in his final message Rasputin talks of the veil "an object of immense paracausal power" so what could this be? well I think the veil is a long dead traveler. because the witness has many pyramids and so it would make sense that this is a dead one, but still with a bit of power.
now this part is VERY speculative.
theory one. think that the veil is leaking strand as it fully dies.
theory two, instead of the veil leaking strand, the veil is turning into strand
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3 RepliesBefore my theory, quick note, we know about the Witness than our own Traveler. That’s what happen when we focus on the Darkness and forget the Light people! My turn for a theory, I worked hard on this, The Veil is a object directly linked to the Gardener (final Cutscene after Witch Queen, the Witness says “You Pale Heart holds the key.”), that could generate a portal for the Winnower to enter the physical realm. There’s lots of reasons for this, but I think the biggest one is The Final Shape. It’s implied that it’s going to connected to the beings mentioned in the Unveiling lore books, the Gardener and the Winnower. You can’t have a true final shape without at least on these powerful beings somehow relating to the main story. Look, I think the Gardener is already in the physical realm, and I know there’s theories about the Gardener being inside the Traveler, I’m not really sure about that, but the very first cutscene, the original, sketched out one, shows a person telling people on Mars about how the Travelers coming. I think either this is some form of a speaker for another race of aliens, or… this is the Gardener. It’s goal is to pretty much preserve (read Mistborn by Brandon Sanderson, you’ll get it!) life right? I think the Traveler is either a direct servant of the Gardener, or an imperfect form of it in the physical realm. That’s why the Gardener connected, but what about the Winnower. The Witness’s goal is the Final Shape, just like Crota’s and Oryx’s (kinda, don’t quote me on that), where the Sword Logic rules all, only the Strong live and rule, blah blah blah, etc. Anyway, according to Bungie, the Darkness and the Light are neutral forces (Winnower and Gardener), and if you have read unveiling this makes more sense, but you can’t have really have the Light without the Dark, yet both beings want different things where the opposite doesn’t exist. This doesn’t directly tie in yet, but it is interesting. Anyway, Crota and Oryx, they want the Final Shape, and it’s implied that the Witness does too, so… is the Witness a servant of the Winnower? If the answer yes, which I think it is, then that means that Gardener has to be related to the Traveler because why else would the Witness be so intent on killing the Traveler? It all kind of connects. Last point, why is the Veil a portal? Let’s go back to the start, if the Traveler’s Pale Heart, or the Veil (since by this theory, the Traveler is a servant of the Gardener, the heart is directly connected to the Gardener), is an object that the Witness wants, and what else could be a surefire to kill the Traveler, but his own Dark Master. At the end of the Lightfall gameplay trailer, you see the Witness near a portal looking thing, so, does that mean, that the Witness finds this Veil at some point, either before or after us, that he uses it to pull the Winnower into the Physical Universe, and he goes after the Traveler. This also makes sense because it could start setting up for Final Shape, hypothetically, we push the Winnower away someone, but he finds a way back in, and, *magic* end of Darkness and Light saga. Thanks for listening to a madman.
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I always thought the collapse was the veil engulfing us and it’s just the dark opposite of the light energy.
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[quote]in his final message Rasputin talks of the veil "an object of immense paracausal power" so what could this be? well I think the veil is a long dead traveler. because the witness has many pyramids and so it would make sense that this is a dead one, but still with a bit of power. now this part is VERY speculative. theory one. think that the veil is leaking strand as it fully dies. theory two, instead of the veil leaking strand, the veil is turning into strand[/quote] [spoiler]A leak mentions the veil appearing in Lightfall and being a key to something. Don’t remember what, just that the witness wants it. Also seen talk about the witness being imprisoned in another dimension or something, so maybe a key to that. Would explain why the witness is talking to the disciples through reflections and what not. [/spoiler]
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Only one Traveler, it carries the Gardner inside.
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2 RepliesI wonder if the Veil was some sort of outer shell that the Traveler shed. Kind of like molting. Sounds weird, I know.
