial router despite what the may tell you.[/quote] I have to reset my router daily, often several times throughout the course of the day. This is on days when I am not playing Halo 3 at all, as well. But like you and many others have said, I think that getting a modem from them and using my own router may be a better solution, and I am going to talk to my roommates about it today and try to get that set up. If it does indeed work, I will post here. As far as no ISP being pefect goes: I certainly know that, but my Comcast service (and others, it seems, from the posts on this thread and elsewhere) is absolutely godawful. I have taken this 360 to places that do not use Comcast internet and experienced not a single disconnect whatsoever during the times that I played from those places. I was at one of those places for longer than a month. [Edited on 03.10.2008 1:43 PM PDT]
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No internet connection is perfect. Unless your on a T1 network or get Verizon Fios (or similar) this is bound to happen at some point to everyone. I have comcast cable internet and rarely have any issues. I have fewer than 20 EXP penalties and most of those happened right when the game was released, in december when xbox live was messed up, and recently when grifball was crashing my xbox. I rarely have any issues with comcast and when it seems the internet is being weird it is generally always my router. It is a netgear but not provided by comcast. It is good practice to reset both your router and cable modem once a week to ensure your connection to comcast remains near the top of their list of active connections. Comcast's blockage of BitTorrent should not effect halo3 or xbox live as they must operate on different ports and connections. Finally, if comcast offers you anything other than the modem refuse it. What ever they give you will be locked down and barely usable, just get the modem, it will work with any commercial router despite what the may tell you.
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[ [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Lx PATCHES x7 My response is to the original post, very inaccurate post as far as trying to conclude that his connection problem has to do with the Comcast issue with blocking torrents from their network. It has absolutely nothing to do with that. I am a former engineer for Comcast, I was in their National repair center for 5 years as an engineer. The problem with cable is you have no guranteed bandwidth. It all depends on how many customers have cable in the immediate area you are in. You would need to know something about HFC to have an idea of what I am referring to. In each area or subdivision you live in, you will have fiber nodes that run to a head end. Depending on how many customers are hooked up at each fiber node, and how many of them are consuming bandwidth is what determines the speed you will get. In many markets they are upgrading their plants so that they can provide more bandwidth, so in some areas their service is great, other areas its going to stink. The statement about their customer service being the worst in america even the IRS is a flat out lie and a joke. A very naive statement made from someone who has never had to call companies like Dell or Qwest for any type of service. With that being said, I do completely agree that Comcast sucks. You think you hate being a customer of theirs, try working there for 5 years. They treat their employees like crap. I now work for a different cable company that covers smaller markets and we have no problems. If you are in a market where you have more choices than comcast try and go with Cox if you can. I do not work for them but they have the highest satisfaction ratings in the industry. Thats my two cents have a good day[/quote] As far as the customer serivice thing being a joke, it isn't. From Wikipedia: In 2004 and 2007, the American Customer Satisfaction Index survey found that Comcast had the worst customer satisfaction rating of any company or government agency in the country, including the Internal Revenue Service.[22] As far as it not being related to torrent blocking: Comcast has recently implemented traffic shaping measures using Sandvine hardware which sends forged RST packets, disrupting the BitTorrent protocol. This has prevented some Comcast users from uploading, or "seeding" files they have downloaded via BitTorrent.[25] Some Comcast users also may experience packet loss and latency, resulting in lag. This effect is most often noticed when dealing with time critical traffic in online gaming, and especially pronounced when such users host online games on ad-hoc networks (such as in Halo 3).[26] I've been trying to avoid directly linking from the Wikipedia page, but at this point I simply have to. You may indeed be right about the fact that it could be cable infrastructure in my area and not Sandvine causing the problem, but trying to say that Sandvine is not causing any problems whatsoever with Halo 3 is blatanly wrong. Edit: And not to take a personal shot at you, but working for 5 years in a National Repair Center doesn't necessarily give you any insight into the Net Neutrality Traffic Shaping that they are using. [Edited on 03.10.2008 1:33 PM PDT]
