Come on dude. I know all this. But there's something majorly wrong with destiny's model. It lacks key mmo features - RPG elements, servers, crafting, massive multiplayer, enemy variety etc, but has all the mmo bad shit- overpriced dlc, broken economys, artificial slow grinds. For a Forty dollar dlc to artificially slow grind is seemingly standard - but not to such detriment to players, and not to cover up for lack of content. It's a cop out to say it's an mmo- sure it's an mmo when its grindy and -blam!-ing tedious, but when it has literally 2 percent of the rpg stuff of WoW, "oh its a looter shooter dude"

Some people just want to shoot stuff and get new weapons...it's a shallow game, I agree. It's a repetetive game, I agree... But it's not a job unless you make it such. I'd understand where you were coming from if you had strong ideas to improve it, but if it's just complaints about how you don't like it, not sure how to say this without being mean, you must be a bit slow to have not figured out by now that this is what some people find to be fun.

Bro come on. There are easy fixes. 1. Ditch the 2 small dlc, one big one model. All it means is bungie is able to charge 100s for the content of one full game, and deludes people into thinking that by finally getting enough content, the pricetag was justified. Dlc should add to a finished product (ala witcher 3 dlc) not fill up and fix a game 2. Rather than dlc adding enough stuff, focus for a full game at launch. Full lengthy stories, with character arcs, twists player choice etc. Make it so people get their moneys worth. Don't ditch the grind - if it has to be an mmo hybrid, grind is necessary. But make it fun byyyyy.... 3. Add more rpg stuff. Pick stats at the start, races having stats, another class, another elemental type, more armor types (eg light, medium, heavy). Make sneaking a thing, add a ship combat minigame like srl. Add more enemy races. Seriously 2 whole games and 7 dlcs, and every enemy is just the same 4 races mixed and matched. Dedicated servers. 12 man fireteams. Overall, replace hollow tedious grinding, overpriced and limited dlc (do people not -blam!-ing realise that the taken, siva, and scorn are all just reskins with new abilities) with worthwile stuff. The destiny world is so interesting . The combat is satisfying. The writing is good. But it is hampered by unnecessary grind and hollow dlc, necessitated by greed and laziness.

You just made it into the games I don't enjoy. Which is fine. Each their own 😀

Everything I said I feel like is an objective positive addition. I'm not getting rid of anything. There can still be grind. Look at skyrim- you can deffo grind through tons of boring caves in skyrim for money and levels. If you want. Same in warframe. In destiny it seems like a necessity.

Stats for races, skills, large groups, vehicle combat... All that stuff is the chore in my opinion. Sounds like more traditional mmo. I'm here for simple mindless fun. I play table-top rpg when I want depth. Honestly though, ESO sounds like the game for you.

Hold on. You think that rpg elements that make you feel like your actually playing as a character, and skills that allow you to develop your character as you want, are a chore, but playing the same strike, to get shit gear you dismantle, to hand in token to a guy, to get and engram, to decrypt and get more shit, is fun?

No, see you misunderstand me again. I play a LOT of games in general Alpha. I remember when videogames were all text based and didn't have pictures. Nearly every single RPG you've ever played is just a table-top D&D clone with altered elements. The exceptionally well done ones with the highest level of detail/skill/strategy are turn-based and not action oriented. Divinity Original Sin franchise would be a great example of a highly involved and deep RPG. I love that style of game in general. Yet, when the model is adopted in action titles, it tends to become exceptionally mundane and bastardized. At that point and time, i'd prefer a stronger focus on action and less on detailed RPG elements as it is usually poorly done in titles like this. See Division, or Borderlands, or recent Mass Effect. The more action oriented, the less capable of an RPG it can be. You have to slow things down to be a proper RPG, which is why turn-based games always do it best and nearly ALL of the super successful MMO's have been attacks/spells on a rotation and not pure real-time action. Have you played the Forsaken DLC yet? Based on your statements, it doesn't seem like you have.

No but I've heard alot from my friends and watched alot. I would preorder destiny 3 if they promised and showed that rpg stuff.

Guessing your friends are still stuck in the pre-Forsaken version of Destiny then and haven't realized the changes on the leveling or gear acquisition. It's all challlenge based now, no longer a token-fest. Random rolls are back, and difficult content exists (instead of everyone just spamming public events to max). But I wouldn't suggest buying/pre-ordering anything from this franchise knowing your mindset on what you want. You're better off with games like ESO.

See that's the thing. I want to love destiny. There's so much good.