I'm skeptical of even posting this. Regardless, the WayPoint forge forums are dead, and feel that these ideas NEED to at least be available to the Halo community, even if most will say TLDR (Too long, didn't read).
WARNING: HUGE wall of text ahead. The items listed below are in no particular order, and come from multiple avid Forgers who spend 90% of their Halo time in Forgeworld.
NOTE: All these ideas are based on the assumption that the next Halo game comes on two disks. This would allow for exponentially greater space for Campaign and Forge and Multiplayer.
[b][u]Disk One[/u][/b]:
Campaign (Big, and I mean BIG. 18+ hours at least)
campaign Matchmaking
Firefight
Firefight Matchmaking
[b][u]Disk Two[/u][/b]:
Multiplayer
Multiplayer Matchmaking
Forge
Forgeworld (upgraded; see below)
This setup would allow for a much better Forge, Campaign, and Multiplayer system. Also, it would be great if we could play both installed disks from just Disk One (and only Disk One).
[b][u]The Next Forge should have[/u][/b]:
- [b][u]Terrain Cubes[/u][/b] (That's 6 sides) (Small, Medium, Large, Extra Large (With different terrain geometry on each side (flat, wavy, hill, indented, etc.) There would be multiple cube textures (Grass, Sand, Mountain, etc)))
- [b][u]Different Forge Object Textures[/u][/b] ((Each in its own category) Halo: CE, Halo 2 (ruins), Halo 2 (regular (forerunner)), Halo 3, Human, Covenant)
- [b][u]Open-able Doors[/u][/b] using channels (alpha, bravo, Charlie, etc (this includes gates, such as on Zanzibar, Containment, Highground)Open-able doors which can either bet set to "normal" (which would make them automatically open for a player and close behind him/her), or set to a specific 'channel', like the teleporters (alpha, bravo, charlie, ..., x-ray, yankee, zulu, etc.). If the door was set to a channel, you would then place a 'panel' and set it to the same channel. During a game, a player would go up to the panel and it would say "Press X to use Panel". The door would then open.
The beauty of this is that you could place the door at one spot, and the panel wherever you want. Since both are linked through the channel setting, it wouldn't matter where either was located. Also, by using the channel system, you can have multiple doors open with one switch, or multiple switches open one door.
You could even have a setting for the switch which would allow it to be used to open AND close doors, such as an option like:
[b]SWITCH PROPERTIES[/b]: "Open", "Close", "Both"
You should be able to set it's reuse time, or the time between uses:
[b]REACTIVATION TIME[/b]: "Instant", "Never", "5 seconds", "10 seconds", "1 minute", etc.
Include multiple "door" sizes: "Small" (like a door in any hallway), "Medium" (such as those gates on Zanzibar/Last resort), "Large" (Like those big base gates on Containment), "Extra Large" (Use your imagination).
Also, some sort of correlation between switches and teleporters would be cool, like on Relic: How you had to hit a switch to activate the teleporters.
- [b][u]Automatic Doors[/u][/b] (Like in campaign; doors that open as you approach and close as you move away.)
- [b][u]Different Sky-Box options[/u][/b] (Nighttime, Daytime, Sunset, Stormy, etc) This would replace lighting-effects.You could have multiple different Sky-box options:
Regular
Morning
Night
Evening
Stormy
et.
You would just select one while Forging your map and it would switch to it. The beauty of having the sky-box swap is that it's just one less thing to constantly bog-down the server during gameplay. The lighting effects used currently are just filters, and can affect gameplay. We should at least have the option to Forge on different Forgeworlds with these different Sky-Boxes before we even start the game:
Forgeworld
Forgeworld (Night)
Forgeworld (Stormy)
Forgeworld (Sunset)
etc.
- [b][u]Forgeable Water[/u][/b] (Using 'Objective' area shape (cylinder, box) with water surface at top; anything inside the boundaries but below the surface will be 'underwater' (Option to have it 'flow' (fast for rapids (and waterfalls (when turned sideways)), slow for creeks and such, and an 'ocean' option; one default 'flow' direction only)))
- [b][u]FIX THE "EDIT COORDINATES" and "ROTATION SNAP"[/u][/b]! (Sometimes objects don't align, especially when flipped upside down. Also, what the heck is up with rotation snap?)
