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Edited by Noodle The Nerdle:
11/16/2019 8:45:08 AM
52
The Recluse Nerf: Lets talk about it, will it be viable and the best Primary still?
So Recluse was just... the best Primary weapon in the game for PvE. It did everything a primary should do and more... to the point it over shadowed everything else.
It broke shields, had bonus damage, was super forgiving, really didn't need to be accurate... was an energy weapon so it could be used with any of the best kinetic secondaries in the game as well as any heavy exotic.
[b]The Legend Himself[/b] broke down why Recluse is just all around good, and the best weapon. Should check it out over here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nnr9-n3CdhI
Master of Arms outshined every damage perk in the game, giving 21% to crits, and 98% to body shots... making it deal in total the crit value to the body with Master of Arms active. You didn't need to get a kill with the weapon to activate the perk, and the perk had such easy to use up time thanks to procing off itself and Feeding Frenzy.
Other weapons could 'compete' but not as well.. to the point Recluse was damn near the only choice- kinda like how Fatebringer used to be.
Anyways, now lets look at the nerf. It was broken down by Ehroar (which his video you can see here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ptgy9QyK_Ko ) that it will still be doing 21% to a crit with Master of Arms active, but that body shot value will also be at 21% as well. So you'll have to aim at the head.
Will this destroy the gun? Will other SMG's or primary weapons get a chance to shine as well as Recluse?
I don't know. It's probably... gonna be struggling to survive now. Though with it being so easy to activate... the damage won't be the same.
However, there are alternatives if you want a new SMG.
Subjective from Vex Offensive can roll Multi Kill Clip/Swashbuckler + Outlaw.
Every Waking Moment from Eris can roll Outlaw/Subsistence + Swashbuckler/Kill Clip.
If you're looking for an SMG in the energy slot to replace recluse... these may be the best... and only options. Unless you're willing to go look for something else. I mean Bug Out Bag from Gambit Prime can roll Multi Kill Clip and Subsistence.
But if you don't wanna do that... you could always go farm the Curated Kindled Orchid for Kill Clip Rampage.
Anyways, what do you think. Is this nerf to Recluse fair, will it still be good... or has this gun been given the same treatment that Breakneck and Redrix got and become useless trash?
EDIT: Side note: Certain Auto Rifles can also shine now. Arc Logic with Rampage and Outlaw, Reckless Oracle... these are all just in the energy slot though. If you're looking for something to replace Recluse in that slot.
English
#destiny2
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1 ReplyFatebringer roll Hand Cannons will probably be the best for clearing out a lot of enemies. Two~Three Headshots, and proc'ing Dragonfly (especially with Dragonfly Spec) should insta-kill the same type of enemies in one explosion. Only problem is that Dragonfly is glitchy and either proc's with a delay or doesn't proc at all, despite landing a precision final blow. Maybe Oxygen SR3 might become viable, after Scout Rifles receive another much needed PvE buff. Seriously, Bungie, 180 RPM Scout Rifles shoot BB's that are bubble wrapped.
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11 RepliesGonna be just a normal submachine gun. Snowflakes got their way again...
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7 RepliesOther weapons were ALREADY viable. If you didn’t want Recluse to outperform everything, then you didn’t have to use it. You can’t want a powerful weapon and complain about it too. The only problem with Recluse was the players using it.
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12 RepliesIt's still gonna be a good PvE option. The perk activation is unchanged and it's fairly easy to hit PvE enemies in the head unless you're shooting from outside of it's intended range. I'd say this change puts it on par with other well-rolled energy SMGs, which is where it should be IMO.
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3 RepliesEdited by Cosmic Owl: 11/17/2019 2:02:02 PMI think it will be absolutely fine. It’s got very good handling and stability with decent aim assist. In PvE getting critical hits is not hard and in PvP if you’re just spraying and praying and relying on body shots you’re doing it wrong. You should always be going for the head anyway. It’s still a very fast gun with good perks and it’s easy to handle. If you were playing skillfully I bet you’ll barely notice a difference.
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Smgs are only supposed to be good in certain situations, so the fact that Recluse became the top energy weapon just shows how badly Bungie designed it. The curated Kindled Orchid you talk about is a fun gun, but still overshadowed by Sunshot(some others too, but Sunshot is an energy hand cannon so is a more than fair comparison). I know Sunshot is an exotic, but it's as easy to get as any legendary so everyone has it. Main thing is historically when a gun becomes THE meta every week for a while it gets a nerf. Recluse has had it's run and I'll say it's pretty damned annoying to get melted by it in what is now perfect hand cannon range even though you get the first shot.
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SMGs in general are more powerful and better to go to in the energy slot than most weapons in most situations. As long as it’s just the body shot damage getting the nerf I think it will be fine. It will hurt the spray and pray value of the gun, but it will still be a legendary with a perk that procs easily, can be equipped with weapon mods like anti-barrier rounds unlike exotics, and it’s an SMG with void. I hate that they are destroying the value of all pinnacle and ritual weapons after we obtain them.
