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Edited by Shacker: 9/25/2014 5:28:28 PM
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Why did Bungie leave Microsoft?

Please read this in its entirety if you're going to comment. I didn't do a TLDR, because TLDRs are for people who want the end result and not the work it takes to get there. Things in life are a journey. My question is why did Bungie leave Microsoft? Why did they leave a partnering with a company that brought both partners extreme success? Surely they weren't conned by what Sony offered, we all know that Sony screws its customers over every chance it gets. They have a great product (PS4), so we continue to buy. However, you should still know that Sony will screw you over in a heartbeat to achieve greater sales figures. Microsoft is in a new era in All aspects of their company, now I know they have only made this amazing innovative transition in the last 3 years and these partnerships were probably set up 5-6 years ago. However, it's depressing that they would break away from everything they've done right to try something new and have it completely blow up in their face. Destiny is not a bad game, but it's not really a good one either. It is a solid foundation, and will most of you who say you're going to leave actually leave? Probably not. So they are going to get their money this way as well, yet coming from the Halo series we didn't see so much turmoil in the player base. I'm just wondering why they did what they did, I'm also curious why they haven't released a simple response as to the discourse running through these forums. If I had to guess I would say that about 80-85% of post are negative. Now if we account for the fact that humans lean towards the negative more quickly than the positive then probably 50% of these people are genuinely dissatisfied with their experience. I'm still on the fence, because the actual gameplay is so much fun that running the same mission for the 100th time still seems to be fun. However, my resolve is fading quickly as week one passed and now week two. I don't want new content per say, I want SOME form of acknowledgement from Bungie about how completely unhappy most appear to be. I've seen one post from a Bungie employee. I browse these forums hoping for a glimmer of positive hope for about 2-3 hours per day and in all that time I've seen [b]one[/b] post. It was a generic tell you nothing post in response to someone complaining about something or another. I'm used to investing in Indie games and getting a solid Long weekly update of what's happening at the studio and what's happening with the fans and their feedback and how that's shaping the changes. This wall of silence and no acknowledgment is very foreboding for me. It's not normal for me, I'm unused to having someone who's salary I pay not listen to my feedback. If I were to stop listening to my customers at work and take weeks to respond to their request just to let them know "hey I'm here and I promise you I'm working on it diligently" then I will easily lose that customer. I'm also curious as to why Bungie got in bed with Activision. A company that is known for being hated in the gaming community. A company that maximizes profits, at the cost of making their customers feel neglected. The issue is as gamers we Will buy the games. We are gamers, most of us no matter what we say on a forum somewhere are going to purchase the next big game in the genre we enjoy. The endless search for an amazing game keeps us going. Occasionally we stop at one for a time, but eventually it's time to move on and keep the search alive. The real interesting part to all this, is not what I'm going to get in the future, but has Bungie taken their Halo success and decided to screw their fans and capitalize on their success as a company? It's not far fetched as All major producers have done this once they become successful. Studios have done it as well to get the most money out of their products (Blizzard). Time will only tell. I will say this to those complaining about having a game unfinished. Give it time. No game that has the potential to be as big as this game does is going to have a smooth roll out with all lights green. Think of it this way, any issues we are seeing now are not issues that Bungie would have known about without having the game out live. They've fixed all the issues we saw in Alpha and Beta. The gameplay is great, the mechanical back end of the game is great. It takes a while to build a stone foundation, but I promise you in the end it's worth it. Patience is a virtue, and it's tough sometimes. Also, to the people complaining about paying for the DLC, which will supposedly give us more of a story, I think it's to be expected. You can't make a great game with a 1 time fee and not pay for it somehow. Does it stink that you paid 60 dollars for a great foundation with only the flooring laid and not the walls put up? Sure it does, and I'm right there with you. However, if we can suffer paying the extra for the DLC then I'm will to beat so long as Bungie is still Bungie then we are going to get a pretty decent ROI. Thanks for reading this far, if you would like to comment on this please feel free. I welcome others opinions so long as they are polite and constructive to the overall conversation.
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#Bungie

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  • You gonna write some 85 page book report and not give a TL;DR Ok I'll bookmark your post and read it the next time I'm in the bathroom. But just know you're going to get a response from me while I'm still in the bathroom, think about that

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    • tl;dr

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    • Holy wall of text.