- [b][u]Mirrored Objects[/u][/b] (This is A MUST! Either an option to mirror a selected object, or pre-mirrored objects)
- More [b][u]Window-like Objects[/u][/b] that are more versatile. (Perhaps just window pane objects with no frame (small, medium, large))
- At least [b][u]26 Different Teleporter Pairs[/u][/b], one pair for each channel (That's 52 total teleporter placements. A little extreme, but it is definitely needed. Also, this could possibly have a correlation between this and the open-able doors system (Key a switch to activate a teleporter).)
- [b][u]Bigger Forge World with different biomes[/u][/b] (desert, Artic, mountain, Cave, etc.)They should take the existing Forgeworld and expand upon it. All those areas we can't currently get to should be altered so as to offer better playability (Flattening land and such). This would include the large out of bounds area above the Canyon and the Area with that large Forerunner Tower-Structure-Thing.
Then, they should at least quadruple the size of Forgeworld, spanning it out in multiple directions. You should be able to fly to those distant shores you see in the distance and forge there (as viewed from the shores of the canyon, and island). Even further away should be a DESERT AREA. If you go to the CANYON's shore and look out in the distance to the right, you'll see what appears to be a desert. You should be able to fly over to it and forge there.
From the ISLAND, you can look out across a big sea and see a distant shore that looks snowy. That should be a SNOW AREA. On the far side of the Snow area should be an Ice-Shelf Cliff that drops into another ocean-like area, only arctic themed (with ice floating in it, etc).
There should also be a very, VERY LARGE CAVE (Bigger than Waterworks) inside a mountain which is accessible via a hole in the ceiling (like in Waterworks) and by a hole in one of the walls that is very easily concealed with a Forgeable rock. Likewise, the hole in the ceiling is concealable.
From the PILLAR you can see a valley between that 'Skull Mountain' and the main area of Forgeworld. You should be able to fly through that valley and emerge into an area suited for Forging URBAN ENVIRONMENTS. Perhaps this would be an exposed part of the Halo superstructure (like an uncovered part, as seen in Halo 3), or something like a collection of Forerunner structures in an urban setup. This area should also contain an entrance to an even larger "inside" area (such as the COLISEUM).
Each one of these 'biomes' should be at least the size of the current Forgeworld (hopefully bigger) and offer as much if not more terrain diversity suited for each area individually. Also, the areas in-between each biome should be populated by diverse and suitable terrain that illustrates the changing climate and ecosystem with transitional textures (i.e. the closer you get to the desert, the more dry the land becomes, the less green the grass is, more sandy patches appear, etc.. As you approach the SNOW area, snowy patches in the grass should become more and more common, etc.)
I realize that this seems like a lot to fit on one disk that also has Campaign, Multiplayer, firefight, etc. This is why I've been pushing for a Two Disk game:
- [b][u]Weather Control[/u][/b] (Possibly in conjunction with Sky-Box; rain, snow, etc.)
- [b][u]Light Bridges[/u][/b] (like in Halo: CE (Not crucial, but very, very useful) Small (Like the ones on the flood level), and Large (Like the vehicle one on the Halo level). Length adjustment. The large one should have those moving beams underneath it. The Light bridges would be under the same area as open-able doors and use the same 'channel' system).
- [b][u]Animated Objects[/u][/b] (Such as the big Fan on Zanzibar, The spinning array on Ascension, or the pile-driver thingy on Waterworks. They are decorative pieces).
- [b][u]Civilian Vehicles[/u][/b]? (Maybe? Doesn't really matter, but it would be nice)
- [b][u]Mega-Structures[/u][/b] (BIG, detailed objects such as large Forerunner Structures or human Buildings. These would be very, very large (such as the Spire, or that Forerunner structure on Forgeworld, or those weather-control things on Tempest))
- [b][u]More Rocks[/u][/b], bigger rocks (HUGE, to be used to wall-off areas; possible texture Cubes option) There should be a rock dedicated to walling-off areas, such as the CAVE Biome mentioned above.
- [b][u]Forgeable Trees[/u][/b]? (Maybe? Not as big a deal, but still extremely useful and very wanted by the community.)