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1 ReplyI just unlocked it today. At least leave it a season as it is. :D
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8 RepliesLol at all the downvotes. Some people are just terrified to not get carried by that noob gun anymore! >x3 Time to learn to aim, folks!
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27 RepliesEdited by EnglishPete: 11/16/2019 5:20:08 PMWhy are things being nerfed in PvE? For people who spent the time getting Recluse, why ruin it in PvE? This 'nerf everything' culture is ruining this game. (and no, I don't own Recluse as I hate Crucible and no I don't care that I don't have it.)
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One less gun in game with no meaningful alternatives. I remember the days in forsaken when recluse was a must have for pve like throne and something else. There were other guns but nothing was useful. Normally, it's ok to take from one hand and give from other... bungie is just taking from both hands and showing the proverbial middle finger to us all.
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17 RepliesI think Ehroar cleared up, going by the TWAB it will very likely be worse than other everyday easy to get, non-pinnacle legendaries. Its also not going to be a fun gun to use at all anymore - in vast expanses of D2 PvE grinding we don't always want to be headshotting every damn target, especially not from a high recoil SMG. And like Breakneck, it will effectively be trashed from the game. Which along with useless pinnacles like Oxygen or pinnacles that had a massive grind and then were simply given away free to everyone like Wizened Rebuke, it really shatters the already thin trust in Bungie's handling of our large investment in time for rewards. One of the atrocious aspects about this is, given the tweaks to Comp, many players will have ONLY JUST GOT THIS. Think about that. So: give out shiny new toys and then just a few weeks later rip them out of their hands and burn them. You're potentially talking about huge numbers, big percentages of the Destiny2 community that will feel that experience and that's really not a clever business or customer satisfaction move. Particularly important on m+k but with controller too, it could absolutely use a downgrade, exclusively in PvP. But to trash pinnacles completely because of that, rather than be more discriminate, is sloppy and may have strong negative reprocussions.
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It's almost like all of this kind of backlash etc could be avoided by properly tuning weapons before they were released. Xenophage 100% proves this doesn't happen.
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12 RepliesEdited by Azur_Fenix: 11/16/2019 10:58:58 PMIts not gonna change a damn thing. Not until they nerf what actually makes it OP, its easy of use, it should NOT have perfect recoil direction of 100. It even has it when firing from the hip. THAT IS THE PROBLEM. No other SMG is that damn accurate at the ranges Recluses is and can down as fast as it can because it basically doesn't have recoil. FIX ITS EASE OF USE SO YOU HAVE TO WORK AT IT TO MAKE IT WORK JUST LIKE ARS AND OTHER SMGS. If that still isnt enough, cut its damage by 2 or 3. Nubs should not be able to -blam!-ing bunny hope all over and burn everyone down because the damn thing is a laser at all times.
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Best in slot? Not anymore. Viable? Eh, maybe. I already have other weapons lined up though so I'm not too upset.
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On PC, yes. There's no recoil and M&K makes aiming so easy a Bungie dev could do it.
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1 ReplyOK so you're post is in conflict with itself. You literally say why this gun is the best and why it's excessively used but then proceed to tell people how there's plenty of other weapons to use and that they should used them.
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Well for PC it is basically unaffected, so yes it will still be top tier. I do think Bungie should compensate the nerf with additional stability for console players though.
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Ffs, why is this getting nerfed? I earnt this gun.
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It wouldn’t surprise me if they end up increasing the body shot damage now. They were extremely vague about this weapon on purpose.
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2 RepliesIt's currently outperforming everything else, no discussing here. Strikes are completely unenjoyable with randoms, because Recluse users are just shredding through everything. I would prefer other weapons to be brought up, namely Rampage and co. being un-nerfed, but we know that's not how it goes. Recluse will still be very good. Just aim for the head and it's practically unchanged.
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4 RepliesMaster of arms will still be active 100% of the time so, yes it will be the best.
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3 RepliesPersonally, I feel like they should just delete Pinnacles from the game. It was a terrible idea from the start and the fact that we're now dealing with a situation where they're easily obtained and dominating endgame is a testament to how badly the delete button is needed. They should even delete Y1 legendaries and transfer those rolls into raid legendaries. Exotics, raid weapons, and possibly dungeon weapons should be the ONLY curated rolls in the game.
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7 RepliesWhat’s wrong with calus msg? Haven’t used it but it’s got similar perks to recluse
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3 Replies[quote]Anyways, now lets look at the nerf. It was broken down by Ehroar (which his video you can see here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ptgy9QyK_Ko ) that it will still be doing 21% to a crit with Master of Arms active, but that body shot value will also be at 21% as well. So you'll have to aim at the head. Will this destroy the gun? Will other SMG's or primary weapons get a chance to shine as well as Recluse? I don't know. It's probably... gonna be struggling to survive now. Though with it being so easy to activate... the damage won't be the same.[/quote] What?? I'm so confused by your opinion. Master of Arms will still be just as easy to activate, last longer than any other damage perk, and do the same damage to the head as before... How will it struggle to survive??
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2 RepliesWhen you play several crucible matches and most of the players in the matches are using just the recluse then you know that something needs to be done
