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3/19/2023 5:49:58 AM
101
Constructive Criticism
I’m sure no one will read this but I guess I wanna see if any of my average gamers out there agree.
Please no hate.
I’ve only been playing destiny for a few season and I accept that I probably miss out on a lot but I just am feeling very defeated with the recent new update of Destiny 2 with the light fall expansion.
I am a casual gamer and mainly started to play Destiny because my partner was playing frequently so it was our quality time together.
I used to find the game play easy to moderate and if I wanted something more difficult I would utilise the legendary options but I certainly could not make it through any master or grand master without seriously being carried through by other players.
I game because it’s fun and challenging but mainly for the fun aspect.
With the new update I can’t make it through any missions, nightfalls or a lot of the team content without dying over and over which make me feels really crap when I’m trying really hard to keep up.
I know… I know, people will say get good or maybe you need to play more to be better. I am an average player but pre-update I didn’t need to be carried at all.
I am understanding that Destiny has a large number of competitive players who felt it was to simply but for the average gamer like myself the game has become significantly difficult which leaves me feeling frustrated and eventually quitting.
There is no more enjoying the game play and having the option to crank up the difficulty when I want something more challenging which is destroying my desire to play the game.
Which after spending $160 for the new expansion because of my love for the game is highly disappointing.
Now to be better I have to understand the intricacies of knowing how to put my mods together in detail, what gun rolls are god rolls, and spend time figuring out how to make a strong character.
Which if you are playing competitively and trying to become an elite destiny player it makes sense that you would put that kind of time and energy in to the game.
But when your no longer able to complete normal content to gain things like enhancement cores or upgrade modules your character becomes stagnant and not matter what light level you become you will always struggle and a certain degree become resentful.
I feel as though bungie has neglected the average player and is probably going to lose customers because of it.
This is just my unpopular opinion but I hope to some degree Bungie might absorb some constructive criticism when making the next update.
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I believe alot of us here, the vets, the new, the olds and youngs probably agree with you on most part. I like how it was the previous season. This Season 19 sucks.
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4 RepliesI've turned several people away from the game because it's really not worth getting into. I'll list some of the reasons below. Bungie cannot figure out what they want to do with it, so it's always teetering between fun and -blam!_ up. Sometimes it will tilt all the way to one side, which is good when it's the fun side. Full priced game calling itself free to play with a free to play microtransaction storefront. Bungie is double dipping. Not enough people call them out on it. The difficulty changes feel more like a way to keep the more casual players in the game longer. What used to take 15 now takes 30 minutes and the rewards are still garbage. I can't respect a company who can't keep you engaged any other way than by cheap shots and calling it a "challenge". We know better. Bungie doesn't have a good onboarding process for new players. It takes too long to bring someone in and get them up to speed. Too many bugs and too many cheeses. Bungie starts seasons with ridiculous grinds and then lowers them eventually. So why even play until the end of a season? It's not like Bungie doesn't knows the grinds are too long either. Another insult "let's see if you'll do this or not". That's just a few. There's more, but it's not worth worrying about. It's just a game.
