I laugh everytime I see someone try to end an argument with putting a price tag on how many hours you play a game... If I came round your home and painted all your walls badly you wouldn't accept me saying I spent 2 days doing it thats X amount per hour stop complaining! no you would be saying this is not what you paid for!

To be fair -- the whole point of an MMO is you buy it once, and wait for the developers to add more raids into the game... free raids, mind you. Bungie is using an FPS model of pricing their game when they should be using the MMO model. You charge people once to start playing the game... and then you make free content to keep them engaged and thus, even more people buy the same game that has already had a bunch of work put into it. You could call Forsaken an "expansion" much in the same way as Battle for Azeroth is an expansion of World of Warcraft, however, Blizzard doesn turn around and charge you 20 bucks for every additional raid you want to do (Not to mention most of World of Warcraft's cosmetics are not locked behind lootboxes but that's another vein of discussion entirely). The way I see it: fans are already unhappy after having spend 90 bucks on a game that offers less content (and more rng) than other MMOs on the market. The prospect of paying another 90 bucks for the SAME kind of deal is kind of a case of "fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me." I don't like to lump myself into "hate" or "defender" groups but even as someone in the middle who wanted to enjoy Destiny -- I just can't help but feel ticked off that Bungie's plan is THIS of all things. A possible solution for Bungie, for example, could be to offer a significant discount on Forsaken to those who already have the base game of Destiny 2 purchased, and furthermore to bundle Forsaken with the Curse of Osiris and Warmind DLCs (if that is not the case already). Revising their scheme to make the post Forsaken DLCs free content would also be a good idea. Again -- the whole point of an MMO is for the game to grow over time and for its value to increase as more content is added. By adding more content the game naturally attracts more potential players. However, if you are going to make the game more expensive every time you add a raid (not even a raid, but an ADDON to a pre-existing raid that has NOTHING to do with the theme of the DLC) you are pretty much actively discouraging new people from jumping into your game. Major updates are supposed to be a time for people to take a second look at a game and decide if they want to jump into it or not, not a time in which they see the price-tag on a game they were thinking of playing go up by 20 bucks. (Note: I know that in my argument I did not account for subscription fees in other MMOs, and in those regards: yes. WoW is more expensive to play for a year than Destiny is. However, the argument could also be made that games such as Guild Wars 2 exist, which have far more content, do not charge subscription fees, and only re-charge you when a large expansion is released).

I don't think people claim they haven't gotten their money's worth out of this game, I definitely have. I believe it's more that people would appreciate a gesture of goodwill from Bungie, as an apology for this trainwreck of a sequel. You know, many game studios these days are trying to improve their business model for selling and maintaining games, Battlefield V will have neither loot boxes, nor paid DLCs, and The Division 2 will also not have any paid DLCs. And in this context of change, what does Bungie do? Cashing in harder than ever before, by a) making people buy all old DLCs in order to buy the new one, b) Still having loot boxes in Eververse, c) selling the new DLC (almost) for the price of a full game, AND on top of that, d) making people pay for the annual content, which won't have any cutscenes or new patrol areas. That is just pure and disgusting greed, nothing else. And people should criticize this, as loud as they can.

A hardcore player try to defend Bungo? No wander why they can ripoff us all the time, because player like you will take whatever they give to you...even piece of sh-t...👎

Dumb argument is just that, dumb. Honestly this one is just as bad as the first time someone tried using it. Value is entirely subjective.

Ok you tell how much I enjoy playing D2 D1 - Over 100 days played (2400 Hrs plus) Damn I miss them days hoping my legendary would turn into an exotic, OMFG, OMFG - WTF why are you screaming OMFG for Screwy, OMFG guys, my legendary has just turn into the Gjallarhorn, lucky B screwy. D2 - 23 DAYS (552 Hrs) No further comment FYI I was there for the Beta and at my local Game shop for the Midnight release. EDIT I'LL wait for the reviews before buying Foresaken

I have less than 10 It sucked

So when you go out to get a steak and it's burnt you eat it right. Then equate it's value to how long you chewed? Instead of them throwing in a discount or a free appetizer next time, they remove a side dish. Me I would have like to see some of those Sep. changes now. Find some easy thing to fix or adjust. I don't like seeing things are messed up and waiting a year to do something about it. Holding the next payday over our heads. If there is anything going for D2-Y2, is they haven't said anything terrible about the game yet. The pre-launch of D2 was bad news after bad news about the development choices of the game. It seems like the game is going in a more positive direction. I guess we'll see in the coming weeks.

Great...THIS dumb argument again. Quit trying to equate the value of a product with the time played. Value is subjective and will be viewed differently from person to person. Quit trying to put a metric on it, you have no right judge how other people determine value and enjoyment.

K....how many hours spent on skyrim or witcher 3? Easily more content and playworthy than destiny

[quote]Nothing in regards to this hobby is so black and white as to be set in stone for every player at all times.[/quote] Unfortunately the mentality of a lot of people on line is pure black and white. People either love or hate something, it's either the best or the worst, you either agree or disagree with something 100%. There seems to be no shades of grey when it comes to how people think or feel any more.

[quote]Stop talking about getting ripped off.[/quote] Compared to other games, it can be considered a ripoff. Other games such as NMS and Division had messed up games and offered free DLC to compensate the fans. In this regard, people, rightfully, feel ripped off. Also, games like MHW and GTA offer free DLC for $60. Destiny keeps charging, so in this regard, we are getting "ripped off." Games like Warframe and Fortnite are free to play and the cost/hour is essentially zero compared to Destiny and don't even require PS plus or Xbox Live subs. Lastly, cost/hour played is a metric, but not a good one. By this logic, the longer I stay at a restaurant, the cheaper it gets. [quote]They owe you EXACTLY jack and shit, and jack left town.[/quote] No, they don't owe me jack or shit because I already got that with my purchase of D2.

lol One day you will understand