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Edited by Valigus:
1/6/2019 8:43:12 PM
88
Stop the Zavala hate
I understand people didn’t like what he did in forsaken but Zavala is not under our control, his job is to lead the city and he has done a good job of it.
He makes good choices and has seen us through many dark times and I would follow him. He is a good leader and while we may not agree with his choices they have been sound in most situations.
So stop the Zavala hate
He has the entire weight of humanity on his shoulders
[spoiler]and you probably couldn’t do any better [/spoiler]
To those who think Zavala is a coward I have a question is anything he did in the red war indicative of cowardice
Edit: don’t think I believe he is perfect or anything all I am saying is he does his best at a very hard job and makes what he sees as the best choices some of his choices have been questionable though like those he made in warmind
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2 RepliesI don't necessarily think he's a coward on most issues. He does his job, true, but a true leader needs to be able to do more than what his job description says. If Zavala was a real leader, he would have gone out and lead the guardians, instead of hiding away, when they went to avenge Cayde. If Zavala was a real leader, he would have stayed in the City until every citizen was able to escape. If Zavala was a real leader, maybe he wouldn't be hiding behind those walls all the time. Hunter/Warlock master race.
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LeAvE bRiTtAnY aLoNe headass
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17 RepliesI only started disrespecting him complety after Kell's Scrouge infiltrated the City and he didn't bother to bring a few more Fireteams than normal raids (he gave us a tank but against what we were facing and the threat of Kell's Scourge having a base in the City)
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1 ReplyIt’s shaxx we should honor.
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4 RepliesDon’t hate him. Just think he’s seen too much, lost too many people under his command to continue to lead well. He’s also to rigid and predictable (he’s at least aware of this himself), and too attached to the City in order to adapt to the changing nature of the war. Cayde and Ikora made up for his shortcomings as a leader. But Cayde is gone, and the relationship between he and Ikora is fraying. She will eventually supplant him as Vanguard commander. Just like she replaced Osiris as Warlock Vanguard. She seems to be the only one of the two of them that seem to understand the expanding character of the conflict, and is willing to make the tough calls: 1. You have to sometimes ride out to meet danger while it is still small enough to be defeated. She made the right call after Cayde’s death, not Zavala. 2. She understands that Osiris was right. That if the Vanguard kept seeing the war in human terms, and trying to fight it on human terms we would lose....and losing means extinction in this war. Not just the City, but the entire Human species. Zavala is too emotionally attached to the City to see what is really at stake.
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As commander, he is a politician first. His first priority is to tend the flock. As such, when thousands of criminals break out of prison, he "needs everyone to know their personal safety comes number one." It might be the worst way to keep people safe, but he's gotta go out there and make his speeches - kissing hands and shaking babies - because it keeps people from panicking. If you get a panic happening in an enclosed city, it all goes to custard. When everyone else is out of earshot, he lets you creep out and do your thing, knowing your god-killing hiney will get the job done alone ("but we can't spare anyone to help you...") It's not as if he can do anything to stop you anyway, especially after you just made your longest speech in years.
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1 Replyzavala needs to GET WOKE OR GO BROKE.
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Base game: Rash and wanting to charge head first. Warmind: Foolishly denies help Forsaken: [i]Cowardice[/i] [spoiler]Got any mugs?[/spoiler]
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Of course what he did during the Red War wasn’t cowardice. But deciding not to avenge your fallen brother AND telling the only person who COULD to stay just because HE was too afraid of the consequences is DOWNRIGHT COWARDICE. I’m so sorry but your “great and courageous” Vanguard was and is a damn coward.
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3 RepliesEdited by Hexi: 1/6/2019 3:40:17 PMConsidering how easily Garry took away the light, I wouldn't want to take chances either. It happened on his watch, he probably feels responsible for all the Guardian who died because he wasn't ready.
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4 RepliesI always pictured the Titan as the guy that would run in and f stuff up I mean shoulder charge and ground pounds are all close up and personal
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I mean. He's better than Sloane. Because he knows when to send us into the breach.