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    • Too Long Didn't Read lol

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      • To answer the original question, at least from my knowledge of Bungie, they never wanted to join forces with Microsoft in the first place. The decision to be bought was economic, since they were having financial problems at the time, and Microsoft would be able to provide a stable financial backing to allow Bungie to continue making games. However, Bungie still valued the independence they once had, something which become more apparent after Halo 3. Halo was supposed to be the second trilogy within a larger trilogy, Marathon being the first trilogy, as evidenced by the whole Durandal, Curtana, Joyeuse theory. This meant that Halo would be done after the third game, and Bungie would move on to something else. Microsoft, seeing the potential money that could be milked out of Halo, was not okay with this. The disagreement was eventually resolved with an agreement that Bungie would be given their independence after making two more Halo games, ODST and Reach, and leaving the Halo IP behind so that Microsoft could continue to milk it. Please keep in mind that this only my own theory and not necessarily true. I'd like to think that I know Bungie well enough to understand that this is what happened, but for all I actually know, it could be completely wrong. And to address the content of your post, I'm not really sure why Destiny is getting so much negative feedback. I loved Halo for its story and game design. I'm not seeing the same principles of game design that I loved in Halo, but I also wasn't expecting to. I still think Destiny is a great game, and it's certainly going to be entertaining me for a very long time. I feel like it's pretty complete. My only complaint is that its missing a lot a features which I thought would have been essential for a social game, particularly split-screen, proximity voice chat, and a larger cap on fireteam sizes. Those complaints aside, the only reason I suspect there might be so much negative feedback is that it was hyped up to much. Being a brand new IP, people expected too much from all the advertising without a reasonable expectation of what the game would actually be. Halo 1 didn't have this problem because it wasn't really hyped. It was successful because it was recognized as a great game despite its low profile. While later Halo games were hyped, people at least knew what to expect because they were sequels. Just as long as the game was "better," or packed with more content than the previous game, then it would live up to the hype. Essentially, people got a great game when they were expecting a ground-breakingly amazing one, and are now disappointed that it didn't meet their expectations.

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        • I agree on your statement guys this game is far from done if you all notice bungie is trying there best to bring excitement to the upcoming stuff they put in the game so what if they patch a cave the game is ment to run around to public events missions and or raids not sit a spot and look at a dark cave what puts the fun in that.. I never farm I can careless of it instead I do weekly night fall mission if I beat I make sure I help my friends do so they can understand that even if it is hard all challenges can be beat.. I say bungie keep working great on this game still lots of work to do but I'm pretty sure we are all excited for upcoming events.

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          • I agree with everything you said, except for that Microsoft is a good company, or that Sony is a bad company, or that Destiny is a bad game, or that Halo was better than Destiny, or that Activision screws over their customers, or that almost everyone is disappointed with Destiny. Xbox sales are low because Microsoft is terrible to their customers. Remember all the Orwellian things they tried to do with Xbox ONe until they almost had a riot on their hands? Have you ever called Xbox support? It isn't a challenge, I wouldn't wish that experience on anyone. Going back a couple years, remember the Red Ring Of Death and how awesomely they handled that? I went through 3 360's in 6 months before I moved to Playstation. Although you said multiple times that it is well known that Sony screws their customers over, I didn't see any specific examples so I can't really comment except to say that I strongly disagree. I've never had a bad experience with Playstation, and as I talked about in the previous paragraph I've had plenty of issues with Microsoft. I guess the quality of Destiny as a game is your opinion, but sales figures and reviews show that you are in the minority. Although to be fair you're on Xbox and therefor haven't played on Dust Palace or Exodus Blue or shot the Monte Carlo. I'm not saying those things make the game, but it is my favorite strike, pvp map and exotic weapon. Again the Halo vs Destiny argument is an opinion. Mine was that Halo was good but not great, and Destiny is so far the best game I've ever played. Its still early though so we'll see if I get bored of it quick. Fortunately, PS4 gets the first expansion in 2 months so it wont take too long for new content. I used to be a big CoD fan before I switched to WoW and Final Fantasy 14, so I guess Destiny was inevitably going to be amazing to me, being a hybrid of FPS and MMO type games. CoD is the only Activision game I've ever played (well, except the TMNT games for the NES) but I have no complaints about Activision as a company or their support or anything. I've certainly never felt "screwed over" by them. I'm sorry you felt disappointed by Destiny, but I haven't seen anyone who has disliked it for what it IS. I hear "It should be more like Halo" (which I'm assuming is your stance), "It should be more like Call of Duty", or "It should be more like World of Warcraft". My answer to all of those arguments is the same: Go play those games, then. I want Destiny to be more like Destiny. While it pulls elements from other genre's, the only game I can even slightly compare it to is Borderlands, and Destiny blows Borderlands out of the water in every way but ridiculous humor. Anyways, I do want to compliment you on a well thought out article. I disagree with almost all of it and I feel like you assumed on several occasions that your views reflected the views of the gaming community at large, but that still puts you ten steps above the average fanboy post.

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            • Both companies(Microsoft and Sony) are all about profit, both have screwed customers over, both are equally deplorable as they are awesome in their own regards. Saying one is worse than the others is ridiculous. This is asking for this thread to get de-railed into another console war thread. Short story though, Why did Bungie go independent? I certainly don't know and it's probably something completely different than what all of us think.

