Nah, just be useless. You'll get it on your first attempt.

This is true. Seen many slapdicks on their first run get it over the past few months. I got carried my first run and I was useless, got it first run

always the way, i saw the most useless person in the history of gaming get the 1k on his first ever chest open while it took me over 30 chests, he was least deserving person in the universe i don't even know how he got onto my friends list.

You must be the kind of person that gets killed the most in the raid group then rage quits because your team is incompetent.

What are you talking about? It's RNG.

Don’t mind him, he’s being a shit

And he's been fighting to keep console and pc as differrnt as they are now. He and I got into a very heated argument over how console should handle compared to pc

In what ways? You’re never going to have the movement of pc... which no matter what anybody says, gives much more of an advantage than some recoil

He was arguing that if we wanted the recoil values of console brought in line with pc to just go buy D2 on pc and stay there. I argued that it just wasnt worth the money and/or time lost in the move. He argued that if we'd just purchased pc destiny we wouldnt have to go through all that. I argued that many players are loyal to their platform and forcing them to leave if they want mechanics that pc doesn't have is very unreasonable and the more reasonable thing to do would be to remove the mechanics console players have been asking for since TTK would be the better solution. He strawmanned that I'd never seen D2 PC and the so called " superior graphics. I called him out for strawmaning aand told him i have a gaming PC I just prefer console because thats where i got into gaming. Then he insulted my hardware saying no one with a brain would stay after playing pc , he ended by calling me a scrub. I retaliated by arguing that no one with a brain would fight to stop a balance change that wouldnt even touch their platform and returned the favor. Ya know, the usual nonsense that goes on here on the forums.

So your main argument is recoil values? Forget all that other nonsense and insults. This brings up only one problem as far as I can see... and it [i]could[/i] turn out to be a big one. If the recoil was made to be the same as PC the aim assist on console would definitely have to also be removed. You can’t have virtually no, or very predictable recoil and also have a sticky aim/aim assist feature. It would be a bit absurd. That’s good I hear you say? You hate aim assist? Well, when I played destiny on console I hated it too. Generally the good players will not like it, it hinders them. The average and bad players though will play so much worse than they currently do without it. Some of the average players would adapt, sure, but it would take a lot of practice. The bad players, or casuals, however you want to describe them will simply just be worse and not be able to get better, making the game no long enjoyable and they would simply leave. Especially the PvP ones. Whatever way you want to look at this it would end up costing Bungie money in the long run. Now, as for my bias... I’m actually in favour of the point you made. For a start it would make the sandboxes of the platforms much more level and weapon buffs and nerfs would not effect other platforms as negatively as they currently do. I honestly think that’s the reason why recoil and aim assist exist in the console versions. Anyway, I hope I’ve made more of a positive argument than the other guy

I'm actually neutral when it comes to aim assistance, but if recoil values on controller were to be brought in line with M+K, aim assistance may need to be toned down, but not removed outright. Controllers, based on 10 years personal experience, are not precision tools. Aim assist exists on console, and on PC if you're using a controller, because it helps bring aiming with a controller closer to what it would be like with a M+K. And that's not the only argument that was brought up between the other guy and I. On console, and i'm pretty sure on PC so long as it's controller input, we have something called Bloom. On most weapons, it's not really that bad, but on Hand Cannons it's insanely strong on many archetypes with the only archetype that has reasonable bloom being 180's. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yQltm9nctNk&feature=youtu.be Sorry for dropping a video randomly in here, I'm just trying to make sure we're both on the same page. Trust me, you'll need it. A long time ago, Destiny 1 year 1, we did not have such a mechanic. If your iron sights said that you would ding your target in the dome when you pulled the trigger, then your bullet would ding your target in the dome when you pulled the trigger. Durring TTK, ADS Bloom was added to all hand cannons because three exotic hand cannons were overpowered, Thorn, The Last Word, and Hawkmoon. What's the point of telling you this? Well, Destiny's competitive community just shoulder charged Bungie's front door down and demanded it to be removed because it made the sights to their Hand Cannons not represent where their bullets would go, causing them to miss their shots even though their aim was spot on. Bungie basically gave them the bird and basically said " No, we will not remove it. You we have higher ups that agree with this mechanic now, unlike our last boss. So either get used to it, find new weapons to play with, or go find a new game." Lucky for us on console at the time, there were other good weapons available. So unlike Halo, Bungie's previous game, Destiny didn't loose it's competitive community anywhere near as much. Anyways, we here on console have basically been begging, screaming, and requesting the mechanic be removed for years and suddenly PC Destiny 2 comes around and, turns out, it has just what we'd been screaming for years. Reasonable recoil, no bloom, diverse meta, and overall a better gun-play experience that we haven't had over here on console since year 1 of Destiny 1. That's why we console players want the two games to be brought more in line with each other. PC has gun-play based on skill whereas on console it's decided by RNG because our guns have both a hard fire rate cap and a soft fire rate cap. PC has guns that shoot exactly where you point them even when "spam-firing", console hasn't had anything like that since Destiny the House of Wolves. To us console players, it feels like struggling in school more because we purchased a paperback version of a text book because we couldn't/ didn't want to spend the money on a hardback cover of the exact same textbook. As for your argument, yes, it is much more positive and more respectful compared to the other guy.

