Alright so I've been through Nether a few times now. Gone flawless a couple times. So what I'm about to say has nothing to do with difficulty. Because Nether is not difficult, it's just bad... for a couple reasons.
Having a seasonal/episodic event tied to direct story progression should NEVER feature any type of negative health modifier, limited revives, or wipe mechanics. That is an absolute guarantee to piss people off for no gain for the game. Those modifiers serve no reason other than to inflict artificial pain points that SHOULD NOT exist in regular/story progression events. This is not me saying that difficult content shouldn't exist in this game, but rather they need to exist in specific places.
Bungie, you guys already have varying levels of difficulties for players to select, and it's fine that you guys want to try new game modes... but those new game modes should not come at the expense of continuing to shoot yourselves in the foot with negative sentiment everywhere I look. This is the -blam!- episode that's going to lead into frontiers and there shouldn't be this much negativity not even one week into the episode.
So here is some suggestions.
For the BASE LEVEL difficulty only... remove the no health regen, remove the limited revives. I really think we all severley underestimate just how little people want to build craft for the lowest difficulty offered for an activity. Those casual players just want to chill, turn their brains off, do the shooty's with the guns they like, and get the looties. And that is completely fine
For the harder difficulty, crank Those modifiers. Give us no health regen, make the enemies aggressive, give us the revive tokens. Really differentiate between the two difficulties and make the loot worth going for. Adept weapons need to be a guarantee for the first completion of the week. Armor drops in the harder mode also need to be 60+ on stat distributions.
Bottom line, any game mode attached to the seasonal/episodic story progression needs to be as braindead as possible for 99% of the players. If you guys don't want to have a brain dead option, don't tie it to story progression. It also needs to be at whatever level players were previously boosted to at the beginning of the years newest DLC. This will make it to where returning players can hop right in and not have to play catch up on their power level.
You shouldn't have to
build craft
Min/Max
Or in any way shape or form, worry about your load outs or abilities on base level content tied to story progression.
YOU SHOULD have to buildcraft/minmax and optimize load outs for hard mode content.
Bungie, it is such an easy change to appeal to both groups of players. Give the hard core players that feeling of accomplishment by overcoming extremely challenging content. You can do that WITHOUT sacrificing your casual players experiences. We can have both things in this game. I don't want this game to fail. I dont want to continue seeing the player base drop, or lapsed players not even try to come back because of all the negativity surrounding this episode so far. You guys can turn this around with simple changes. Make the normal mode a casual friendly experience. Make the harder mode kick me in the teeth.
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1 Reply
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1 ReplyStopped reading after you mentioned the health there's options suros, rat king, crimson, a few aspects for titan & warlock a few perks people just refuse to let them make a new activity actually NEW it rouge like ish play it buy upgrades use ghost mods to get minor buffs you want once you pick them up enough they get doubled its fine just the damage for damage perks are bad
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Edited by Ogma: Destroyer of Worlds: 2/13/2025 3:18:50 PMIt’s tolerable with other people. Solo nether is one of the most unfun experience I’ve ever had in this game though. Got a ton of drops, but super not fun to actually play. Fighting the tormentor boss was just an unfun slog.
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2 RepliesFunny part is bungie has aleady said it needs to be balanced...why not do that before hand baffles me but its just not fun. People seem to equate difficulty with fun yet running this as teh seasonal even will shows its just a chest opening event with a few minibuses thrown in and no replayability. Where is the fun? Challenge but not just stupid? Why is it always maxed either hard or too easy? You cant tell me bungie sat there and said "no hp gen and no new roaming area will sell like hotcakes!!!". There is just no way they could think this was fun other then 1 run. If they believe this is what constitutes fun then game is seriously at its end.
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3 RepliesEdited by Ghodzilla: 2/11/2025 12:13:44 AMThis is the best post on the forums in years. You absolutely nailed the issue. TLDR: Casuals pay Bungie's bills, and all this try hard bullshit is driving them away.
