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Destiny 2

Discuss all things Destiny 2.
Edited by C0ltsFan2164: 6/14/2018 4:10:33 PM
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Why Zavala should have died, (At least from a lore perspective.)

Zavala Should Die

604

VuVuzela Should still stand

344

Apologies for the long post, but I hope it was well written. Zavala, I don't know what to say about you. You were the hype character for vanilla Destiny 2, and just like the game, you did not live up even close to the expectations that were set. The ending of Destiny 2, to say the very least, was a huge letdown for me. The characters constantly kept foreshadowing towards a characters death. Whether it was Zavala's fear of losing another guardian on Titan, All the dead guardians after the red war and even Ikora's inability to act due to fear of losing her "one chance." When I finished the campaign after pulling an all-nighter that fateful night, I was quite dissapointed with the end result. This felt like a blatant slap in the face of what I believed to be an example of "chekhov's gun." So how does one fix this terrible crime of an ending. To first understand it, we must look at the character of Zavala himself. Zavala has always been shown to be a man of the people. Whenever he was questioned about tactics and other decisions, he focuses on defending the people of the city more than that of the Traveler. This could not be more apparent than on the attack of the city during the Red War when Ikora tells him that the Red Legion was attacking the traveler. Instead of diverting forces towards protecting that giant ball we call "God," Zavala instead focuses on defending the tower until the last of the refugee ships were underway. In fact, his unwavering resolve to protect humanity is his one and only true character trait that survived the Destiny 1 - 2 jump. How I would have finished the campaign would have been to continue with the assault throughout the city, but have the members of the vanguard consistently come across death defying odds with astounding ease. Cayde would still have his arm shot off while setting up the portal, but I would have included a true "defend the point" where you and the other members of the vanguard have to fight off hordes of legion trying to break through. Once the portal is opened, you hit a small cutscene where the Red Legion are closing in on you, with Zavala having to shoulder charge you through before it closes. The only thing you would hear after being shoved through is the charging sound of a psion sniper followed by a yelp of pain. The end would continue the same as it did, except that there is no ghost communication between you and the ground troops. (perhaps there was a radio jammer.) With the ending instead having everyone surround commander Zavala's casket on the walls of the new city. The Speaker's words will echo throughout the ending as it does in our current copy, but instead of everyone smiling and collecting, instead, members of the funeral start to depart until it is only you and your ghost that is left. After a soft and sobering discussion with ghost about what the war has cost everyone. Ghost will decide that you probably require time to yourself as it fades way, panning away from your guardian as you softly whisper thanks and look at the Traveler with your hand on the casket. This would make for an excellent piece of storytelling as it would also build itself into the other characters. Ikora: Obviously shaken the most due to her fears of being the one that would die, she is soon given the role of Vanguard commander due to her experience within the tower. She may have a constant and irreplaceable fear of losing your guardian in the wilds as well. Cayde: This wisecracking son of a gun would probably continue using humor to lighten the mood, but it seems to take on a bit more of a darker tone. Instead of using clever wordplay, he begins to become more like Ghelelon and uses it to deflect from his feelings. Shaxx: After being Zavala's rival (ideological at least), Shaxx has trouble coming to terms with the death of his fellow iron lord. With the hole opened in the Vanguard command structure, Shaxx fills up the role of Titan vanguard, pushing guardians in the crucible, (especially titans) to remember a hero of the city and to never forget what one is fighting for. One final point that I want to bring up is that with Ikora in the position of Vanguard commander, it sets her up perfectly for the events of the Curse of Osiris DLC. In this, Sagira will be completely befuzzled with the now methodical actions of Ikora, to which she claims is the side effects of her new position. While meeting Osiris, she will tell him about the position she gained with Osiris giving a quick congratulations followed by sage advice to learn from those who have fallen, and they will never have truly died. From this point on, Osiris will act as an advisor to Ikora, not as a mentor. The Iron Banner may have had an emblem called Zavala's empathy. A quick gameplay point is that you will incorporate Strike rewards with Ikora alongside the meditations. Lorewise, meditations are Ikora's way of gleaning the important lessons Zavala taught from the Guardian's experiences during the Red War. tl;dr. Zavala's death would have lead to a quite creative change in tone for the always cheerful Destiny 2 alongside allowing for true character growth and improvement of many of the main NPC's in destiny. Please comment your opinions as I would love to discuss them! Edit: it has come to my attention that Lord Shaxx and Zavala are not, in fact, iron lords. The fact still stands that Shaxx and Zavala still trained quite a bit under the Lord Saladman and have been battlebrothers for years. Edit 2: Wow! I did not expect all of these responses. For those who may be reading this again, would you be interested in reading more of my remade scenes from D2? If so, please comment what scene you want next.
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#lore #destiny2

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  • I'm not going to deny that killing a character in general and sticking with that death would have major impacts on the game leading forward... But Cayde's character had such a... bright and tragic backstory given and told through shattered fragments in such a way that mimics the character. Y'wanna know what really got me? The exotic ship you get for pre-ordering is called Queen of Hearts. In D1 on the Cayde's Stash mission for TTK, hidden in an air vent near the boss was a "hidden stash". Upon entering, Cayde commented about you finding one of his stashes and tells you to leave the exotics for him, but you can take the glimmer. You find it empty, and he voices his qualms on the matter, but in the empty room you find a playing card. Upon scanning it with your Ghost, Cayde proceeds to tell you that he had a system to organize his loot. "Royal cards stood for weapons. Spades for Hakke, Clubs for Crux/Lomar, Diamonds for Omolon. And hearts... heh... well, hearts were for this girl I knew..." Your Ghost then commented on it and Cayde very quickly dismisses it and directs you back to your mission. If anybody remembers this, his system of organization wasn't just for his stashes. It also applied to his fragmented memories of his past. He dismisses it not because he doesn't WANT to talk about it, he CAN'T. He doesn't remember. I'm sure the lorehounds out there have numerous other instances but Cayde dying, despite how much we hate it and how much we [b]HATE HATE HATE[/b] Uldren's filthy guts and [u]IF[/u] and only [u]IF[/u] handled correctly, could launch this game into the kind of grimdark-ish tone it honestly should've always been.

