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Edited by DataButcher:
11/3/2022 8:35:14 PM
72
Warlock 3.0 Rework.
Warlock main for 7 years.
Minus the mandatory Well of Radiance for most raid encounters (which probably needs a nerf for more build/encounter diversity), Warlock 3.0 subclasses have been gutted and lost a lot of their original identity (Devour, Benevolent Dawn, Guiding Flame, Healing Grenades, Arc Web, Storm Grenades, Ionic Traces, etc)
Child of the Old Gods and Lightning Surge are great but are the only additions with 3.0 that are new and unique.
A lot of what made the Warlock class unique was used to build the core 3.0 systems.
In comparison to other classes, there is very little that is still specialist at present.
High end PvP viability also appears to be statistically low.
There could be improvements made for greater diversity into class identity, outside of primarily sentient torrents (regardless of how cool they are, literally in Bleak Watchers case) and Well-locks.
Ideas for greater specialisation and class identity include:
Solar - Aerial Phoenix - Warlocks having a way to get radiant outside of melee, with all classes now able to fill the role of Guiding Flame, perhaps eating a grenade for Heat Rises also activates radiant. As well as, Touch of Flame Healing Grenades strongly seek targets, making Warlocks more specialist healers.
Arc - Becoming the Storm - With all classes now having access to Ionic Traces, Electrostatic Mind could also overcharge grenades and super damage or improve functionality similar to amplified base melees. This would be situational with a short window in PvP, but allow for more potency in PvE.
Void - Vampire - Devour cannot have its old functionality of eating a grenade anymore, as the activation would contradict the activation of the Chaos Accelerant aspect. However, Feed the Void is a downgrade to its previous activation. Secant Filaments help this but require an exotic slot and using Empowering Rift. Perhaps Secant Filaments could have a slow tracking Rift when the player moves that works within a 15 metre proximity from activation point, with Devour also activating on Healing Rift.
English
#destiny2
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I strongly agree with your Stormcaller idea, as Bungie sort of missed the opportunity to compensate for no grenade-enhancing ability by letting us Amplify our grenades. It would also further drive the point that Warlocks are the Amplify class and give us that "lightning shaman" identity that Bungo mentioned in their Arc 3.0 post. I sort of disagree with your Dawnblade suggestion, though, as Hunters seem to be the radiant specialists, leaning more heavily into their gunplay, but it'd also be nice to see Warlocks have a bit more access to their support tools. Honestly, I think the Heat Rises buff needs a lot of love to reinforce that aerial playstyle. That's my input. Solid post, OP.
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I like some of your suggestions. This reads better after your edit and not like one of Snow's warlock doomsday post.
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Edited by jyoung314: 11/3/2022 1:01:24 AMIt's been known for years that Warlocks are not allowed to have good subclasses in pvp. Or exotic for that matter. Literally every warlock subclass that was remotely good in pvp, Bungie absolutely decimated due to other class mains crying that it was overpowered. Warlocks couldn't even have a simple air dash without it being gutted, because somehow it was considered op by other classes because it allowed you to move, ever so slightly, faster in a straight line than other classes. Yet, hunters had some of the most overpowered, braindead abilities in the game, like hunter dodge, and all the ridiculous amount of perks that come with it, or shatterdive. Any complaints about those abilities came with insults, "crylock" and red herrings like comparing icarus dash to hunter dodge, which was so much more overpowered in comparison, it wasn't even funny. I digress though. Essentially, playing warlock in pvp is an inherent disadvantage and it's been known for a while now. There's no reason in complaining anymore, Bungie nor the community wants to hear it. Simply play Titan or Hunter if you want to be on a level playing field in the crucible or use Warlocks if you enjoy the challenge and satisfaction of winning while at a disadvantage. Warlocks are great in pve though, so there's that. Edit: Hilariously enough, right after I wrote this post, I see a post stating that their are players advocating for an Ophedian Aspect nerf. If that doesn't drive the point of this post home, I don't know what will. It's funny and sad at the same time.
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30 RepliesI'm convinced Warlock mains simply don't know how to utilize the kit and that's why there are so few of them. Ironically, most of them are illiterate. Unless a YouTuber tells them how to make a build, they won't investigate it for themselves. So everyone else must be OP. Lol. Geomags were always amazing before the nerf. 3-4 chaos reach a game, but they didn't know it till they knew it. Had it for months. They have also held the "best" pvp spot many times before in this game of rock paper scissors. But complained "I have to use top tree dawn". "I have to use Geo Mag". "But that's only nova warp." Years where they could run empowering with a high impact sniper and body shot people. The more I read posts like this, the more it becomes clear, y'all just don't know how to play on your warlocks. Stasis warlock used correctly is still absurdly powerful, compared to the others. Even well after its nerf. Giving up your healing nade doesn't mean your "whole identity is lost". Dramatic.
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Absolutely correct. Seeing hunters demolish everything with combination blow and invisibility AND wall hacks while warlocks have... rift and that gets nerfed too.
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Bungie just kinda hates on warlocks. That’s not gonna change for a while if at all. I used to be a warlock main until they started to slowly get poured down the drain.
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4 RepliesWell of radiance is the best super in the game devour is still very much a thing an arc warlock is getting buffed check this weeks twab an dry your eyes
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Solar Warlocks, for PvE at least, need to fully lean into Scorch. The melee alone can be a pocket nuke, couple with Sunbracers grenade spam and Incandescent weapons to keep the Scorch spreading and your melee back quicker....