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18 RepliesEdited by Mara Sov’s Step Bro: 3/19/2023 6:23:53 AMI had mastered “master” content (didn’t step into raids or dungeons because it didn’t exist last time I played) and never set foot in GM seriously because I didn’t enjoy it. Now there’s very little difference between Legendary and GM in all the content it’s available in due to power caps. Legendary content is now a struggle without an absolutely broken build, otherwise you’re left hiding in the back of the room with a long range weapon (that isn’t power fantasy). I enjoy raids (which still aren’t power capped). I enjoy being able to LFG and carry [u][b]actual[/b][/u] bad players because I’m decent at the game. It’s a large part why I play Destiny - especially it’s raid content, over games like FFXIV or WoW. I can wipe for 4-6 hours with noobs in “chill” groups and still be having a blast just mowing down aliens and making hero moves recovering failed mechanics. With the new changes to difficulty that is t really possible anymore. None of my builds are viable beyond the absolute most broken setups (which will probably be nerfed). Build crafting has gone down the drain, now requiring the absolute meta to complete content and killing variety where power level used to carry us. Upgrading power feels pointless as it doesn’t actually make you more powerful - it just makes you [i]less weak[/i]. There’s nothing fun about having to run broken builds with little variety or hiding in the back with a long range weapon. There’s nothing fun about exploiting bugged exotics and interactions that will later be nerfed or fixed. “Hero moments” and power fantasy are largely dead along with playing how you want to play. Meta builds should raise the celing - not lower the floor. You should be rewarded for running them - not punished for not. There’s nothing fun about the majority of gear being utterly useless because it can’t hold up in level capped content. There’s nothing fun about power level being meaningless when the entire point of levels is to become more powerful
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Edited by Pocahawtness: 3/20/2023 11:53:53 AMI agree with you. Despite playing a lot of hours, I am a very casual player. I really enjoy a challenge at times, but most of the time I am playing to relax. Just wandering about, exploring and collecting things. I get that we needed more difficult activities, but I don't think it was the best option to just make everything more difficult, because it will drive away the more casual players. I agree that now Bungie cater too much to the "elite players" as you call them. They've always done this, though, especially by placing special gear behind single activities - those activities are the only way you can get that gear. I don't have a team to access many of the activities so certain gear is simply unobtainable for me. That seems to have gotten worse in this release in that more activities are multiplayer - and yet NOT included on matchmaking. So to me, what Bungie should do is decrease the difficulty back to the way it was, but expand Master and Grand Master to cover more activities. To add Matchmaking for more activities. To make gear more obtainable in the rest of the game - not just in single activities. If you take a look at the Steam figures for the game, there has never been such a sharp decline in players so quickly after a release of a major update. [url]https://steamcharts.com/app/1085660#All[/url] True, it's early days yet, but it doesn't look promising.
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The game is seriously UnFun now! I've given up already. £80 for nothing but grief, being killed so easily is no longer fun. I only hop on when my Pal wants a bit of company. I no longer log on for any solo plundering. I've got ESO and HALO to keep me occupied.....they're Fun!
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I agree, the game is too hard in areas that matter
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I'm usually not one to complain myself but after doing 5 legendary lost sectors, one in which I only died once, the only way I was able to farm it effectively and efficiently was with a raid dps build meant to dish out the most damage in a short amount of time, ie: Starfire Protocol, Witherhoard, and an Auto loading RL. I should not be having to use raid tier builds to do lego lost sectors, that is too far of a swing away from fun and challenging. It's just punishing at this point.
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spot on . I played from day one for 6 yrs, quit because of the cash grabs they do. Having to pay full price for every activity and hitting paywalls for a lot of content. Bungie is a corporation and greedy as hell, the only way they change if we hurt their wallet. I am starting now. Back to the Witcher. A game I love and can play endlessly because I do find avenues where I can make my character better to hit the content and its fund to find new loot. Its always new, not just at end game activities. Stick a fork in me I am done
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Edited by GRAVEL: 3/20/2023 10:57:09 AMFeel ya. Been playing from the start. Pretty critical of Bungie from the start tbh. They are an egotistical over- whelming dungeon master that skew all encounters their way. There can be only one outcome and it will frustrate the hell out of you. You will slam your hands on the table. You will get up to walk away. You will quit, and you will come back and finish the game with your friends. Bungie takes the cake and eats it too! That's the problem right now. Destiny is a great game especially now with the enemy density, however, it is severely over-tuned in all regards. This weekend my boys and I tackled the Vexcalibur mission. It was engrossing. It was not fun. Solo. At current, Bungie has stacked the deck so well against us that celebrated things like exotic missions are a drag. It's not hard. It's not difficult content. It is just great and dreck at the same time. Raising the difficulty across the board would have been enough... No, but Bungie up'd; enemy density, damage, health pools, alt fires, shields, shielding capabilies... While nerfing our guardians and weapons as well . The formula is 'off'. It's easy to recognize. Bungie having cake and eating it too. Means you better play one of a few ways or the experience will be punishing. Also, On warlock- I couldn't do Vexcalibur with strand. Needle storm does pathetic damage. It's wide array often is blocked via environment. Cutting down the dmg further. I had to switch to void...which has always been my resting place with warlock. The 3.0 subclasses didn't bring anywhere enough synergies. I still dislike arc and solar reworks and think they are very flawed and play worse than their previous incarnations... That's a pretty big problem now that all the knobs are turned up to ten! Bungie, you are so close to having the greatest shooter of all time. You just keep repeatedly standing in your own way.