- [b][u]Forgeable Invisible Walls[/u][/b] (With adjustable dimensions (This is needed. Kill-Boundaries aren't good. Especially Soft Kill-Boundaries; Regular 'death barrier' Kill-Boundaries are still needed).)
- A [b][u]'Despawn Time'[/u][/b] option (The opposite of 'Spawn Time'. Similar to the 'Invasion Gate' option currently available while forging Invasion Maps in Halo Reach)
- [b][u]More accurate time settings[/u][/b] for 'Spawn Time', 'Despawn Time', 'Respawn Time'. (Just add a 'minutes' option AND a 'seconds' option.)
- [b][u]CRUCIAL: An Extreme Increase to 'Budget'[/u][/b] and the number of objects able to be placed at one time. An EXTREME INCREASE. MUCH, MUCH MORE (like, over 10x as much).
[Edited on 04.28.2011 9:44 AM PDT]
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love the iteas
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These are very well thought-out ideas, but it seems a little too much of expanding the current ability.
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Mikal7 - [b][u]Terrain Cubes[/u][/b] (That's 6 sides) (Small, Medium, Large, Extra Large (With different terrain geometry on each side (flat, wavy, hill, indented, etc.) There would be multiple cube textures (Grass, Sand, Mountain, etc))) [/quote] Cool idea, but just wondering, does anyone know how to make 3-dimensional hills on a flat cube? Cubes are six-sided, regular polygons, not six-sided odd-ball objects. Call it a box. Semantics aside, if someone could make a design on something like "Sketch-up", that would be good, just as an example as to how it would be possible to make it logically. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Mikal7 - [b][u]Different Forge Object Textures[/u][/b] ((Each in its own category) Halo: CE, Halo 2 (ruins), Halo 2 (regular (forerunner)), Halo 3, Human, Covenant) [/quote] Another cool idea, but overcomplicated. Just stick to things like "Forerunner", "Human, Civilian", "Human, Military", "Human, Ancient Ruins", "Covenant", "Flood". Keep it simple, forget about which game it came from. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Mikal7 - [b][u]Open-able Doors[/u][/b] [/quote] A little bit of a confusing read, maybe I'm just getting lazy, but it sounded pretty solid. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Mikal7 - [b][u]Different Sky-Box options[/u][/b] (Nighttime, Daytime, Sunset, Stormy, etc) This would replace lighting-effects.You could have multiple [...] The beauty of having the sky-box swap is that it's just one less thing to constantly bog-down the server during gameplay. The lighting effects used currently are just filters, and can affect gameplay. We should at least have the option to Forge on different Forgeworlds with these different Sky-Boxes before we even start the game: Forgeworld Forgeworld (Night) Forgeworld (Stormy) Forgeworld (Sunset) etc. [/quote] I don't know exactly about this one, in any aspects. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Mikal7 - [b][u]FIX THE "EDIT COORDINATES" and "ROTATION SNAP"[/u][/b]! (Sometimes objects don't align, especially when flipped upside down. Also, what the heck is up with rotation snap?)[/quote] Please be more clear as to exactly what you mean. The "Edit Coordinates" issue is just different/poor placing of the center point (the coordinate that the object exists/rotates at) on the object. I'm assuming and hoping that you're freaking out about the random rotation of objects while entering the "Edit Coordinates" menu. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Mikal7 - More [b][u]Window-like Objects[/u][/b] that are more versatile. (Perhaps just window pane objects with no frame (small, medium, large))[/quote] Cool idea, but don't windows add a decent amount to frame-rate issues? Correct me if I'm wrong. Please. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Mikal7 - At least [b][u]26 Different Teleporter Pairs[/u][/b], one pair for each channel (That's 52 total teleporter placements. A little extreme, but it is definitely needed. Also, this could possibly have a correlation between this and the open-able doors system (Key a switch to activate a teleporter).) [/quote] No. Just, why? 26 channels are not needed at all. Chiron TL-34 didn't even use that many (Again, correct me if I'm wrong). Seriously. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Mikal7 - [b][u]Bigger Forge World with different biomes[/u][/b] ( [...] Then, they should at least quadruple the size of Forgeworld, spanning it out in multiple directions. You should be able to fly to those distant shores you see in the distance and forge there (as viewed from the shores of the canyon, and island). Even further away should be a DESERT AREA.[/quote] WHAT!? Really? You defended this idea in your response post saying that the game would unload distant objects like [i]single-player[/i] (or cooperative only) games do, replacing them with low-res images. Okay, that's fine and dandy for single or cooperative RPG's, do you have an example of this from a multiplayer FPS? Just let it be multiple maps. It'll perform amazingly better. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Mikal7 - [b][u]Mega-Structures[/u][/b] (BIG, detailed objects such as large Forerunner Structures or human Buildings. These would be very, very large (such as the Spire, or that Forerunner structure on Forgeworld, or those weather-control things on Tempest))[/quote] I'm assuming you would like a one "Mega-Structure" per map limit, right? Otherwise, I'm going to say performance would die pretty quick. There were a couple other things, such as the "Extreme Increase to 'Budget'" that you've proposed that are just insane, but for the most part, it's pretty good. Oh, invisible walls would be good.