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A simple couple changes they could make for solar 3.0 are the following Make firebolts under touch of flame cure on impact or create a curing turret. OR make healing grenades turn into healing turrets with the same properties as the grenade Remove the -10 discipline from ember of benevolence, remove the refresh cooldown when players are inside a well or rift. I would rather not have people play ring around the rosie so I can get my rift back. Add radiance or cure to either of the melees so they actually feel like solar 3.0 rather than solar 2.0 (also remove the lunge attack problem that auto melee w/ incinerator snap, I would rather a thrall or shank be blown up at a distance and not have to rebind keys to accomplish that goal)
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preach brother
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18 RepliesWarlock main here ....we don't need a buff, in my humble opinion. Warlocks have been strong from the go. I gravitate to PvP but play PvE when I have to. Add clear....stormtrance with crown, nothing better. DPS....chaos, nova, check. Support, well of radiance. Right now I'm running void in PVP. I'm a 54 year old woman and run between a 2.1 and 2.2 kda. I run aeons in Crucible. Remember when warlocks we're all the rage in PvP a season or two back? Warlocks didn't get as much of a rework because we didn't need it. We have always been strong. Would I like some of the fun toys the other classes have, sure. I play with what I have the smartest way I know how, and to my play style. Note, I have all 3 of my characters at max level but rarely run either of the other two.. We have great exotics at our disposal. Aeon, Crown, Phoenix. Just to name a few. My best advise, learn to play with what you have. Warlock main for life.
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4 RepliesNew TWAB address some of this for next season. Vortex Nova Bomb is finally getting a buff so it might be viable again. Arc Soul is getting a buff and ball lightning and chain lightning is as well. We ll see what it does. Sadly Chaos Reach got addressed but nothing about its damage. CD got lowererd and thats it.
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If you are talking about PVP, you might have a point. If you are talking about PVE, you are completely wrong. Warlocks have benefitted massively from the subclass updates and are not only viable, but in some cases best in class (yes, I did go there...) 1. Well of Radiance: Has always been a staple and will continue to be a staple (as you have noted), but above that, you can now use Well of Radiance in addition to other Aspects such as Icarus Dash and Heat Rising to make your Solar Warlock builds incredibly more versatile. Not to mention Solar Warlock grenades slap. 2. Devour: Anyone that thinks Void 3.0 nerfed Devour in PVE has little to no understanding on how builds work. Devour got a massive buff that allows you to increase your timer to 15 seconds that can be proc'ed on any Void ability kill, not just grenade. Not only that, but you can also run Chaos Accelerant with Devour for some incredible grenade builds. Slap on Contraverse Hold and literally spam Vortex Grenades for free real estate. 3. Stasis Bleakwatcher: It is worth noting that even Stasis Warlocks got the best build for Stasis for endgame content. Bleakwatchers (even after their nerf) are incredibly potent to the point where they can trivialize Champions in GM Nightfalls. Significantly more potent than any other Stasis build. The only sub-class that feels mediocre when compared to other classes is Arc.
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7 RepliesOh no child and lightning surge are the only new things. Meanwhile hunter got a new super that they didnt get with forsaken while warlock and titan did get one and a new solar melee. Also 2 things same as warlock.
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You want them to buff the class that has been at the top for the last 5 years? Get real. Warlock is insane right now. If you don't agree, you don't know how to play Warlock
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Talk about an overreaction
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3 RepliesHonestly it feels like the whole “class identity” thing is just another excuse to show off their hunter favoritism. More evidence shown in the early builds of lightfall, they were going to make hunters the only class with the grapple, only to be given to all classes because the hunter favoritism can’t be too too obvious. Hunters have the highest dps supers in the game. They have the most “meta” exotics in the game. Statistically having the most players playing the class. 24.8% of hunters that played trials last weekend were running void, meanwhile 22% of the total trials population was warlocks, meaning there were 2.8% more void hunters than their were warlocks running any subclass. And instead of attempting to properly balance the classes they just keep pumping hunters full of useful exotics and kits and zero-no nerfs while warlocks got stripped for parts in every subclass but stasis.
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Bungie picked Warlocks clean and gave their skills out like gifts.
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2 RepliesEdited by Scratch: 11/3/2022 9:52:01 PMGreat! Quit posting about it too?
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Yup only log on for bd store then log off, -blam!- these clueless devs.
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2 RepliesI'm NoT sPeCiAl! I QuIt. [spoiler]Adios[/spoiler] [spoiler]Arrivederci[/spoiler] [spoiler]Au Revoir[/spoiler] [spoiler]Auf Wiedersehen[/spoiler] [spoiler]Sayōnara[/spoiler] [spoiler]C'ya[/spoiler]
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1 ReplyYou do know it is one of three playable characters in a computer game? Getting jealous over other two characters that you can equally play is ridiculous. By the way you do know you're not a Warlock, it's not real.
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1 ReplyEdited by nonchalantone: 11/3/2022 2:39:02 AMMy Warlock quit all together....he's now a barista at Starbucks......... He sent me his Ghost just the other day through Fed-ex! Along with a $10.00 coupon! That summmaabeech..........
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[quote]In comparison to other classes, there is very little that is viable or special at present. [/quote] ???
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I don't even play warlock I know they need a buff.
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Warlocks we’re def most lack luster for arc 3.0. They have a good kit for subclasses but not broken crap like the others. Solar 3.0 is still great for pvp not counting dawnblade.