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His armor is trash
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Tbh the only flaw is his thinking for me was that Uldren killed a vanguard commander (equivalent to the highest levels of government) and it was thought best to let them be. I can understand securing the prison of elders first but Uldren needed to be dealt with too. After the city was safe however.
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2 Replieshe backed saladins order to withdraw at twilight gap while shaxx and six other stopped the fallen at the hole if theres any character that needs more respect lore dlc or anything its him
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Still don’t like him
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3 RepliesI don’t think anyone questions Zavala’s courage. His judgement on the other hand has been a topic of much speculation ever since he prioritized evacuating the Tower over protecting the Traveller when the Cabal attacked the Tower. The way Bungie has been writing him recently portrays him as being very short-sighted, he sees the obvious threat in front of him, but he doesn’t see the bigger picture at all. Other posters in this topic have brought up the idea ‘Chess’ to describe Zavala. A great Chess players anticipates the moves that their opponent will make several moves down the road and controls the board. A novice Chess player reacts to their opponents moves and is always on the defense. Zavala is the latter, not the former. It’s somewhat ironic ( and disappointing since I’m a huge Lance Reddick fan ) that Zavala in Destiny 2, is pretty much everything Asher Mir thinks a stereotypical Titan is. I suppose another analogy would be that scene in Jurassic Park where the expert tracker goes out to the main fuse box ( so that they could reboot power to the computer systems ), initially he thinks he’s tracking the Alpha Raptor, he doesn’t realize until it’s to late that the Alpha Raptor was actually leading him into a trap where he ended up being flanked and killed by the other 2 Raptors.
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I don't understand did y'all really want Zavala to leave the tower? why would he that would make no sense. The guardians job and vanguards job is to protect those who can’t defend themselves. To the Red War argument the entire vanguard are powerless after the attack Cayde & Ikora & zavala flee from the city to Titan, IO, and Nessus, what exactly are they supposed to do? Knowing that if they die it's over. Just like if the vanguard left for a friend that would leave the people in the city defenseless or "powerless" from a surprise attack which ultimately would lead to their deaths.
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5 RepliesZavala is the best vanguard commander we could get. If we were the vanguard commander we would be too busy to deal with city politics or whatever. He seems like a coward because while ikora and us were trying to get revenge on uldren, he was doing his duty, focusing on the city.
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1 Replywhat do you mean we couldn't do any better? did zavala slay a bakers dozen of literal gods? did zavala save humanity from a cabal invasion? what did zavala do? he killed like 100 fallen when they invaded the city well guess what big blue boi, [i]we destroyed the entire fallen house system without even breaking a sweat and we still made it home by dinner time[/i] we go out every day and slay gods willy-nilly like it's a daily chore and how are we repaid? "Oh guardian, here's a shit rolled edge transit, thanks [b]FOR SAVING OUR ASSES FOR LIKE THE 17TH TIME[/b]"
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He should be stripped of his bubble... again!
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1 ReplySomeone gets it. Thank you. Zavala doesn’t lead an army to attack all enemies, he has guardians to protect those who can’t defend themselves. When he sends troops there will be no one defending the tower from the fallen, the hive or the cabal.
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4 RepliesI don't have issues with what Zavala did in "Forsaken". He was right. Cayde would not have wanted us to put the City at risk just to punish his killer. Zavala understood the Vanguard's greater role as humanity's protectors. However, in general... I think that Zavala's not quite as smart as he thinks he is.
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6 RepliesI respect Zavala more than I do Ikora. Ikora can be a bit hot headed at times, but Zavala thinks with a clear mind and trys to do the right things despite what he's feeling. Remember, he didn't try and stop us from going after Uldren, only the entirety of Guardians because Guardians are not conquerors. He did the right thing.
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Nope He didn't wanna help Rasputin, and is hiding secrets from us, how did he even get ahead of us behind that sealed door?, Didn't wanna avenge Cayde, was even jealous when we got our powers back but he didn't. Zavarla has been a prick for a long time now, yep it's bungie's fault after all they write the script, but they've made me wish he'd died instead of Cayde.
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2 RepliesZaval should ask for help. He should distribute the weight of humanity to other notable people in order to lessen the load.