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Edited by Natdeguerre: 2/16/2023 1:58:01 AMIt might be something Savathun used to deceive the witness. She wanted to safe the traveler during the collapse, presumably to get away from the darkness pact the krill had made. She knew about Neomuna (see Osiris’ visions) and she may have also deleted Rasputins files regarding Neomuna, when she was disguised as Osiris, in order to keep the Veil safely hidden. A Veil seems like a good description of something to deceive. Kinda like pulling the wool over someone’s eyes. Obscuring truth or reality. Not to mention that it also appears to cloak Neomuna itself from sensors.
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[ (we followed [the Path) crumbled beneath (our feet] became [one mind) can absorb (the truth] is that Osiris understands [nothing) can describe the joy of shared (thought] you knew what they were didn't [you) haven't lived as they (do] you wish to find [your future) is (predetermined] individuals will never find [answers) lie in forbidden (places] bound by [shared dreams) will reveal (your nature] is to [destroy)your sense of (self]-preservation coddles leaders into ritual [complacence) is something (i have forgotten] loneliness uncertainty life [alone) i see with my six (eyes] watching from beyond [the heliopause) is a curtain before the next and final (act] decisively to meld with [yourselves) will know (you] together alone striving toward your final [purpose) built to move as they (move] to stand apart from your [heroes) are commonplace these (days] of change draw ever [closer) looks at what is forbidden can only (help] them help [you) are so afraid of the (taboos] must be [overthrown) rulers would agree i'm (sure]ly you are convinced by [now) go and find yourselves] ] [url=https://www.ishtar-collective.net/cards/ghost-fragment-vex-5]give you an idea of what it is, or oxa is, or what your chasing after as a whole[/url]
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3 RepliesThe veil is where the pyramids and the traveler get their power... it created the exo, it powers the vex network too I think. It's where both the darkness and the light come from.
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I see the Veil as something completely different. Before Rasputin directly called it an object I think we always had a thought it would be a people or race. Now that we got that info and we know that The Witness is seeking it so hard that it is scouring through time, I believe it might be a key of some sort. Maybe a way to enter the Traveler. The Vow prophecy wall does indicate the Witness is seeking to drink the Light. I'm only assuming that this artifact is required to do so, otherwise why is it even holding back? Clearly something is keeping the Witness from being able to go all out. The Pyramid murals also show us a repeating symbol where it holds a certain key or object. Maybe that is the Veil?
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1 ReplySince, up until this point, the veil have/has been associated with the darkness, I speculate that they are perhaps the original race - possibly the creators of the witness and the traveler.
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inside the pyramid ships are female veiled statues. i once thought long ago that the staues were isis, since we have osiris. im not going into much detail about that here though, just look up egyptian mythology about how osiris was killed by sept and his body parts were spread all over the place. isis retrieved osiris's body parts and performed some magics and brought him back to life. she then had a child with him who they named horus. it's an interesting read, especially if you like calendars and time clocks... eg: SEPTember is when sun falls, summer ends, winter pains arrive. HOURS~horus describe the position of the sun on any given day, etc. the veil though. as the name suggests, a veil is hiding something. could be something in plain sight, like with the veiled statues, or not. the veil rasputin refers to, my guess is that once removed, the gardener will be revealed. my money is that the gardener will be female, maybe isis, but hopefully not. there are infinitely many female heroines bungie can use since they have blended mythologies and legends wonderfully so far. im hoping the veiled statue will be named helen (helen of troy) or mother nature personified as 'the queen of hearts' who runs around wildly shouting "off with their heads! off with their heads!!!" upon first reveal. as our guardians continue to tumble down the rabbit hole in the year of the rabbit 🐇, i would be immensely pleased to be able to interact with the QoH and the chaos world she rules. note: cayde-6's ship is called 'the queen of hearts" so it's very much a possibility. as for the QoH reference to mother nature... i got that from 'alice in wonderland' 😉