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2/11/2019 6:56:06 PM
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idk where you got 230% from but it's closer to +125% damage. And it goes away after a miss or a kill so it's basically 1 shot of +125% damage. With things like kill clip and rampage which only require a kill and last regardless of follow up kills or misses, magnificent howl is pretty balanced in how it's actually been implemented in the game.
Also if we're really talking easy mode how about Last word which also 3 taps but at 225rpm and is a 1 hour quest to get as opposed to a 2 week to 2 month grind for LH/NF respectively.
Or how about Ace + OEM which two taps at 140 rmp lmao.
What other gun is as accurate? Literally any handcannon with opening shot or high range.
There's literally a fvcking myriad of guns to counter the lunas the fact is most people that don't have the lunas are to trash to get it and are being outplayed by every single gun but can't blame it on every single gun because they have access to them so they have to blame it on the one thing they don't have because that's clearly what the problem is. People think they're way better than they actually are and give themselves far too much credit.
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It’s 230%.... do the math lol
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Edited by Crucify: 2/11/2019 10:23:49 PMDon't you start as well. Go get a calculator, 57 + 130% = 131. 2.3x is not the same as +230%. When you +100% to something, you are taking 100% of it's initial value and adding it to itself, essentially doubling it (aka 2x). If you are adding 200% of something to itself, you are taking it's initial value, doubling it and adding it to the original value which gives you 3x the original value. +230% would be the same as 3.3x the normal value which would give you 188. And Lunas with magnificent howl does not hit for 188 on a crit, it hits for 131 which is 57 +130% of itself (+130% buff).
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Either way. It’s a bad perk to have ingame
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It's not, it lasts for one shot in pvp. The minute you miss the first or second crit you instantly go from having the best 180 to having the worst 180 in the game due to it's lackluster range. Yes landing two crits can be very easy but it absolutely does not happen as much as everyone that doesn't have the gun thinks. Also there is an annoying feature on the gun where the perk procs on a delay which means despite landing two crits, your third shot does regular damage.
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[quote]magnificent howl is pretty balanced in how it's actually been implemented in the game.[/quote] It's not when people have access to Malfeasance, Trust, West of Sunfall 7, and other 180 options and yet always choose LH and NF over them. In fact, these 3 handcannons have more range than LH and yet they're underused because magnificent howl is good enough to warrant its use over them. LH is the most used weapon on every single pvp gamemode regardless of whether it's Competitive or Quickplay. NF doesn't beat it in terms of % usage solely because less people have it compared to LH. A weapon being used the most on every single pvp gamemode isn't an indication of balance, it's an indication of being broken.
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Of course people will for the most part choose LH and NF over other 180's. The whole purpose of a pinnacle weapon is to be the best in it's class. Why would anyone spend countless hours grinding for a gun that they're then going to ditch for the gun they used during the grind (trust). It literally wouldn't make sense. These are the best in class, but they are by absolutely no means, uncounterable. Lunas has a max range of 29m before it starts experiencing drop off damage and NF has a max range of 33m. All the other 180s have superior range as you stated, the problem is nobody tries to outrange Lunas and NF, i guarantee you if you took your trust and challenged a NF or Lunas outside it's optimal and intended range, you would immediately start winning your gunfights more often. You wouldn't use a pulse rifle to counter a shotgun in shotgun range would you? Also a trust with explosive payload is still a Lunas killer and everyone knows this. Lunas and NF are powerful, there is no doubt about that, but having either of these guns absolutely does not mean you will win every engagement nor does it automatically make you a good player. There is a lot of guns that can outplay them and this is beyond apparent on PC
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On xbox not so much. I have been killed by both at INSANE range for a HC while using greatly rolled Bygones n BF....I don't care like some do about this but the ppl using LH/NF ALL crying their eyes out about Telesto is why it got the nerf stick so I don't support elitist that cry bc something is beating their SUPER powered HC's
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Telesto didnt get nerfed it got fixed, bungie even stated that telesto was putting out numbers higher than its archetype was intended to put out.
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[quote]Of course people will for the most part choose LH and NF over other 180's. The whole purpose of a pinnacle weapon is to be the best in it's class. Why would anyone spend countless hours grinding for a gun that they're then going to ditch for the gun they used during the grind (trust). It literally wouldn't make sense.[/quote] The point of this post is to evaluate to what extent LH and NF are a crutch, so the methods or difficulty in acquiring them have no bearing over this aspect. [quote]These are the best in class, but they are by absolutely no means, uncounterable. Lunas has a max range of 29m before it starts experiencing drop off damage and NF has a max range of 33m.[/quote] They are the best weapons and most used weapons on high-competitive play (and in LH's case on every single pvp gamemode), so that makes them the biggest primary crutch in the game. [quote]All the other 180s have superior range as you stated, the problem is nobody tries to outrange Lunas and NF, i guarantee you if you took your trust and challenged a NF or Lunas outside it's optimal and intended range, you would immediately start winning your gunfights more often. You wouldn't use a pulse rifle to counter a shotgun in shotgun range would you? Also a trust with explosive payload is still a Lunas killer and everyone knows this.[/quote] More range than LH yes but not NF. NF has the highest range stat of any 180, so it can't be outranged by them. Also, I don't have a problem going against these weapons (I have a 2.5KD overall and the only special I use are Fusion Rifles), what I do have a problem with is when tryhards using NF/LH/DRB say I'm "crutching" on Erentil. The extent to which a weapon is easily used as a crutch is a direct measure of how many people are using it. On guardian.gg or any other tracking website, LH holds #1 for the most used, while Erentil doesn't even appear anywhere. People who run paid carries want to make money as easily and quickly as possible. Guess what their set-up is? DRB/NF.