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Could not agree more, thanks for taking the time to write the post.
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35 RepliesCorrect me if I'm wrong because I've really only played Destiny for the last 9 years, but it seems as if Bungie are the only gaming company that makes big changes just to pander to the requests of streamers and the top tier elite players. The majority of streamers provide humorous and/or interesting information about Destiny, but some of the creators with huge viewing bases seem to persuade Bungie to make changes to satisfy their own selfish needs. The outstanding example was with crucible, when Bungie tried to balance out matchmaking in trials, and the flawless farming brigade started throwing their toys out of the pram because " it was too sweaty to play teams of their own skill level". Something average players have to suffer week in, week out. Freelance was a great addition, but the elite complained because they said average players shouldn't be allowed to earn trials gear, so it was only put in now and again, and this year, taken out completely. And so to Lightfall, which has seen ridiculous changes to make things harder....not more challenging, just more frustrating. Again, because a minority of hard core players said content was too easy. If there are fundamental problems in a game, yes, they have to be addressed, but a game that has been created should be played as it is. If it's too hard for some, or too easy for others, why are you playing it? Same with PvP. There should be different game modes and tiers for different skill levels with rewards to match, but no one should be excluded from taking part or earning loot. So, streamers can be a source of entertainment and information, but sadly, because of some of their content such as game-breaking cheeses and glitches, selfish attitudes, and their influence over the people who actually [i]make [/i]the game, the majority of the player base has to suffer the consequences
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1 ReplyThe streamers think that mods and stats and builds are what the game is about. Actually playing is secondary and its only purpose is for them to show off. They hate it if average players can complete the same activities that they can. Bungle has bought into their view of the game and we suffer the result.
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Edited by stevexblade: 3/20/2023 7:25:51 PMI play Destiny since around 2015. I remember in the beginning to play the game all year round.. Then, as expansions started to come, it started to become more of an "on and off" thing for me and I noticed that as time passed and even more updates came up, the time I spent playing Destiny was less and less. I recently returned, haven't played since Shadowkeep because I thought "heck, let's give it another try". Destiny is a great game and has something I didn't find in any other games: a good mix of FPS with MMORPG. Unfortunately, the later seems to have been fading away more and more. Not just that, but the amount of grinding required is ridiculously insane. If you're a casual gamer like me, you better forget achieving anything meaningful unless you're willing to play countless hours a day, research stuff, keep track of progress on the different questions/achievements/whatever, etc. I thought the Raids were already pretty crazy - I did manage to do a couple over the years and it always turned out to be at least a 3 hour endeavour. (most of the times well more than 4 hours). All those complicated mechanics I personally found, in the beginning, pretty commendable and "hats off" ish but after a few attempts and runs, it quickly became more of a pain in the butt rather than anything impressive. So my point here is: - The game is amazing but its grinding and often unnecessary complexity became major hurdles to achieve any excitement or engagement with the game.
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9 RepliesDude, I’m an experienced player and I hate the update. Sure there are plenty of builds that can get folks thru the hard content, but how many casual and new players understand build crafting? Not to mention any build that is effective gets nerfed as soon as there’s a YouTube vid on it. I wish Bungie could find a balance between fun and challenge without needing to sacrifice accessibility. Because they just made a lot of content inaccessible to a large portion of the player base.
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1 ReplyAgree with you, aspects of the game are just too hard and is no longer fun, I want to play casually but the game doesn’t really allow that. Sure I can still patrol the Edz and cosmodrome but I have already done that thousands of times.
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Level up your character. Get up into the 1700s and up and it will start to feel less overwhelming.