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    • Edited by MKBucko: 6/15/2018 5:21:01 AM
      And the tombstone would read... [spoiler] Whether we wanted it or not, we've stepped into a war with the Cabal on Mars. So let's get to taking out their command, one by one. Valus Ta'aurc. From what I can gather he commands the Siege Dancers from an Imperial Land Tank outside of Rubicon. He's well protected, but with the right team, we can punch through those defenses, take this beast out, and break their grip on Freehold.[/spoiler]

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    • So Shaxx and Zavala don’t have a rivalry. There’s some beef between Zavala and Shaxx but it’s not as bad as Saladin and Shaxx’s views/actions. During the battle of twilight gap, Saladin, Zavala and Shaxx were some of the battle leaders. Shaxx took a small set of frames and guardians and held the line at a break in the wall. Shaxx was ordered to retreat; he disobeyed this command and Zavala led a counter attack. Since then the Shaxx hasn’t been in good eyes with Saladin and Zavala, although I do believe that Zavala has come to terms with him a little.

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    • The only way bungie has a chance of pulling this off is because it’s cayde if it was ikora or Zavala we wouldn’t care as much. I can even say that all guardians already didn’t like uldren but once he shot cayde he was at the top of the wanted list. And cayde brought us humor if bungie can do this right it could save the franchise but we’ll find out in September

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    • You forget that the speaker died and he wass supposed to be the one we all mourn. Unfortunately, we got a scannable in a corner of the tower instead of a huge funeral cutscene.

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    • Zavala don't do nothing besides make big speeches. Ikora is way too serious. Cayde had a sense of humor and he did more than the other two combined. Ikora or Zavala should have got killed.

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    • Edited by A Broken Record: 6/23/2018 2:45:38 AM
      This whole game should've died after the COO. This is without a doubt one of the worst games ever. Now to enjoy the tears of the fanboys.

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      • Ok, but what about Warmind? It would be blander without Zavala putting into Ana.

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        • Love how deep you got with this. I think I would have been more bothered with Zavala since I have been a titan main since year 1.

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        • No. Glad it is Cayde, good riddance

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        • Edited by Ryan Gosling: 6/15/2018 1:09:17 AM
          The point of Cayde’s death was to fuel our anger and hunger for revenge. People may as well bat off Zavala’s death, and plus how would he be caught in a moment of where he could die, he rarely leaves the tower. But the point of the character choice is to make this new DLC feel like we actually care about what’s happening. People aren’t as invested with Cayde as they are with Zavala. And if this death can be reversed, Zavala’s is gonna be kinda tricky.

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        • Neither Shaxx nor Zavala are/were Iron Lords

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        • Tl;dr If zavala died maybe then we could get a commander who can actually.. You know.. command. Make tactically smart decisions. Make smart decisions at all really. Destiny 2 showed him to be a really shitty leader. Cayde dying is nice too though. If this ends up not following the bungie pattern of being a low quality rip off it'll be nice not having quipbot constantly make stupid -blam!-ing quips straight out of a marvel movie

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        • TLDR

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        • Shaxx is an iron lord...thus why he is called Lord Shaxx. Zavala likely was, but was excommunicated for disobedience after Twilight Gap.

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          • Shaxx hunted an Ahamkara dude is a badass I wish we got to see him thrashing cabal when the red legion attacked.

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          • Lance Riddick’s cheaper and Cayde-7’s possible voice actor will be ever cheaper.

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          • Doesn’t matter when Cayde-7 shows up in the next overpriced DLC for sheep to buy. Cayde was cheesy and cringy AF

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            • Well... Whether we liked it or not,

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            • Nathan fillian asked for to much money to return just like peter dinklage

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              • Edited by FluffyMonkeyyy: 6/14/2018 4:32:27 AM
                Yeah I actually wanted Zavala to die at the end of the main campaign. Then maybe Ikora and Cayde would get cut as the dlc’s progressed. Also if they kept that cutscene of Zavala becoming the vanguard leader and built off that his death would’ve been meaningful.

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              • A tragic death would make destiny so much better

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              • I’m not happy he’s dead but they did say it was changing to a darker tone and what better way to show that than killing the lighthearted character

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                • TLDR, I think they killed Cayde because he is a character people care about. I’ve never seen so many people wanna but this DLC now.

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                • Love the idea

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                • They killed the only down to earth character. The one that gave us humanity. Without cayde, no one will crack silly jokes at terrible times to break the tension. It brings a much darker tone to the game. Hopefully they pull it off and truly bring some dark story telling to this franchise. I'm sick of all of this flowery Victorious bull when there are still very deadly enemies out there that could easily put us back to the dark ages again.

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