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They're not crutches though, everyone who has earned a Lunas and NF can preform just as well without them, it's not like they went into comp at 0 glory on day 1 with a NF. Everyone that currently has one, didn't have it at one point and i guarantee that even if you take these guns away they will still go around stomping everyone.
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False. Not even a week ago I played a bunch of tryhards on Comp who initially had NF/DRB. When they saw me and my friend using 2 Erentils, they switched to Fusions before the game started. When they started losing badly, they all switched back to NF/DRB. One guy on their team even had 16,000 NF kills and was from that "It Had 2 Be Us" clan. They were streaming, so I can point you to the segment of the clip if you want. If they are so skilled and good at the game, why couldn't they do shit with Fusions and were forced to switch back to NF/DRB? That's why those weapons are crutches.
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Not everyone has to use fusions to be good? I guarantee i could beat your fusion with my sniper, that doesn't make my sniper a crutch or your fusion worse than my sniper. Also the fact that you beat them with the loadouts they were using further solidifies that the guns aren't even that good and don't suddenly make everyone unbeatable
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"Anyone who got their LH and NF can perform just as good without them" That's what you said, and the fact these guys had to switch back to NF/DRB means they were "skillful" enough to use those weapons, yet not enough to use Erentil (a weapon most tryhards consider a crutch), so it contradicts that. Also, I never said we won. They were losing badly when we had equal loadouts and turned the game around once all of them switched to NF/DRB, which shows the weapons had more of an impact than their skill. [quote]Not everyone has to use fusions to be good?[/quote] True, but based on what you said previously, anyone who got NF shouldn't have a problem using a Fusion against another Fusion, yet these top-tier players couldn't and switched back to NF (their crutch).
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Edited by Crucify: 2/12/2019 12:13:08 AMAlso trust is more used than Lunas so i guess thats a statistical crutch too?? Bygones? Must be a crutch, blast furnace ?? Definitely a crutch.
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Not sure where you're getting those numbers from. On guardian.gg, the only two gamemodes in which Trust is used more than LH are Survival and Countdown, which makes sense because all the people who don't have LH use Trust until they get their Luna. Also, the difference in % usage is less than 1%. Meanwhile, in other gamemodes, LH is used almost twice as much as Trust. Also, LH is used more than Bygones and Blast Furnace in every gamemode. In fact, the most used primary weapon in every mode is DRB lmao. Everything I said can be verified here: https://guardian.gg/2/weapon-stats/2/12/0/2019-01-11/2019-02-11 We're currently in a Shotgun / Handcannon / Pulse Meta, but let's not pretend. When tryhards want to win a game really badly, they all default to NF/DRB, not pulse rifles. DRB+NF is the ultimate crutch in this current meta.
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Problem is, most Luna’s players are smart and will not engage in a single gunfight past 28m...you can have all the range in the world on a weapon but it becomes useless against someone who doesn’t engage out of Luna’s 28m range, if they use that weapon at 28m range against Luna...rip. It’s not hard to engage an entire match at 28m or closer. No gun is even close to as powerful as Luna or Not Forgotten. Everyone knows that. It’s a Pinnacle Weapon, yes, but Luna + Not Forgotten are so powerful that nothing else is even on the same planet. I know players that haven’t used a different weapon after they got the Not Forgotten. Why? They all say it’s broken as hell and every other weapon is trash compared to it.
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Please explain how it’s a 125% bonus again lol...that was hilarious and u made my day. Reread what u said lol... U sir are awesome!
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Edited by Eucadia: 2/11/2019 10:05:15 PMTo be fair, his math is correct. The bonus obtained from magnificent howl is calculated as the difference between the final damage value (131) and the initial damage value (57), which gives 74 points of extra damage. Comparing this value (74) to the initial value (57) we get 74/57 = 1.30 or 130% bonus damage. That being said, I don't think magnificent howl is balanced in any way considering LH is the most used weapon on every single pvp gamemode even though alternative 180 options with better stats exist.
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It’s a 130% difference in damage from 57 to 131. But that’s not what the buff is...I see what both u are saying but it’s not correct. It’s a 230% damage buff or 2.3x buff. https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.reddit.com/r/CruciblePlaybook/comments/9djayn/lunas_howl_review/#ampf=undefined
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That's not how it works. If you buff 57 by +230% you end up with 188. How do you think you are right when your figures literally don't add up to actual values? And i literally cannot stress this enough. 2.3x and +230% are completely different values. 2.3x is the original value literally x 2.3 +230% is the the original value with 230% of itself added to it. You're so painfully wrong.
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Edited by Eucadia: 2/11/2019 11:25:28 PMD = Do (1 + B) Where: D is damage; Do is initial damage, B is buff in decimals B = (D/Do) - 1 B = (131/57) - 1 B = 1.30 or 130% If B = 0, then D = Do (no buff applied) The (1+B) factor represents the amount of deviation or buff that the damage value has with respect to the initial damage value.
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Edited by Crucify: 2/11/2019 7:44:22 PMLunas does 57 on a regular crit, if it had a 230% buff as you suggest, it would then do 188 on a crit which is enough to almost one shot a guardian from full health. With magnificent howl, lunas does 131 on a crit which is 125% rounded up via in game programming. GGs.
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Lol... https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.reddit.com/r/CruciblePlaybook/comments/9djayn/lunas_howl_review/#ampf=undefined
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“Looks at FlaccidDaggers last 20 games played...” n he used Luna on every single one. Wrecked... Do I need to check further?
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LOL he actually did math and you had no counter so you ran to check if he uses the gun - which was completely irrelevant to his point