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              • Because they don't wanna give Xbox players free shit like they did for play station

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              • Edited by PrometheanSun: 9/25/2014 11:03:33 PM
                -Why Bungie REALLY Left: (money) The reason Bungie left Microsoft was not because they were tired of making Halo. Destiny feels just like Halo. Sure, the core concept of how you play the game is different, but so was Halo 1 in it's day. If you want to get to the heart of why a company does anything, just follow the money. Bungie would have at one point looked at the costs to benefits of leaving Microsoft, and realized that they could profit greatly from leaving MS. Bungie would have taken Halo with them if they could. Wouldn't you? Even if you are completely sick of a game, you can still create a brand new team (such as 343) that would be thrilled to death to work on it for you, and you don't have to give away creative control and direction. Bungie doubled their potential revenue by going cross-platform. -But Why Activision? Who else is big enough to finance a game like this (and won't tie them into just one console)? Activision kinda knows what they're doing when it comes to MMOs (personal feelings aside). -But I Hate Activision! Yeah... well, no one ever called Bungie Indie. Seems to me like they deserve each other. -Why Won't Bungie Acknowledge Us? Simple. It's no ones job to. Every employee there has signed an Non-Disclosure-Agreement when being hired on. After all, it is the responsibility of the marketing department to communicate with future and current customers not of the testers nor even creators. Likely they are too busy to get around to hiring/reassigning someone to the position. Alternatively, if they already have one, they are likely handling some bigger problem. The game has just been released. Their first priority has been towards removing bugs (Loot Cave was a bug). Their second priority is most likely to push scheduled content releases. If those two tasks are not strenuous enough (and they are) then they can get around to fixing problems that we, the players, see with the game. Bungie at this particular moment is more than likely over-worked and under staffed. Be patient, there is a lot of work to be done.

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              • Its soooo long

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                • *facepalm* claims sony to be bad does not know that ms tried to force bungi to make only halo a real group of saints

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                  • Edited by Giblet: 9/25/2014 7:06:26 PM
                    Didn't really mean for this to trend. As my original message against Sony was too harsh and based off of what I've experienced and what I've read let me rephrase and hopefully save myself some dignity. Sony doesn't have the greatest track record for listening to customers. I'm talking about all their product lines not just one. Sony TV is a great example of this. Microsoft is still a corporation and wants your money yes, however their track record is better and in the last few years they have become extremely innovative comparative to what they where in years past. Their innovation has come from listening to their customers. Here's the thing when I look at a company for stocks I don't look at a company for one division of that company. A company's culture is spread throughout the divisions. Since I take into account everything and don't get stuck on one thing I like to buy products from certain companies that I feel are doing more of what I as a consumer want. Microsoft is trending towards the "kinda sorta listens to their customers" side of things while Sony is still "complaints fall on almost deaf ears" side of things. Xbox one sales overtook PS3 sales over their 7 year (I think that's right) stints. Why you may ask? Microsoft listened to the complaints and devoted appropriate resources to fixing them. Sony clearly did not, or the sales figures would show that as the PS3 was the superior machine graphically. XbOne launch, Microsoft was 100 dollars more than an already $400 gaming device. That's a lot of money for most people, so the one's who had no allegiance said "I'm getting a PS4". Give it two years or less and I'm betting we will see Microsoft on top in sales figures, because you get a device that has multiple functions for the same price of a device that has one function. The interface is better looking as well (opinion). I'm not really sure why I'm talking deeply about this to forum people who may be perfectly normal, but get their 2 year oldness out each day on a forum :(. It's worth a shot though I suppose.

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                  • Very well written sir.

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                    • Edited by HoboBoxes: 9/25/2014 5:21:30 PM
                      I think you forgot the part the E3 Xbox one reveal. Either way I prefer xbox. Microsoft is just as money hungry and screws people over all the time

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                    • Lol you lost me when you said MS are a more caring company lol I felt shit on at every turn during my time on the xbox. Sony are a far better company and their sales figures are a reflection of that.

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                    • They left MS because MS wanted them to make more Halo games. MS wasn't interested in giving Bungie the freedom they desired nor the resources needed to launch a new IP. Activision has the money and reach to see their project through. Also, Blizzard's success with Activision shows that they are not opposed to stepping back and letting the developer do what they do best. EA, the only other publisher in the industry with the resources to support the launch of a massive new IP like Destiny, has not shown that same respect to any of the developers under their umbrella. I say that as a veteran of the games industry who worked on two EA projects.

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                      • Stopped reading at Sony screws its customers every chance they get. Get out of here here with the ms fanboyism.

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                      • The ms fanboy is strong

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                      • Yup just fanboyism not interested in you trolling go back to IGN or Gamespot with console war post this is for destiny topics

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                      • You deviated off topic so i stopped reading.

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                      • Ya dude I'm not reading your essay there but to answer your question microshit is horrible to work under and they couldn't take it anymore, they wanted to make new IPs but Microsoft would only let them do more halos so they left and picked up activision as a producer instead. Now they can actually sell to both consoles(making way more sales) and actually do the game they've wanted to do for years

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                        • Because bungie I had only one game and Microsoft being as progressive left

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                        • >says Sony will screw over their fans every chance they can to make a buck >backs MS I like MS more but that's just -blam!-ing retarded.

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                          • TL;DR

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                          • Maybe because they got tired of making halo? I mean look at naughty dog. They stick with sony, because they don't keep them locked into one IP for all eternity. You're just a moron.

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