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I have one suggestion to contribute to this thread, and that is map privacy. Ever since the introduction of forge in halo 3, people have constantly pushed the limit to what is capable through the forge system. This brought birth to an entirely different form of digital art. Some people view the forge system as a creative outlet, and consider their work art. However, there are always those undesirable people who steal the maps to call them their own. To me this is equivalent to walking into an art museum stealing a painting then saying you painted it, then having everyone believe you. [u]My Suggestions to combat this:[/u] Map privacy! When you save your map, you are presented with 3 different options to choose from: [u]Open[/u]- This privacy allows any person to download your map and edit it to their liking [u]Moderate[/u]-This option allows any one to download your map, but they can't make changes to it in forge [u]Closed[/u]- This option prevents anyone from downloading your map or editing it One more suggestion, we could also integrate the map and gametype into one file. If a map has multiple gametypes, you could also have an option to add multiple gametypes for the player to select from.
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Sounds like you've got some good ideas there.
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There is already a thread for this [url=http://www.bungie.net/Forums/posts.aspx?postID=52362108&postRepeater1-p=1] Here [/url] and IMO it has a way better list [Edited on 07.23.2011 9:24 AM PDT]
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This sounds good, but in reality, only REALLY dedicated mappers would ever finish a map. Also, the mappers themselves would be able to incorporate secrets (such as teleporters or door switches) that other players may not be able to find if the map becames a matchmaking map.
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Forge 3.0? When and where did you hear about this?
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Best thing to add to Forge: Mission editor. I do not know if anyone knows what I am talking about, but like StarCraft. Placing AIs, adding objectives and areas that activate certain other things, and stuff like that. Also included should be spawns (look like initial but with Spartans and Elites for different faction spawns, and both specie initial spawns have an arrow above). Also included could be another few types of spawn. The regular spawn point, painted black (as that is the only unused recognizable color in forging for spawns), which will have Spartans, Elites, Grunts, Brutes, Marines, ODSTs, and so forth. Under the properties of advanced, the gametype label would be (infantry, specialist, leader - forming the types of AIs in the campaign). Elites in infantry would spawn either a Minor or an Officer, and specialist would form either a Ranger or a Spec Ops. I know it could be buggy but look at the possibilities!
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I would say, that another, simple feature about monitors, would be that the "eye" part of it, which is always blue, is instead you primary color, so for instance, red, green, cyan, and so forth
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Even if everything in this thread was delivered people would still -blam!- about things not included. Although I really like the ideas here :D (Though they've been working on Halo 4 for over a year already now, so idk how much impact this will be able to have)
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What I've always wanted and really think would work were: .Monitor weapons! I think Bungie tried to do this in reach but it seems like it hit a snag and was removed. It's annoying when you're building a map and a friend joins the other team and AR spams you so a monitor laser would be quite useful. .Editable monitors! Changing to sentinels and possibly an Engineer would be cool and also changing the colours to say metalic red would also add individuality to forge!