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1 ReplyI think the Nether is another in a long list of failures. The activity is too long, the entry power level is too high, it's aggravating, and the rewards aren't worth the effort. After a long day at the office, I like to play for an hour or 2, depending on how much fun I'm having. I've noticed a trend that the activities have been getting longer and have changed gradually to legendary lost sector type play, timers, and other B.S., I'm assuming locked load outs will be coming next. Once I get what I need from the Nether, it'll be another Neptune. Once I'm done getting what I need there, I won't go back. The game play is too repetitive, and the rewards aren't worth the time you spend there.
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4 RepliesI mostly agree, but could do without the brain dead part. Casual doesn't mean stupid or lazy. It can mean less time to play or, like me, someone who plays for fun and a challenge, but not abuse. I paid to play this game so being sent to orbit is ripping me off. Bungle isn't doing me any favors by "letting" me play. I'm doing them a favor by paying their bills. Time for these developers to get the memo.
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2 RepliesI agree. There are many many reasons to not have faith in the future of Destiny because of all these horrible decisions. The second I figure out there’s no health regeneration, I just don’t want to play it. Plus the infection spread into onslaught and strikes too. Break time again
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trash activity, not worth it
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3 RepliesEdited by Kirka: 2/10/2025 5:47:44 PMIt's kind of telling that everyone has to mention that personally THEY did not find the content difficult but.. And I think it's because of the bizarre mob mentality when it comes to online discussions and spesifically gaming. I remember 10 years ago when I bought Dark Souls 2 for Xbox 360 and it was my first game of that kind (later became my all time favorite game) I went online to look for some tips for a particular boss encounter. Well there it was, someone had asked the same questions and was instantly shut down and ridiculed, told to "git gud" and whatnot. It was absurd to me. And the same behavior has spread to Destiny. To make a comparison. My another hobby is weightlifting. I have done it for a long time, put quite a lot of time in it and am pretty decent. But when I see someone struggle in the gym with weights that are easy for me I don't tell them they're trash and should cancel their gym membership. When I see someone struggle with say overhead squat technique I don't tell them they're stupid and should go for a walk instead. It's baffling how gaming has this weird mentality. In any other hobby or sport it would be ridiculous.
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When these awful player-unfriendly mechanics make it past Beta testing, I always wonder 'Who the hell is Bungie testing this stuff on? Get a better Beta group. The ones you're using now do not care about your future.' The loss of health recovery is a massive PITA and (at this point Bungie) you can't afford deterrents-to-play.
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Agreed it is a bad seasonal activity mode, and from my point of view not because it's too difficult, it can be tough if I put myself in silly situations, but as a seasonal standard activity I should be able to be a bit funky. But that's not allowed, I will die quick, so for me the that's where the fun is taken out of the activity. Expert mode should be where the real drama is and cautious game play. It also takes too long especially if I am going to go look for everything. 1hr plus is not a good idea. It's tedious, repetitive and boring. Although most seasonal activities are, this one just seems more of a chore. Normal mode should be tuned down more an be quicker to go through, expert should be where the real challenges are if that's what you want.
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1 ReplyThank you! Very well said. I am one of these casuals. So far I wasn't able to finish a single Nether run to its end, neither solo nor in a fireteam. Story progression is possible but tedious. Losing a run last minute at the final boss due to no revives and then going to orbit, without even the opportunity giving your mates you spent 40 minutes with a commendation feels like a gigantic middle finger. Yeah, I got the message. Git gud! Dreadnought is nice but since when were we handicapped exploring a place due to limited lifes? Of course I can still play the game, there is enough content out there keeping me busy. Yet, it leaves a sour taste for the very last season of a 10 years journey. Personally I regret having paid for this episode. But we all do mistakes. Take care! And be realistic with regards to the future of this franchise.