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I just want people to grab a dictionary and read what the words casual and hardcore actually mean.
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Game was peak during forsaken, now just the same boring seasonal crap with no new crucible maps or strikes regrinding the same guns we did 2-4 years ago. Diablo 4 can’t come soon enough, tired of these lazy greedy devs.. activision carried hard
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After a quick peek at your characters, here's a few quick things you can do to greatly improve your gameplay experience (if you're interested). -Your resilience scores all look pretty high, but that's often not enough. In any activity with an active threat modifier, make sure you swap your chest armor mods to have at least 1-2 resistances of the threat damage type. I often go with 2 matching threat, 1 of different type that I'm expecting enemies to hit me with. -All your characters are using double primaries at the time of this reply. Primaries are, quite frankly, bad. Swaping one out for a special weapon like a sniper or fusion rifle will greatly increase your damage output, and allow you to delete majors without relying on heavy ammo. Dead enemies can't deal damage, which also means you survive more. -Void weapons in conjunction with bricks from beyond and volatile flow (artifact mods) are universally extremely powerful this season. Kills with void weapons generate heavy ammo and volatile enemies, leading to more heavy ammo drops and more dead enemies. This combo is extra powerful using a void machine gun in your heavy slot. Don't be afraid to use one for clearing weak enemies, you'll get your ammo back. This combo is useable on any subclass. -If bricks from beyond doesn't generate enough heavy for you, the add heavy ammo finder to your helm. If playing in a Fireteam, add on heavy ammo scout to give the rest of your Fireteam more heavy, and ask them to do the same. More heavy for everyoje leads to.... Yes, more dead enemies.
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Which part of this criticism was constructive? -game is hard now -i dont wanna make a build -i regret spending money Sure is a lot for bungie to "absorb"...
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There is a balance between making a game unplayable and making it too easy such that it gets boring and monotonous... I don't think anyone would truly appreciate a game where you just run right in and cleanup a map. I don't see a problem with the difficulty here. ...and I'm not a die hard gamer. I just enjoy the challenge of working to complete a game. Suffice it to say I've been playing video games since before Elite Dangerous was released on the Commodore 64. Yes, I'm likely much older than most everyone's dad here and I've got the "old man" reflexes to prove it! But I still managed to solo yesterdays lost sector on Legend. It took a couple of hours (I'm guessing) and a lot of cautious work and strategy. Anyway, I think folks spend their money on a game like this because it stays playable for a while (between seasons and expansions). If you could zip right through everything then folks would easily lose interest between each and every release... Yes, there is always some stuff I can't finish solo and I know enough to put that aside until I get to the point if/when I decide to go LFG to finish things up. If you are running right out into the middle of things and getting blown away then you might want to stand back and think up a better strategy. This is not so much about honing your pew, pew skills as much as it is a strategic exercise. I.E. If you are tired of getting one-shot by interceptors then your situational awareness might be worth some attention...