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My response is to the original post, very inaccurate post as far as trying to conclude that his connection problem has to do with the Comcast issue with blocking torrents from their network. It has absolutely nothing to do with that. I am a former engineer for Comcast, I was in their National repair center for 5 years as an engineer. The problem with cable is you have no guranteed bandwidth. It all depends on how many customers have cable in the immediate area you are in. You would need to know something about HFC to have an idea of what I am referring to. In each area or subdivision you live in, you will have fiber nodes that run to a head end. Depending on how many customers are hooked up at each fiber node, and how many of them are consuming bandwidth is what determines the speed you will get. In many markets they are upgrading their plants so that they can provide more bandwidth, so in some areas their service is great, other areas its going to stink. The statement about their customer service being the worst in america even the IRS is a flat out lie and a joke. A very naive statement made from someone who has never had to call companies like Dell or Qwest for any type of service. With that being said, I do completely agree that Comcast sucks. You think you hate being a customer of theirs, try working there for 5 years. They treat their employees like crap. I now work for a different cable company that covers smaller markets and we have no problems. If you are in a market where you have more choices than comcast try and go with Cox if you can. I do not work for them but they have the highest satisfaction ratings in the industry. Thats my two cents have a good day
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No problems after 3 years on comcast.
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Great thread. Although I have to give Comcast a tiny bit of credit. I have almost never lagged out of a game or been disconnected (except it happens frequently at my dad's house) and I get host quite often I believe. Good luck to you guys though!
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I had Comcast as Halo 3 launched, and let me say this: Comcast sucks so much ass. They monopolized cable connection in our county, and they made us pay an unprecedented $67 a month for their dicksucking connection. It sucked so badly, I couldn't surf the web for more than 10 minutes before being disconnected. Uhh.
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yeah, i have comast. most of my losses are from lag-outs and disconnects. it sucks.
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Thank god I have Fios, ive never lagged out of a game or have even gone below green bar since I got it.
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] L00 [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Zach The One Well I pay an extra $10 a month on top of the basic cable and don't have a problem with it. I used to have a lot of disconnects in the past, but that was because of faulty hardware on my end, not comcast. I call BS on this guy.[/quote]The Associated Press did a study on this a while back and said that Comcast was doing this. It might not be the problem in [i]every[/i] case, but it is in some cases.[/quote] Yeah, most of the info from Wikipedia came from the AP study and from associated news articles, which I took the time and read. It very likely ISN'T a problem in every case (it's far more likely that you are having issues with the way your router is set up and there are plenty of guides on here / online to tell you how to do it properly) but if you have spent a good deal of time with your router setting it up for Halo 3 and are still having problems it very well could be. As far as getting them to give me a new router and modem, I'll give that a shot too, and if that works I will post it here. Edit: And I have a feeling that alot of the people "calling BS" on me ddin't bother to read the wikipedia page or any of the articles associated with it. The fact that YOUR Comcast connection works doesn't mean that everyone elses does too. [Edited on 03.10.2008 1:04 PM PDT]
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I am a comcast user. The only disconnect issues I have had occurred a few months ago when everyone was having problems.
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] I Call Rockets Would you have any suggestions other than having them check the nodes at this point? I really don't think it could be any other issue, but I don't want to get charged for a service call by Comcast because they came out and didn't fix anything.[/quote]I've had similar problems in the past. I just called and told them I refuse to pay. I am using their equipment and it isn't working. Them coming out and finding nothing isn't my problem...that doesn't change the fact that it still doesn't work. Comcast is pretty good about waiving those kinda things without much of a fight.
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Zach The One Well I pay an extra $10 a month on top of the basic cable and don't have a problem with it. I used to have a lot of disconnects in the past, but that was because of faulty hardware on my end, not comcast. I call BS on this guy.[/quote]The Associated Press did a study on this a while back and said that Comcast was doing this. It might not be the problem in [i]every[/i] case, but it is in some cases.