Yeah man I see where you’re coming from. Like I said, I’m not against it at all, it solves lots of issues. Balance being the main one for me. Right now PC players are saying nerf LoW, console are players are like “wow, pc players ruining another gun”. It would solve this crap, we would all be more equal. After taking sunshot into crucible on PS4 and trying to use it at its max rpm I can honestly say I believe that there is some kind of bloom, having my sight on someone’s head on anything after it’s first shot did nothing but miss. It’s there, I agree. Anyways, for not against your argument

Honestly, I dont know why Bungie keeps ignoring bloom on console. They basically ninja anything that discusses the issue, causing it to become hidden. OEM with Ace was a problem on PC and [b]only on PC[/b]. Luna's and Not Forgotten were a problem on console and [b]only on console.[/b] At the moment the community has two options, bring the two platforms as in line as possible or have both platforms recieve balance changes that do not make sense for their respective platforms. Surprisingly, there is a large minority of players trying to stop changes that would improve gun-play on console for a combination of reasons, PTSD from the Thorn meta, annoyed by the constant requests that have been comming in, ect. What I'm trying to figure out is, how do we get Bungie to listen to console when they keep turning deaf and blind eyes to this simple request.

I’m 100% certain, in my own opinion, that bloom was added to consoles in D2 to cut down on the insane handcannon meta of D1. Bloom exists slightly on all guns, but on handcannons they are turned up to 11. They did that for a reason, and it’s because they completely dominate at all times when within their given range... which is huge. That would of been a huge problem at release when they were trying to make D2 PvP an e-sport (yeah it’s jokes I know). The things is though, I don’t think it’s as easy as people think it is to simply remove that... and anyway, have you seen pc PvP? Why use anything else at all when you can have a laser hand cannon. They dominate, they’re everywhere. The shorter range pulses, at the end of their range, can be out gunned by longer range hcs, it’s insane. I honestly don’t know why you would want that, and even if you do I’m sure you can understand why a lot of people don’t. Believe it when I say it that if bloom was removed from console there would be sooo many posts within a week about nerfing every hand cannon archetype into the ground. Honestly, I believe D2 is much too far into its life cycle now to start changing things like that. Especially if you’re talking about removing all recoil, aim assist and bloom. You have to understand that people don’t like change, and removing all of the above would be a HUGE change. When I first moved to pc it’s like I’m not even playing the same game, and that’s what it would feel like. I’m sorry to say that no matter how many voices make the same noise there will always be those that firmly stand against them. I will try and put this part as respectfully as possible... with your consoles coming to the end of their lives, having massively outdated hardware that certainly shows the strains of playing a game that’s even had its graphical settings turned down to mediocre, and with destiny moving to steam, and with cross save so people will lose zero progress. It’s the perfect time to make the switch over to pc. Not everyone has to buy some 3k beast machine to run destiny like a lot of people think. Hell, destiny even runs great on my old burnt out laptop with a 1060 card. My friend runs it fine with a 1660. The prices to build your own capable pc are wildly over estimated by a lot of people that think you need swag bags full of money, and that’s simply not true. Plus, the money you actually save in the long run from not paying for a live service, not paying £60 per game, a much wider choice of games, and hundreds of games going on sale literally all the time, all adds up. I understand you want to play destiny the way it’s meant to be played, but I don’t think console will ever change in regard to what you’re looking for. All the while, what you’re looking for is literally right there in front of you, within arms reach... don’t be one of those guys that refuses to grab it. [u][b]It’s the perfect time[/b][/u]

I'll definitely pick up the f2p version on pc, but because the dlc is tied to the platform, i dont think I'll make the full switch. This is just another reason I'll likely stay on xbox, if I make the switch, I'll have to repurchase content I already have. A better price than what was originally offered, but still questionably high. It's really just better to simply release a patch that reduces ADS bloom on handcannons and brings recoil values of controllers in line with M+K. Remember the hardware really doesnt matter in this case, it's the software that is important here. If the two versions of the game remain as different as they are, I'm 75% sure Bungie will need to do it anyway. As for the time of such a change, I'd have to respectfully dissagree with your belief that it's too late/too hard to implement this change. Remember, bloom was added durring TTK, a year after the game first came out. Arguably too late to implement it properly, but here we are. It was implemented improperly, late, and it's been screwing with the balance of Destiny 2 from the start. Really it technically wasnt a full blown HC meta, it was a Thorn meta. We only asked for the exotic handcannons at the time to be nerfed, but Bungie nerfed handcannons across the board even though Thorn, Last Word, and Hawkmoon were the only HC's that had questionable strength in PvP. I'm sorry, but a full move just to get rid of an annoying mechanic that screws me over just isn't worth re-purchasing everything I already have..