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1 ReplyThis is exactly why Destiny will never grow. Bungie just can’t help themselves
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Bungie handicapping players in every activity has to stop in general. At some point, people will simply stop playing. I've done nether, flawless too, and I hate it. It has all the hallmarks of a fun, repeatable activity. But with the modifiers and limited revives, it plays like an activity you only do a handful of times and for specific rewards (like GMs). It's just so tedious and there's no chill unless you play with folks you know and you're all good at the game.
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2 RepliesI don’t know how anyone could argue with these sentiments you have so eloquently stated OP? Killing off casual content for casuals and those that don’t want to have difficulty permanently baked in at the lowest level is what is going to kill replayability for most people. Yet we’ll have the typical responses from those, that are bordering on the sociopathic imo, telling those of us that don’t like this direction the game is going to ; “get gud, it isn’t hard, why don’t you just leave?” etc etc. The latest gaslighting comment from a salty elitist is that we aren’t even the majority in expressing our opinion of the Nether and the new dungeon. What they fail to realise is that the majority of Destiny players are not here or on Reddit, they are silent. And the vast majority of players have left or will be leaving at the end of Heresy. We’ll see how well Frontiers sells. Sadly I predict it’s going to flop, hard. Not as hard as Concord, but maybe along the lines of DragonAge the Veilguard. To be honest Bungie will be lucky to sell as many copies as Veilguard.
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Let’s talk tuah
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I can't add anything to the OP. A very sensible and mature post. Well said 👏👏👏
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Bump++ 🫡
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Edited by Tis-but-a-scratch: 2/10/2025 5:21:59 PMCompletely agree with the sentiment that the story should not be a part of certain activities. Just turns people away. All very well said.
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Yeah, this activity is absolute cheeks
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6 RepliesBunige needs to take some insight with how Digital Extremes handles warframe. Both Destiny 1 and Warframe came out in 2013. Yet they keep reinventing themselves and their game. With actual quality of life changes and improving on what they have. Which is a regular basis. Bungie hasn't evolved much beyond what it has been since d1. The only thing that's changed is weapons in different slots, alpha stages of builds, and abilities, and that's it.
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4 RepliesMostly, amen. Bungo needs to figure out something simple that DOOM has offered since many decades ago; users appreciate more than two selectable difficulty levels, presumably with rewards scaled accordingly. Remember these? Too Young to Die, Hurt Me Plenty, Ultra Violence, Nightmare, Ultra Nightmare. [b]Allow campaign/story progression in all of them[/b]. Stop screwing over normal people who don't play your silly game for a living--there are a lot more of "us" than there are of the self-centered narcissist content creators, and our purchase dollars pay way more of your paychecks than theirs do. It's not rocket science, and Bungo apparently already understands the basic concept (Advanced vs. Expert, or whatever they call the levels this month).
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Edited by FlareFL: 2/11/2025 11:22:15 AMI don't understand why Bungie made limited resurrections for the basic difficulty, there seems to be an expert difficulty for such decisions. In general, I didn't like Nether as a new solution, since there is almost nothing new there, in fact, it is a patrol from the Destiny 1 with the same disabling of the ship's defense mechanisms from the Dreadnought introductory mission of the Destiny 1.
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1 ReplyEdited by Richie: 2/11/2025 9:40:39 AMI'm not gonna be holding my breath on Bungie making changes based on community feedback anymore, which is also why I'm not gonna be giving feedback anymore, and rather I'm just gonna play less and less when the game isn't fun. IF changes are ever implemented, it's the tiniest change, because ultimately Bungie doesn't care. Bungie has a vision, and if you don't like their vision... oh well, sucks for you. From now until July this is what the Nether will be like. It's funny, play Live Service games – or one specific Live Service game – long enough and you'll come to realize that the devs don't actually care for your input. Even if something is so genuinely unfun that player numbers are dropping off at a rapid rate, they still don't care. There could be 0 people playing their game and they still would not care to implement changes to make things more fun.
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For me the activity just gets old/boring after a few runs through. The dreadnaught for all its hype and size feels empty, nothing like it did when it was full of secrets and stuff to find in D1. The color palette this season also just makes it feel so bland and empty.