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3 RepliesEdited by ErondilVae: 3/20/2023 3:03:36 AMI’ve been playing Destiny since 2016. I’m not an elite player, but I’m better than average. My equipment is decent with almost all of it master worked. Destiny has been a lot of fun over the years, and I still enjoy it. It’s definitely more difficult now, but in my experience it seems to get easier when your light level increases. It now requires players to be a little more strategic and situationally aware, but I’m finding that I do end up enjoying it this way. However, I don’t really like doing the missions on legendary. It’s very time consuming and irritating the first time through it. Having said all that, I just want to encourage you to stick with it and do what you like in the game. Running vanguard activities is a pretty easy way to get equipment you can use to raise your levels. If you get frustrated just turn it off and do something else for a bit. You will get better and have an easier time eventually. If I can do it, anyone can. Happy gaming to you! P.S. Watch Esoterickk on YouTube. An amazing player who you will learn a ton from
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Respectfully, not every game is made for every human. Not every human will be able to be "good" at every activity they wish to be. Not every video game is focused more on being a casual/easy experience. You've not had much experience in this franchise, but the excessively casual / challenge-lacking game that bungie has been producing between Shadowkeep - The Witch Queen is outside of the "norm" for this developer on this franchise. Bungie made a direct & public decision back then to purposely make the game more casual & open to wider skill gaps in order to broaden their player base numbers. But, what they have found is the player they've been attracting either don't stick around or don't really engage in the game. Additionally, their passionate player base was growing fatigued by the lack of challenges the game offered & the boring game play was developing apathy for the franchise. Bungie has reviewed the feedback from their player base, play tested, reflected on how the game felt & compared to the game's reputations + studio goals for the franchise. It doesn't mean that the current difficulty level will remain, but it's clear that the old super casual Destiny isn't what they want for &/or view the majority of the community wants for Destiny. The fans that have been with this franchise since 2014 have been waiting 2-3 years for Bungie to slowly retract all of the super casual focus. I understand your feelings - but imagine how the other side is feelings. They've played the game for 6 years to have Bungie nerf the entire experience down to a super casual "Wii bowling" type of game. They've endured a super watered down version of Destiny for 3 years & finally got the game back to feeling good again. With all that said, if you REALLY enjoy this game & want to develop your skills - this game isn't too difficult. As a matter of fact, it's really not too much more difficult than it was in S19. You just need to take the time to invest into the game's systems, FPS/Bungie games basics, & develop your skill. Ever hobby is more fun & more fulfilling when you work towards & achieve goals. Will you step up & meet the challenge with the courage to keep failing & re-trying to develop your skill in the hobby you car about so much? Or will you cower in the face of change/challenge either due to insecurities or lack of interest?
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1 Replyplay the new raid, it is literally the easiest content by now..... even the enemies in open world are harder...
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7 RepliesEdited by jhermannITJ: 3/20/2023 12:22:47 AMWhat in D2 mattered before this? This is my respectful rebutal.... Did the weapons you used matter? *Exception being... GMs, Champs & Day 1.... No. Now, I would argue they matter more. Not just a function of vanity and personal preference. Like weapon systems in any well designed video game. Did your mods matter? No. Now, they do. Your subclass, what artifact mods you used... did any of it really matter outside of the exceptions* I referenced? No. Was Destiny 2 basically power crept into The Sims, a fashion & lifestyle game? Yeah. So, Bungie designed all these advanced systems and mechanics that only benefited less than 1% of players... a huge waste of money and resources. Bungie wants a real game with systems and mechanics that apply to everyone. Now for everyone, mods matter... loadouts and subclasses matter. The game need not be any more difficult, just learn and use the systems. You don't need to be a crazy min-maxer either, just put some basic thought into your build for whatever you're doing. Finally, I left this for the end. Prior to Lightfall power level really didn't matter but for that top 1%. I really think 🤔 alot of these posts are from those that aren't properly leveled yet. Power makes a much more noticeable difference now. I'm really not playing any differently than I was before Lightfalll now that I'm leveled up. Soft cap and the closer you get to hard cap, makes a difference, artifact power makes a difference... pinnacle power makes a difference. People believe these difficulty changes are catering to the voices of the 1%... it's the opposite. They want everyone to experience the game in its totality. These changes are about 99% of players; and about creating a sandbox, systems, and mechanics that engage all players, at all skill levels.
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1 ReplyEdited by Kureosity: 3/19/2023 9:44:13 PMWell said. I'm 67 and have been playing since Forsaken at the urging of my son. We then convinced my wife (kicking and screaming - now 66) to play so we could play as a fireteam. Destiny was our way of connecting and having some casual fun along the way - this, sometimes, included tackling some challenging content (challenging for us - I realize there are players that find dungeons, legend lost sectors, legend and higher Nightfalls, recent battleground playlists, etc. easy - that is not the case for us but the challenge was within our reach). We had fun, and if it wasn't fun, we didn't play the content. Sadly, with Lightfall, unless we're running bounties, there's not much that we find fun any longer. We'll stick around this year because we purchased deluxe but unless something changes, I expect that post-Lightfall we'll be watching campaign videos on YouTube for the story instead of playing Destiny and will have moved on to something else. There are things to like about Lightfall, but the cons far outweigh the pros for us...