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Maybe add Rust or Moss to building blocks, like colour is added. Ability to build a map (from scrape) on the computer (like Oblivions TES construction) and then upload it to B.net to then be downloaded onto your xbox. You could seriously make some awesome stuff. ----------------------- Or perhaps go in an entirely new direction with forge and add in a campaign. Forge objectives, film scenes (like age of mythology use to) and then even add in A.I.s and voices through Kinnect/ mics. If I could do that, I would make one hell of an amazing complex and twisting storyline, filled with amazing strange facts that relate to it, such as 5% of people shot in the head survive or that for each hemisphere of your brain is a consciousness, and if removed into two can cause limbs to literally have a mind of their own. My god it would be epic.
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How about different types of kill barriers like the ones on Snowbound (Turrets).
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Rather than a single GIANT forge world like you suggested, I would rather have multiple worlds with the same forge pallets; then we wouldn't have to put up with the bad lag/framerate we have already.
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Increased budget? Why not have an Infinite budget with some sort of frame rate meter that tells you whether or not your map will be playable.
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sounds good, I would love this.
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cool story bro.
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I read the start, I completely agree with the mentioned things. I'd say a fog controle would be nice, seperate from the weather controle, so you could set it to either night time fog or dusk fog ect. With the fog being adjustable. The possibility of bot placement would be an extremely great edition, it has been done before in other games, such as 'time splitters fp' the controle wouldn't be great, but giving bots a plat style and such could set up for being able to create complete play through levels. In essence, giving us the ability to make a game with the game. ^.^ I'd say that's definatly something 343 would need to consider, taking into account you previously stated 2 disk option op.
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AI in forge would be propably the thing I want the most. With lot of custom values like health,shields,damage,meleedamage,team, and maybe some coloring of it's armor. Maybe even away how the AI behaves, like is it sneaky, berserk, grenadier, protector etc. And the thing that the AI data is on the other disk. Maybe the game could use the AI data by installing the disc 1 to your xbox. But a possible idea that I'd like to have is that you should be able to customize the size of simple forge pieces. Like the buildin blocks in Reach, because I have to use so manh pieces just to make one building, it would be good if the size of a building block were customizable like the kill boundarys size when using the box shape. Also the size of the shield pieces (shield, shield wall, one way shield) would be good to be customizable because they are always either too small or too big. And maybe you could be able to have a shield box piece, which size you could customize in the same way.
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If you had a super large forge world with deserts, caves, forerunner city, waterworld, etc. You would need a much larger budget and teleporters, or else you could take like 5 minutes to get from 1 end to the other. Or you could just have DIFFERENT choosable maps which would result in you spawning in somewhere else e.g. Forge World: Desert Would result in you spawning in the desert instead of the middle place.
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I 1000% agree with you. I love Bungie but REACH would have been so much better if Forge was like this.
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Hey, I love these ideas, but I would really like to be able to place enemies like the flood and covenant. Like you could spawn a few skirmishers and have them attack whatever team or all (neutral). I would also LOVE being able to forge a firefight map with wave spawns and ammo boxes and everything. It would be fun but I can understand why they wouldn't do that. I mean, I don't know if I'm happy about the fact that they made custom FF (cuz everyone makes themselves invincible, and it isn't a challenge.)
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This idea would be possible since you're asking for full map editor like Farcry 2 on console had full map editor mode, and it has proven it has no lags, etc. It would be possible for Halo 4 to have full-fledged map editor as long they do optimization and use completely new game engine from scratch. (it is possible since Halo 4 may be on new game engine or close to UDK) [Edited on 06.21.2011 6:51 PM PDT]
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Personally, I think that if they do put Drop Pods in, they would be scenery, and you could phase them into the ground to make them crashed. Also, by openable doors, do you mean like in ODST when you pushed a button to open them, or they open when you approach them?
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I hope that the next halo game will have all of this stuff in it, It would make forging a bit more of a challenge but more worth it in the long run. Another thing that I wish they could do is a sort of item locking ability. Has anyone ever put two item together and wanted them to stick to each other even while on the normal physics setting? I also wish there was a way to interact with forge creations (Such as ships, boats, and others). I have seen a lot of really impressive forge creations but the only thing you can do with them is run around in them, it would be amazing if there were some way to make it to were you can interact with these kind of things, like adding a button or switch that makes the creations start moving. To do this there could be an option to set a predetermined path for the object, so that once the switch is activated the creations would follow the path and then return to it's original position. (If not for ships it could be for a platform that moves you from one base to another)